Login with Facebook
Echo Rock - West Face
Routes Sorted
L to R R to L Alpha
Battle of the Bulge T 
Cherrie Pie T 
Cherry Bomb T 
Cole-Evans T 
Double Dip T 
Eff Four T 
Falcon and The Snowman, The T 
Fall from Grace T 
Forbidden Paradise T 
Gone in 60 Seconds T 
Heart and Sole T 
Highway 62 T 
Legolas T 
Love and Rockets T 
Minute Man T 
Quick Draw McGraw T 
Respect The Pouch S 
Stichter Quits T 
Stick to What T 
Team Slug (aka Cliff Pounder) T 
Ten Conversations at Once T 
Too Bold to Bolt T 
Tooth Beaver T 
Trough, The T 
Try Again T 

Stichter Quits 

YDS: 5.7 French: 5a Ewbanks: 15 UIAA: V+ ZA: 13 British: MVS 4b

Type:  Trad, 1 pitch, 115'
Consensus:  YDS: 5.7 French: 5a Ewbanks: 15 UIAA: V+ ZA: 13 British: MVS 4b [details]
FA: John Long and others, November 1972
Page Views: 7,713
Submitted By: Orphaned on Jun 24, 2002

You & This Route  |  Other Opinions (211)
Your todo list:
Your stars:
Your rating: -none- [change]
Your ticklist: [add new tick]
Your opinion of this PAGE:    [1 person likes this page.]
Rob Leicht half-way up


The original name for the route was "Black Tide", but apparently there was some controversy surrounding the "completion" of the first ascent and Long's party (and name) won out. Whenever I go back to climb this route, it seems like the initial face section feels thinner and thinner. Take care when climbing up to the first bolt. After that, it's fun edge and friction climbing up the dike feature along the righthand margin of the big unbroken Echo Rock face. Belay from a pair of bolts, then walk off or rappel off bolts atop Forbidden Paradise.


Protection is provided by 4 bolts (3/8"), but this is not a sport route. Bolted anchor (3/8").

Photos of Stichter Quits Slideshow Add Photo
Echo Rock - West Face Left
BETA PHOTO: Echo Rock - West Face Left
One his way to 2nd bolt.
One his way to 2nd bolt.
Charlie Hoffman on the lower section. This was a great climb.
Charlie Hoffman on the lower section. This was a g...
easy going
easy going
Climber from San Francisco near the top
Climber from San Francisco near the top
Polished as glass, the crux is.
Polished as glass, the crux is.
Slabbing up Stichter Quits
Slabbing up Stichter Quits
joshua trees!
joshua trees!
above the crux... <br />I was a little bummed that the last bolt was so far left of that horn in the photo.  You can clip that last bolt with a long sling, and step back down and traverse over to it.  That way you won't miss out on the coolest hold on the route...
above the crux... I was a little bummed that the l...
Jenny heading up the route.  It was way too hot to be climbing let alone wearing jeans...
Jenny heading up the route. It was way too hot to...
The Stichter Quits/Black Tide Dike is highlited in early morning Sun.
BETA PHOTO: The Stichter Quits/Black Tide Dike is highlited in...
This is the rappel station for "Stichter Quits".  We wanted to get of that rock ASAP as the heat was getting unbearable... Let's find some shade!!!
This is the rappel station for "Stichter Quit...
Elaine still has a ways to go to the second bolt.
Elaine still has a ways to go to the second bolt.
Lori shows off her hands free rappel (back up prussik) after climbing "Stichter Quits".
Lori shows off her hands free rappel (back up prus...
"Stichter Quits", we still call it "Black Tide". <br />Photo by Blitzo.
"Stichter Quits", we still call it "...
Christa Cline at the crux by the first bolt.
Christa Cline at the crux by the first bolt.
Yet another butt shot of Black Tide
Yet another butt shot of Black Tide
Anna wanted to free solo the route but i finally convinced her to rope up...
Anna wanted to free solo the route but i finally c...
The super inviting dyke in the morning light.
The super inviting dyke in the morning light.
Brandon Lampley on "Black Tide" (Stichter Quits) <br />Photo by Blitzo.
Brandon Lampley on "Black Tide" (Stichte...
George leading Stichter Quits (AKA Black Tide): "Hey, where the hell do I go from here?"
George leading Stichter Quits (AKA Black Tide): &q...
We counted four bolts unless we are off route here.
We counted four bolts unless we are off route here...
Moving past the crux
Moving past the crux
Shiloh on Black Tide
Shiloh on Black Tide

Show All 27 Photos

Only the first 24 are shown above.

Comments on Stichter Quits Add Comment
Show which comments
Comments displayed oldest to newestSkip Ahead to the Most Recent Dated Mar 26, 2014
By C Miller
Jul 9, 2002

It's original name was indeed Black Tide, a much more elegant name for the climb that it is.
By Flying T
Nov 4, 2002

Wonderful slab climb with four very well-placed bolts. The walk-off is a bit long. I prefer a single-rope rap from the top of Stick To What to climber's right, across the slab and down a little.
By Steve Powell
From: Alhambra, California
Apr 2, 2003

This is one of the best 5.7's around. First lead it in 1984. I agree that the crux seems more greasy now than it did in the past. the runout sections are not that bad.
By Randy
Jul 17, 2003

While "Black Tide" may be more elegant name, the original name (by the FA party) was Stichter Quits. Black Tide was a "working" name for the route by the climbers who placed the protection bolts on it. Perhaps Largo and company's snagging the route from Ken Stichter and John Wolfe was in bad form, but it was still the first ascent.

It is really no different that someone redpointing a project someone else is working on. And what would be the reference for all the other "Quits" routes (Martin Quits, Sphincter Quits, etc)?
By Steven Powers
Aug 2, 2003

The best descent is indeed a single rappel off of Stick to What, and a single 60m will reach as I've done it numerous times.
By Woody Stark
Oct 30, 2003

I've climb this route numerous times over the years; and, I believe, it should now be rated 5.8.
By Randy
Oct 30, 2003

This route has definitely gotten harder over the years. So many people have paddled up (and floundered upon) the crux that the rock has become quite polished. 5.8 may be fair. The new guide rates it 5.7/8.
By BinkyBoy
Nov 7, 2003
rating: 5.7+ 5a 15 V+ 13 MVS 4b

Very nice route. I definately disagree with the previous comments. From what I've seen of Joshua Tree tradition, this climb is definately a 5.6-5.7, given that the low moves and moves off the bolts are well protected.

Also, getting to the second bolt is definately a job for someone tall. I was a little surprised by the height off the flake.
By David Evans
Dec 1, 2003
rating: 5.9 5c 17 VI 17 HVS 5a

Yes, this route is borderline 5.9 now, passing the first bolt is the crux. Let's call it 5.6+.
By Bo Johnston
Feb 10, 2005
rating: 5.8 5b 16 VI- 15 HVS 4c

I too believe this route is harder than 5.7. I always feel bad when I get a beginner climber on it, telling them it is 5.7 and they get spanked. I don't think I'd call it 5.9 yet but it's heading in that direction with how polished it's getting on the start. The dike move midway up the climb is a bit sporty too!
By Trevor Roberson
From: Oxnard, California
Mar 23, 2005
rating: 5.7 5a 15 V+ 13 MVS 4b

Just climbed it last weekend. Great climb but if your used to "sport climbs" it is a little bit runout. We rapped off of the anchors with a 60 meter but the rope comes just about 6-8ft shy of the bottom. We rapped down to the beginning of the dike where there are big footholds and down climbed the last few feet (fairly easy). The walkoff is very straight forward, continue up the dike to easy ground and head left towards double dip, follow the east side slab down and to the right. Follow a large flake which turns into a crack (don't follow the crack all the way, it disappears over a ledge!) and head right towards the bottom) I feel this is a 5.7 face climb but the runout may make it feel 5.8 for some people!
By Bill Olszewski
From: Colorado Springs, CO
Mar 10, 2007
rating: 5.7 5a 15 V+ 13 MVS 4b

Maybe not a good climb for anyone leading max 5.7, but standard JT traditional slab. Is there really such a thing as a 5.7 crux? The "crux," while perhaps a bit greasy, is well protected. Hey, it's a sunshine climb, don't climb it when it's too hot. ;-) Lot's of fun but no worse than 5.7- by Josh standards IMO. In case anyone who hasn't yet climbed this route is confused by the descent beta, the rap anchor everyone is talking about is NOT the anchor for Black Tide. That would require two 60's. Anyway, I prefer to stick with the north walk-off.
By Guy H.
From: Fort Collins CO
Mar 28, 2007

It is possible to rap this line with a single 70M rope. The ends barely touch the ground.
By Gary Schenk
Mar 3, 2008

We did it on a Saturday when nobody was at Echo Rock. A really fun route. It might be a bit runout, but the bolts are well placed to protect the crux moves.
By Brian Hench
From: Costa Mesa, CA
May 12, 2008
rating: 5.8- 5b 16 VI- 14 VS 4c PG13

I did this route for the first time and loved it. The walk off is dead easy and it took fewer than five minutes. It's faster than rappelling.

It's true that the bolts protect all the hardest moves.
By JoshuaTreeRunner
From: Los Angeles
Oct 13, 2008

i climbed it few times, and the last time i noticed that the 4th bolt was chopped. but that chopped bolt is on the easy terrain after the first 3 bolts so maybe someone thought it wasnt needed. i think it should have stayed since it means youre doing a 50ft runnout at the top.
By Dave Daly
From: Del Mar, CA
Dec 8, 2008
rating: 5.8 5b 16 VI- 15 HVS 4c

Gotta agree with a few folks here, did this route 15 years ago and then again this past weekend. The route is definitely slicked up (mainly at bolts #1 and #3). Feels more like 5.8 these days.
By Cory
From: Boise, ID
Feb 22, 2010
rating: 5.7+ 5a 15 V+ 13 MVS 4b PG13

What a fun climb! For a 5.7, the moves were very interesting! I didn't find the route greasy at all, although we did climb it on a cold day.

Although the bolts are well placed to protect the cruxes, I wouldn't send a beginning leader up this as they are fairly spaced.

We rapped the route with our 60 meter. The ends didn't quite touch down, but there were large holds making the 8 feet of downclimbing very easy.
By Rodger Raubach
Sep 8, 2010
rating: 5.7 5a 15 V+ 13 MVS 4b PG13

"Black Tide" IS a great name for this great route. One of my all-time favorites ANYWHERE! To me it will always be "Black Tide" which is exquisitely descriptive. I need to climb it again and see if it has gotten harder since 1986!
By Will S
From: Joshua Tree
Nov 7, 2010
rating: 5.8 5b 16 VI- 15 HVS 4c PG13

It can be hard to see the belay from the last bolt if you don't know where it is beforehand. Did it in 90+ degree heat, and after the crux did NOT want to get back on that black varnish that's slick as snot...didn't see the belay, and went up and left all the way to the next anchor to the left that I could see. The climbing is really easy going that way, but the runout is ridiculous (so don't get offroute like me). Thought my second was going to murder me when she unclipped the last bolt and looked at the 50' penji she would take if she came off.
By Brian in SLC
Dec 16, 2010

Interesting info from the 'taco:

"Well, while we're all coming clean, I was probably the perpetrator of the most shameless route thievery imaginable.
Ken Stickter and about ten other guys were working all day on what later turned out to be the classic route, "Black Tide," 5.8 (or whatever it is). The boys worked all day on the thing and got all the bolts in but bailed owing to darkness. I can't remember how it came down but we sneaked in there and dashed up the thing before they returned and we had the gall to call it "Stickter Quits." Of course we didn't bother to put in any belay bolts or any of that so when the "fist ascent" party came back and finished the thing they saw the chalk marks and had to wonder but credit went to them anyway and that's fine by me.
By kennoyce
From: Layton, UT
Jan 15, 2011
rating: 5.6 4c 14 V 12 S 4b

I just did the route today and had a few things to comment on, first of all, I thought it felt easy for a 5.7, I would probably rate it 5.6, so I don't know why everyone is saying it should be 5.8. Secondly, there is a comment that says that a 60m rope will get you within 8 feet of the ground, this certainly isn't the case. A sixty meter rope ends up in between the first and second bolt and above the crux of the route, so be sure to bring 2 ropes if you plan on rapping off the route, or just rap from the anchors 40 feet to the right.
By Mike Fogarty
From: La Quinta, CA
Mar 6, 2012

This climb will always be black tide to me.
By Jim21
Mar 31, 2012
rating: 5.7 5a 15 V+ 13 MVS 4b R

One of my first outdoor leads! I'm definitely glad I TRed it first just to give me the confidence on the run-out sections. Overall, it's an easy and fun climb once you get past the mental part of having little protection. The scrambling to the walkoff is not too bad either.
By Rob M
From: Fullerton, ca
Apr 10, 2012

The new JT guide by Miramontes has it listed as 100 feet. I thought that didn't look right, and it's not. I'd have to look at the guide again to see if there was other beta, because I only glanced at it after borrowing it from a nearby party.

That said, I got 15 feet above the last piece and yelled down to ask if I had passed the halfway mark and find that it had. I looked up and the anchors were nowhere in sight.

Down-climbed and bailed. Use a 70 or bring two ropes.

Stopped by Coyote Corner on way out and looked at Falcon's short guide; had it listed at 113'.

The party who was next to us that I borrowed the guide from also had the same issue on the neighboring route.
Apr 11, 2012

My appologies, I will make a note of it for the next one. I recall though, that is was pretty easy to walk down that last 10ft of ramp.
By Rob M
From: Fullerton, ca
May 1, 2012

No worries RTM. Partly on me. I could have topped and walked off-just wasn't familiar enough with it. Classic Josh-got in my head a bit.
By Canon
Nov 17, 2012
rating: 5.7 5a 15 V+ 13 MVS 4b

The runout at the top is on EASY terrain. Simul-rapping on a newish 60m rope got us below the first bolt on easy slab. I really don't know how this route is so highly regarded. There are much better Josh slab climbs out there.
By Mike Holley
From: Boone, NC
Dec 11, 2012

Fun, casual Route! Slick Slab down low leads to very, very easy run out up high! I suppose it is so popular due to historical Reasons! Fun nonetheless!
By RNclimber
From: Riverside, Ca
Feb 23, 2013
rating: 5.7 5a 15 V+ 13 MVS 4b

70 meter raps ok. Rope tip ends about 3-4 feet above the ground
By Rodger Raubach
Apr 21, 2013
rating: 5.7 5a 15 V+ 13 MVS 4b PG13

To keep everybody (myself included) happy, why don't we simply call the route "Stichter Quit Before He Got the Anchor in Place?"

I'd more seriously suggest the substructure be called the "Black Tide Dike," and keep the present name as a route thereon.
By Ryan Watts
From: Bishop, CA
Feb 19, 2014
rating: 5.8 5b 16 VI- 15 HVS 4c

Cool looking line and worth doing if you're in the area but the climbing isn't necessarily "classic" IMO.

Also not nearly as slick as I was lead to believe. I climbed it today in full sun and thought there was a small section of 5.8 between bolts 1 and 2. The rest is significantly easier. Don't pitch from the top though...
By Cron
From: Barrington, NH
Mar 26, 2014

Felt a bit runout from the last bolt to the anchor. Fun exposure on that spine.