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Backing up your Figure 8 Follow Through tie-in


Original Post
Northeast Alpine Start · · Conway, New Hampshire · Joined Nov 2012 · Points: 122

Was hoping to create a poll but I don't see that option on the MP forums?

Do you think a “backup” knot above a property tied Figure 8 Follow Through is necessary when this knot is used for your tie-in?

Big B · · Sin City, NV · Joined Mar 2015 · Points: 1

No knot necessary

nice effort on the troll

Adrienne DiRosario · · Troy, NY · Joined Jan 2016 · Points: 0

Nope

· · Unknown Hometown · Joined unknown · Points: 0

Ropes aren't necessary unless you fall so clearly a backup knot isn't necessary.

Chalk in the Wind · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Aug 2014 · Points: 3

Not necessary.

John Wilder · · Las Vegas, NV · Joined Feb 2004 · Points: 1,535
Northeast Alpine Start wrote: Was hoping to create a poll but I don't see that option on the MP forums?

Do you think a “backup” knot above a property tied Figure 8 Follow Through is necessary when this knot is used for your tie-in?

Why would you need a poll? It's well known they're not needed and are only taught as a mechanism to make sure beginners pull enough rope to safely tie their 8.

Nick B · · Anchorage, AK · Joined Jan 2016 · Points: 61

Never.  Full strength knot.  

Gregger Man · · Broomfield, CO · Joined Aug 2004 · Points: 1,320
Dakota R · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Mar 2016 · Points: 0

Agreed it's unnecesary, I'm curious why so many climbing gyms make it a point to require one...  
I've always heard the blame put onto the insurances that cover them. Is anyone able to shed light on this subject from a climbing gyms perspective?

Benjamin Chapman · · Small Town, USA · Joined Jan 2007 · Points: 13,357

No backup knot necessary.
Watch any of the AMGA instructional videos to see that the AMGA doesn't promote the use of a backup knot with the Trace 8 or Figure 8 Follow Through.

Steve Marshall · · Concord NH · Joined Jul 2014 · Points: 40
Dakota R wrote: Agreed it's unnecesary, I'm curious why so many climbing gyms make it a point to require one...  
I've always heard the blame put onto the insurances that cover them. Is anyone able to shed light on this subject from a climbing gyms perspective?

makes it easier for gym staff to spot and inspect an improperly tied knot from farther away


ensures beginners have pulled enough tail thru their fig.8 for it to be safe
John Wilder · · Las Vegas, NV · Joined Feb 2004 · Points: 1,535
Dakota R wrote: Agreed it's unnecesary, I'm curious why so many climbing gyms make it a point to require one...  
I've always heard the blame put onto the insurances that cover them. Is anyone able to shed light on this subject from a climbing gyms perspective?

Just makes sure there's more than 4" of tail and can be spotted from 50' away. 

Roy Suggett · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Jul 2009 · Points: 7,569

Yes!  It always make me (feel) better!

Nick B · · Anchorage, AK · Joined Jan 2016 · Points: 61
Gregger Man wrote:
Tie in with the Sooooper 8©

Thank God someone blurred that out.  No one thinks of the children these days ....
FosterK · · Edmonton, AB · Joined Nov 2012 · Points: 43

Not required if you have a thumbs'up for safety (i.e. sufficient tail).

Finn The Human · · The Land of Ooo · Joined Jul 2008 · Points: 106

Not necessary for safety, but convenient to keep long tails out of the way.

Adam J. Clark · · Mill Creek, WA · Joined Sep 2011 · Points: 110

Not needed. Most gyms, most people know this now.

wisam · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Jan 2012 · Points: 60

Not needed but having enough to tie a backup is a sigh you have more than enough tail. 

Austin Donisan · · San Mateo, CA · Joined May 2014 · Points: 46

The IFSC also requires a figure 8 + "stopper knot" for competitions, which seems a bit strange.

Brian in SLC · · Sandy, Utah · Joined Oct 2003 · Points: 14,759

Nope.  I tuck the tail down through the knot too.  No accidentally clipping a long tail!

Northeast Alpine Start · · Conway, New Hampshire · Joined Nov 2012 · Points: 122
Brian in SLC wrote: Nope.  I tuck the tail down through the knot too.  No accidentally clipping a long tail!

Seems many tuck the tail improperly though... to maintain full strength you must wrap around the rope and tuck into the lower half of the knot. Despite MP readers seeming to be in the know I'm surprised at how many outdoor climbers still back their knots up... probably been spending to much time at Rumney this summer ;)

Anyways blogged about it here and included video of the correct way to tie the "Yosemite Finish"

https://northeastalpinestart.com/2018/08/09/do-you-need-to-back-up-your-tie-in-knot/
Guideline #1: Don't be a jerk.

General Climbing
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