New and experienced climbers over 50 #38

Alan Rubinwrote:

BITD, there were far fewer places where people climbed---and far fewer people climbing,  so much easier to meet up with folks of similar experience level and stoke, as well as more opportunities to meet and get to know older ( though not always older!!!) mentors. From my understanding ( others on here with direct experience can correct me), for folks in the LA area it was Stoney Point, then Hidden Valley CG itself, which drew folks from a wider area. Eventually, many migrated up to Camp 4---a larger group ( though then not so large) and from all-over. Similar areas existed across the country. 

^^^
This!

I started climbing in 72 in SoCal and for those of us further east of LA in the Inland Empire, (Riverside, San Bernardino, etc.) our local meet up and training area was Mount Rubidoux and Big Rock at Lake Perris. For those further south in San Diego County, it was the Mt Woodson area. 

Then seasonally, climbers from those areas would migrate to Hidden Valley CG when Joshua Tree was still a National Monument and you could easily find free camping there on a weekend, or Humber Park in Idyllwild for Tahquitz/Suicide Rocks.

I was fortunate to have a great mentor in Jim "Rubidoux" Wilson, who I was introduced to thru my father that was a PE teacher at the HS we both attended, Dad knew Jim was a climber, so he hooked us up. Jim is a year older than I and BITD climbed with the likes of Long, Sorenson, Accomazzo, Robs Muir, Bachar, and other early "Stonemasters". So, after reading Mountaineering; Freedom of the Hills, Robbins Basic Rockcraft, and Jim's yearlong tutelage, I had learned the ropes so to speak and got my lead head together. Paid it forward myself by mentoring other friends over the following years, one of which still at it. 

About a decade back, my son-in-law who had started doing some gym climbing asked me if I would take him trad climbing as my daughter had told him that I had been pretty good BITD and still had the gear to do it. So, I took him to a NorCal crag that I had pioneered BITD and lead him up a couple of routes that I could still lead all these years later. We had a great time.

dragonswrote:

So I'm not very good socially (putting it mildly). I find it hard to understand how you all found such a large circle of friends that you could find a partner as needed. Instruction manual, please.

There is always the time tested method of sharing some goodies. Have the best goodies and your friend circle gets larger.

It seems to me if you just regularly show up at areas where the sorts of climbers you want to meet hang out and you are reasonably pleasant to be around and seem attentive and safe, you will end up chatting and start inviting each other into the belay rotation, get numbers and invite each other to crags. It is harder if into exploring and new routing at areas that are not yet popular (the context in which I do most of my TR soloing), but if you put up good routes people will eventually come along (sometimes too many!)  and they will want to talk to you and try out your routes.

Lori Milaswrote:

I really feel your pain, dragons.  This is a real problem, and I have never found a solution.  Our local climbing forums are filled with posts of people looking for partners. That may be why I was so interested in the history of climbing here because it sounded like an extended group of friends of similar capabilities met here every weekend and paired off to go climb. When I look at the FA’s here in the 70s, it’s the same group of climbers who obviously knew each other.  I assume it was that way in camp 4, and probably in the Gunks.  That no longer exists today.

When I showed up here at intersection rock, which is where climbers commonly meet, it was instantly obvious that young mostly male climbers were not going to want to pair up with me.  

I have had scrappy looking climbers approach me saying “hey we should climb together “… but nooo, we should not climb together!   Safety seems to be a relative term here and there are so many accidents and injuries. I do wonder whether if I were climbing in another place it would be this fraught with danger – – maybe sport climbing areas would go easier.(?)

For a while I climbed in Northern California with various meet up groups, REI had some climbing outings, another Sierra group had scheduled climbing days and I did them all. I don’t know why I didn’t love them. For one as a newbie, I might be in a group of really advanced climbers and just feel like I was holding them up.  Also, they were all really young.

I don’t know if there’s a solution.  My solution is not an option for most people.  I just had to weigh my age, diabetes, capabilities, or lack there of, and make some decisions.  I had just sold my house up in Rocklin and set aside a little piece of that to afford some ongoing climbing.  I thought a lot about the natural mentorship that seemed to happen among Yosemite climbers and probably here in Joshua Tree too where an older more experienced climber would take someone under his wing and teach him the ropes (literally).  I really wanted something like that as part of my own experience. I got really lucky. I hope you find some good partners and potential new friends. 

When I was younger (in my 60's) I had great success finding partners when I was at Red Rock through MP's partner finder.  Climbed with people from all over the world who were visiting LV.

Birdland was by far what people wanted to climb, along with other multi-pitches.  Now, 20 years later, not so easy to find someone who is willing to climb with the old man.

Daniel Shivelywrote:

 I can’t rationally understand what forces occur during top roping that create a situation that requires redundancy when a single device is sufficient in belaying or rapping. 

For me the redundancy comes with the human using the device. Im not just relying on said device when I'm with a partner, I'm also relying on the human. Whom I hope likes me... and when rapping, I will have a prussik, or autoblock, just in case... for redundancy. 

M Spraguewrote:

There is always the time tested method of sharing some goodies. Have the best goodies and your friend circle gets larger.

M Sprague….. this has always been the way!

Dragons…. One of the things I really love about climbing is the social acceptance. As long as you’re not a mother raper/father raper, liar, gear thief-  the climbing community will usually accept you “as is”.
I have been climbing at “Gunks” three times. Every time without a partner. To me it’s the easiest place to grab someone. I have just walked down the carriage road and looked at the situations I see. The first was two dejected youths sitting on the ground with the rope going 1/2 way up then back down…. I watched the one dude lower the other down so I knew there was belaying skills. “Hi, my name is Guy. I’m traveling alone- could I try to lead this?” ….
I continued my travel and just a bit faster on I see this scene. A old familiar tale. Dude is up at top of P1 - yelling encouragement to nice looking young lady, standing on the ground. She is crying and mumbling something about “the asshole”…. I ask her if she has ever climbed before. “No” she said. The belayer can’t see us so I tell her to untie and I tie in. I tell her to yell “OK, I’m trying again….” So I start climbing and nail the 5.8 crux (thinking that the Dude is really lame now) When I pop my head around the corner the Dude is actually surprised it’s not his GF. So I introduce myself and let him know we need to get down cause GF is packing her things and heading back to the parking lot….. ah the Gunks. I’m thinking I need to return because I now seek “easy” climbing…… that means no awful sized cracks, squeeze chimneys or mammoth sized approaches. Perfect.

Stoney Point….. many of my lifelong friends have moved to “climbing towns” and promptly quit climbing! Weird as that seems one of the common reasons given is “there is no climbing scene here” “no Stony Point” 

Now on to one of my favorite topics: Top Rope Soloing 

The first thought that comes into my head is this.

What, are you so creepy that you can’t figure out how to have a partner????
(Partially joking, but really, nobody wants to climb with you?) OR BEFORE I REALLY GET FLAMED I DO KNOW THAT FOLKS HAVE JOBS, TIME CONSTRAINTS Etc….. The reason I have this attitude because of this: at 95% of the places I climb at: California south of Yosemite.
If someone is shuffling around up in the trees trying to find the best spot to anchor, a shower of small and large rocks happens along with dirt, tree limbs and branches. This happened most recently at San Ysidro (a small, yet historic, crag in Oprah’s backyard). A bunch of us were climbing when a young fellow showed up. He needed to know the names of the routes and he needed to know how to “get to the top” …. Everyone offered him a Belay or a TR burn but he declined saying “I’m Top Rope Soloing today”. About 30 minutes later the rocks, sticks and dirt started falling down on every one at the base. The intrepid TRS person had figured out how to go diagonally across the top causing the maximum amount falling scree.

@TAD….. The fishing was slow. I wonder about two things and haven’t ever received a good answer to. #1 If a weather front is coming in- do the fish know? and stop feeding?
#2 Does a full moon have anything to do with the fish not biting during daylight?

So in the end I did go climbing when it was 106….on Sunday. Out of bed at 5am… at the rocks at 7a - climb- finish at noon… followed by mass consumption of Ice Cold IPA’s followed by a 14 hour nap.

Happy climbing 

Idaho Bobwrote:

When I was younger (in my 60's) I had great success finding partners when I was at Red Rock through MP's partner finder.  Climbed with people from all over the world who were visiting LV.

Birdland was by far what people wanted to climb, along with other multi-pitches.  Now, 20 years later, not so easy to find someone who is willing to climb with the old man.

I would totally climb with you as would many others. Do you have any idea how cool it sounds to say “Yeah, this 80 year old sent this climb!”

I have tried climbing with younger folks but it just doesn’t have the same feel.  My three main climbing partners- my wife, my brother, and my friend Steve, have been climbing with me for 35 years or more.  After all that time there is a trust  and a knowing what the other person needs without words.  If I don’t have a partner and want to go outside I boulder. 

Guy, never climbed before and expected to do a 5.8, with partner out of sight no less! I hope she made it back to the parking lot ahead of him, drove off, and LEFT HIM THERE! 

I heard someone today talking about taking their kids to a family night at the local gym. Both parents were just "too old" to climb with their kids. Both of them no more than 40... I gotta say that kind of parenting is setting up those kids for nothing positive later in life! I  also have a friend who thinks a 100 mile backpacking trip is just way too much and he could never do it at age 50, no job, plenty of time to travel. 

God bless America!

I climb for all sorts of reasons… flow, concentration, camaraderie, amazing settings.  Just like with aid climbing I find it difficult to get these things from TRS.  So, I find partners. Most of the time it has not been too hard.  I have moved several times in my life and getting to the point where you have a crew can take a little time. Early on in the (70’s, I was part of the Stoney Point crew and had tons of people to climb with, most of whom  I call good friends today.   College time was a breeze. Moving to Portland wasn’t too bad they had one of the first rock gyms in the county and that kept me sane.  My latest move to rural Colorado was a bit more difficult.  Now older and no local gym, so I did a little TRS, but didn’t find it satisfying. Ended up driving 40 min to a gym in Boulder, which in the middle of the day, mid week has quite a collection of senior crushers.  Didn’t take long to find good friends and good partners.  Now I climb outside around 3 days a week.  I don’t care about difficulty or sends, just good friends and excellent locations. 

Let's flip that around, Guy, just for fun...

What...are the voices in your head so loud that you can't stand hearing them when you are alone, and require groups of people around you to drown them out?

Kinda works both ways, don't it?

fossil,

Thanks for the further details on runout training!

More on mindset…

Lori says…

” When I showed up here at intersection rock, which is where climbers commonly meet, it was instantly obvious that young mostly male climbers were not going to want to pair up with me.”

That is her rational side telling her she is not worthy.

I'm sure Lori can speak for herself. But I wouldn't conclude that. Is it not possible that she simply presented herself as wanting to climb, and there were no takers from the youngsters? They might have looked at her and thought "she won't be capable of following me up my 5.12 proj" or "she looks like an old granny, she won't be able to keep up with me, plus she's not a 20 year old hottie" and so on. And it's not unusual for people to want to hang out with others in their own age group. That's what Lori asserted for herself, in fact. For myself, I also tend to prefer climbing with oldsters, although I'll certainly climb with youngsters who are careful and thoughtful.

She then adds…

“I have had scrappy looking climbers approach me saying “hey we should climb together “… but nooo, we should not climb together!   Safety seems to be a relative term here and there are so many accidents and injuries. I do wonder whether if I were climbing in another place it would be this fraught with danger – – maybe sport climbing areas would go easier.(?)”

Again, rational side judging by appearance rather than a true assessment of talent.

Yeah, she's old and she doesn't want to get injured because that could mean missing out on a large fraction of the rest of her climbing years. Same here! She also realizes (probably correctly) that those young guys don't understand how easy it is to get injured at our age, and further they probably have no concept of risk management for a person with diabetes. She is wisely protecting herself, and living to climb again another day.

Guy, fun stories, thanks for sharing those! I have rarely run across anyone needing help here though. The people I've met seem fairly competent and locked in with their partners. Almost everyone is from somewhere else. I did try the partner finder a few times and it never worked out (flakes). Probably I'm not persistent enough. I've also come to distrust the Internet as a partner source. Things are getting weirder out there.

Idaho Bob, I'd climb with you if we ever meet up!

M Sprague, not sure about the goodies, first you have to find someone to climb with, then offer goodies I suppose. I haven't really gotten to the finding part yet. But hopefully it will come with time. I do think I'm pleasant enough, but who knows. And ya know, I am kinda picky about who I will climb with, in fact. Not just anyone and everyone. That's probably part of my problem. I had some bad partners when I started out, and decided TRS was safer and more pleasant than just going out with any old rando.

There is less than zero chance that I'd ever use MP's partner finder (or anything similar), or take a ride on some rando's rig I encountered at a crag somewhere. If I want to climb, I'll patiently find a way to coordinate with one of my select partners, do some TRSing, or find another way to have a good adventure. Climbing in big social scene is the exact opposite of the experience I seek while climbing, and I'll go to great lengths to avoid encountering such groups.

Li Huwrote:

I would totally climb with you as would many others. Do you have any idea how cool it sounds to say “Yeah, this 80 year old sent this climb!”

 

Gary and I were walking out of Virgin Canyon (EPC) a couple of year ago.  There was a young honeymoons couple at the base of Cat Daddy looking despondent.  The guy had bailed at the crux, leaving a brand new locker that had been a wedding present.  Gary told them not to worry, we'll send the old guy up to get it.  So I did, then went to the top and rapped.  The young lady was impressed, her new husband not so much.  Told him I had a problem with the crux on my first attempt and that he'd send it the next time.

apogeewrote:

Let's flip that around, Guy, just for fun...

What...are the voices in your head so loud that you can't stand hearing them when you are alone, and require groups of people around you to drown them out?

Kinda works both ways, don't it?

I'll kind of answer for Guy cause like him (he is one of my regular adventure partners) I like climbing with people.  At the same time, we are both happy as little clams to go fishing all day by ourselves.  Guy and I will fish together but he will go downstream and I'll go upstream.  We meet for beers at the truck at the end of the day.  There is no scary inner dialog.  Hell, we are in our 70s, we got over that stupid shit decades ago.

I think being from LA and having Stoney Point really is special.  There are at least 10 people I could call up any day who I have known for 50 years of so who are still cranking and still willing to go climbing.  Many are now retired and even more available.  But realize that many of us have spent every Tuesday and Thursday for 50 years climbing the same damn boulders together.  And taking vacations together.  And having scary adventures together.

At the same time, I spent all of my 50s and early 60s climbing really hard and my partner was 25 years younger than me.  I never felt like we didn't have things in common.  I never heard any complaints from him about me being an old fart either.  So maybe if you don't like climbing with younger people, you have become an old fart yourself.

Idaho Bobwrote:

Gary and I were walking out of Virgin Canyon (EPC) a couple of year ago.  There was a young honeymoons couple at the base of Cat Daddy looking despondent.  The guy had bailed at the crux, leaving a brand new locker that had been a wedding present.  Gary told them not to worry, we'll send the old guy up to get it.  So I did, then went to the top and rapped.  The young lady was impressed, her new husband not so much.  Told him I had a problem with the crux on my first attempt and that he'd send it the next time.

I totally live for this! As long as I’m there with an old dude claiming that they’re going to struggle from old age then cruise up with flair and style to boot  

There was an older 76 year old with his worn out Planet Granite lead card, and he cruised up 11s like they were nothing. Loved belaying him! 

Jan Mcwrote: 

I think being from LA and having Stoney Point really is special.  

Kamps & Rearick

Jan Mcwrote:

I'll kind of answer for Guy cause like him (he is one of my regular adventure partners) I like climbing with people.  At the same time, we are both happy as little clams to go fishing all day by ourselves.  Guy and I will fish together but he will go downstream and I'll go upstream.  We meet for beers at the truck at the end of the day.  There is no scary inner dialog.  Hell, we are in our 70s, we got over that stupid shit decades ago.

I think being from LA and having Stoney Point really is special.  There are at least 10 people I could call up any day who I have known for 50 years of so who are still cranking and still willing to go climbing.  Many are now retired and even more available.  But realize that many of us have spent every Tuesday and Thursday for 50 years climbing the same damn boulders together.  And taking vacations together.  And having scary adventures together.

At the same time, I spent all of my 50s and early 60s climbing really hard and my partner was 25 years younger than me.  I never felt like we didn't have things in common.  I never heard any complaints from him about me being an old fart either.  So maybe if you don't like climbing with younger people, you have become an old fart yourself.

You guys remind me of some of the CT traprock crew. Upper NE is a bit less social on that front, we have guys on TRS who would be happy to not say a word to anyone which I find strange but have gotten used to it. I have a couple main partners and a couple younger ones, I don't care about the age at all as long as my "smoke up the arse" sensor isn't going off, I'll happily boulder solo too. Totally agree on the becoming an old fart comment,  I feel like if the energy is good than the day is good. Of course I have a 15 year old to keep me in check...

who you do a climb with is usually more important than ticking the climb.

Nick Goldsmithwrote:

who you do a climb with is usually more important than ticking the climb.

Yup. Looking back at my memories of many years climbing routes big and small it’s my partners that I remember most.

Edit for Apogee: yes I remember a few of my bigger solos very fondly too!