Dogs that bite

J Ewrote:

Pupper bites hand because something you did made it anxious, or because the . otherwise we'll behaved dog has food aggression, or whatever other reason. The reason yall don't like muzzles is because you don't think their cute. And this is coming from someone who is pro crag dog

You alway ask if you can pet a dog and / or give them a treat before you approach it.  Sorry if I didn't  state that.

Bruno Schullwrote:

Dog says, no muzzle for me please

You don't have to do everything your dog tells you.

Chad Millerwrote:

You alway ask if you can pet a dog and / or give them a treat before you approach it.  Sorry if I didn't  state that.

How many dog bites are followed by the phrase "omg he's never done anything like that!!!"

J Ewrote:

How many dog bites are followed by the phrase "omg he's never done anything like that!!!"

These are the same people who fail to realize a dog wagging their tail is not always done out of joy, or that licks are not always done out of compassion. Nervous (often the precursor to an attack) behavior often mimics joyous behavior. 

". . . the great majority of reasonable dog owners."

Leaving aside the oxymoron; three, four at the most? 

Charlie Bwrote:

What says the mob?

I left my dog away from the crag, off trail in a good spot with my 12 year daughter, who likes to draw while my wife and I climb. My dog is a blue heeler (yes they have a propensity for being protective and nipping), and she is a sensitive rescue dog that "fell off the back of a truck in NM". She is sweet and loving but weary of people. She doesn't bark, and only sleeps at the crag. 

All of a sudden a younger dude, climber, ran down the hill stomping on the talus. He went off the main trail and towards my dog and daughter. My daughter flinched at the noise and my dog got scared and tried to nip him as he came within 3 feet of my daughter. My dog barely missed getting the back of his pants as he leapt out of the way and she was on a leash. 

What does the climber own in this conflict? 

I took my dog away from the trail. 

I leashed my dog, who was quiet all day. 

My daughter was with my dog. 

Who's at fault here?

You had the dog off trail and on leash. It was under control.  That's the bottom line. If a dog is unleashed AND it wanders around getting into other's stuff, fighting other dogs, barking incessantly, etc. it's not in control. THAT is the problem. Not that a dog happens to be at the crag. If a dude is so unaware that he stumbles off trail within 3 feet of a 12 year old girl and a dog that's on him. The fact that he did that and did NOT get bit because you had an appropriate length leash shows you did nothing wrong. I'd probably do the exact same thing. If I had a 12 year old daughter and I'm preoccupied with climbing and can't protect her I damn well would have a dog there leashed to protect her, and the being protective and nippy is a bonus. Now that dog should never be along the base of a crag where people are walking by and it could bite someone, but entirely different situation if it's off trail and someone needs to be clueless to end up within leash distance.

I've had and seen mixed results when trying to blend climbing with other priorities: dogs, child care, picnics, romance, partying etc.

What we do is dangerous. The base of a cliff is dangerous. "This is this."

Kenny Parkerwrote:

My hope is to bring awareness to people w dogs to not bring your dog if it isn't comfortable around people. Its selfish.  And if you don't want your dog at home while you climb....don't go climbing.  I realize that there are more effective ways to help stop this from happening....however I hope this reaches the dogs owner and others.  And BTW....it is not my responsibility to be an Alpha.  In this case I was getting my gear.  

They are aware.  They're always aware.  Awareness isn't the problem.  Entitlement is.  SUE.

J Ewrote:

How many dog bites are followed by the phrase "omg he's never done anything like that!!!"

I'm gonna throw a random number out there, it's 100%.

Jake Joneswrote:

They are aware.  They're always aware.  Awareness isn't the problem.  Entitlement is.  SUE.

I think the culture (particularly American) of immediately suing people if you don't approve of them is a form of entitlement.

Bruno Schullwrote:

I think the culture (particularly American) of immediately suing people if you don't approve of them is a form of entitlement.

Bruno, this is an unfair and knee jerk characterization of Americans.   It is simply not true.  More often than not, we turn first to gun play and bypass the legal system altogether.   Please don’t spread vicious rumors.  

@ Dr. Hypocritical...did you make a new account just to reply to this thread?

Actually, to be honest, I have no idea if the US is more or less litigous than other countries.  People in the US certianly seem more prone to sue but is that actually the case?  

I'm no legal expert, but I found some data rather quickly that does suggest the US is more litigous. 

"The U.S. has about a quarter more suits per capita than does the U.K., but 3.3 times as many
as Canada."

Source: http://www.law.harvard.edu/programs/olin_center/papers/pdf/Ramseyer_681.pdf

Anyway, I like Mark's take on this. 

"Shoot first, sue later."

Bruno Schullwrote:

"Shoot first, sue later."

Aren’t you pro dog though?

Not Not MP Adminwrote:

Aren’t you pro dog though?

Absolutely. 

I was simply trying to characterize the prevailing anti-dog sentiment.

https://www.politico.com/news/2023/10/05/commander-biden-no-longer-at-white-house-00120145

apogeewrote:

https://www.politico.com/news/2023/10/05/commander-biden-no-longer-at-white-house-00120145

Muzzles bro

Gloweringwrote:

  I'd probably do the exact same thing. If I had a 12 year old daughter and I'm preoccupied with climbing and can't protect her I damn well would have a dog there leashed to protect her, and the being protective and nippy is a bonus.  

You actually climb somewhere where you might fear for a family members well-being? This thread has devolved into a squabble. People bickering, for the sake of bickering.

This thread, like the other active dog thread, needs some pictures of crag dogs.  

Glen Priorwrote:

You actually climb somewhere where you might fear for a family members well-being? This thread has devolved into a squabble. People bickering, for the sake of bickering.

Do you have a point to make? Or just jumping into the squabble for the sake of bickering?

Glen Priorwrote:

You actually climb somewhere where you might fear for a family members well-being? This thread has devolved into a squabble. People bickering, for the sake of bickering.

Well, if you go read the Charlie Barrett thread you'll find that even Yosemite is not perfectly safe.