Backcountry.com not playing nice

Old lady H wrote: Ma Ja, points taken. But. The world isn't black and white. I do participate in corporate America, now and then. Yes, I have purchased from Amazon. Yes, I have shopped at giant box stores. Yes, I even have Prime.

However...

I have also shopped farmers markets for many years, for a hefty supply of my food, and helped found a regional seed company growing locally adapted seeds.

That is direct action in a really big picture. Our food supply. I've been doing this for twenty years now, and that is ever so slowly changing the food we all eat for the better. You're welcome.

Maybe you can do stuff on every front at once all the time.

I can't. I pick and choose, moment to moment, purchase by purchase...including buying used gear from my former Backcountry named store. Gear that may have come from....oh dear.

Re Backcountry ©®£¢π? The really idiotic part of this, is it didn't even "benefit" them in any way whatsoever. None of these places were "confusing" the BC name, and, far as I know, none went out of business over it, these "competitors" that threatened to put BC outta business. Righhht. Just..."backcountry". Sheesh. Backcountry©®€√∆ shot themselves in the foot with this, embarrassingly so.

Best, Helen

This is not specifically directed at you Helen, but you provide a great example of someone who is obviously a conscious citizen/spender, and still cant seem to get around the Amazon stranglehold. Convenience is the reason this world is falling apart. It's certainly not convenient to go to the farmer's market and support local farmers, but you set out to do so and made it happen. Finding alternative vendors for products, and waiting a week for it to arrive is not that difficult, you just have to make that decision.

You know that old saying made famous in It's a Wonderful Life, "Everytime someone presses the Purchase button on Amazon, an Angel is forced to piss in a bottle becasue their bathroom break privileges were taken away"? Well, God's name is Jeff, and he's bald, angry, wants to live forever, has a lazy eye, and loves the smell of freshly reopened bottles of piss...and obviously hates angels.

I'm not trying to skew the focus off Backcountry. Fck them too.

Martin le Roux wrote:

Not exactly. If you dig through USPTO filings it's apparent that Backcountry.com got what they wanted. In 2018 Backcountry Babes applied for a trademark covering outdoor education, guiding services and "Backcountry Babes"-branded t-shirts, jackets, hoodies, etc. Backcountry.com objected because they wanted trademark protection for "Backcountry"-branded clothing and outdoor goods. To date the USPTO has denied this, citing potential confusion with other trademarks that use the term "Backcountry". So Backcountry.com pressured Backcountry Babes into dropping all references to branded clothing in their trademark application. Backcountry Babes' trademark is now limited to outdoor education and guiding services, and it includes a disclaimer that they're not claiming an exclusive right to use the term "Backcountry" for other purposes.

Thanks, that clarifies things. That detail wasn't in an article I read.

Briggs Lazalde wrote: If only Ma Ja and Joe Trabucco had a baby. 

Steve G wrote:

He looks like a crusher to me.

For those who don't like Amazon, suggest you talk to those who manufacture product.  More than one has told me that Amazon is their largest customer and has helped their business grow.  So, perhaps there is another side to the Amazon story.  Now if your business is selling (as opposed to manufacturing), I certainly understand that Amazon is a tough competitor.  So if your just selling, go back to Marketing 101, determine what are your customers unmet needs and then provide that (often it is service, not only price).  And figure out how to get your costs down since there will always be a low price competitor even if Amazon disappears.

Ma Ja wrote: Take your Prime dildo that was delivered in 2 days, and go have fun with it.
Get it?

I was gonna eat some Prime Rib tonight but this sounds better

Ma Ja wrote:
This is not specifically directed at you Helen, but you provide a great example of someone who is obviously a conscious citizen/spender, and still  can't seem to get around the Amazon stranglehold. Convenience is the reason this world is falling apart. It's certainly not convenient to go to the farmer's market and support local farmers, but you set out to do so and made it happen. Finding alternative vendors for products, and waiting a week for it to arrive is not that difficult, you just have to make that decision.

You know that old saying made famous in It's a Wonderful Life, "Everytime someone presses the Purchase button on Amazon, an Angel is forced to piss in a bottle becasue their bathroom break privileges were taken away"? Well, God's name is Jeff, and he's bald, angry, wants to live forever, has a lazy eye, and loves the smell of freshly reopened bottles of piss...and obviously hates angels.

I'm not trying to skew the focus off Backcountry. Fck them too.

Bullshit. What you said, essentially, is I'm a great example, yet incapable of the judgement you just praised.

Just say it simply. We don't measure up to your standards.

For the record? I don't give a shit what your standards are, "you" being anyone, not just some rando on MP. I can, and do, make my own decisions. Even get my pants on okay most days all by myself.

And? We're climbers here, okay? My not buying an ice climbing book from Europe via Amazon (my last purchase), yes for convenience, won't change the world. By the way, same peeps sell the thing on or off Amazon. Yes, they might make more money if I bought directly, but would they get the exposure they get through Amazon???

But? Here's the thing. BC®™©¥¶ isn't selling the stuff for ​the little shop across the pond. They are an online retailer. ​So......???? What's the cost/benefit analysis for small businesses then?

All of this pales to my latest dilemma. Bad treatment of employees at a local place. Still working on that one.....

Best, Helen

Ma Ja wrote:
This is not specifically directed at you Helen, but you provide a great example of someone who is obviously a conscious citizen/spender, and still cant seem to get around the Amazon stranglehold. 

Mountain Project and all the REI websites live on Amazon Web Services. Better stop posting.

Idaho Bob wrote: For those who don't like Amazon, suggest you talk to those who manufacture product.  More than one has told me that Amazon is their largest customer and has helped their business grow.  So, perhaps there is another side to the Amazon story.

Amazon also contributes to charities. If you go to smile.amazon.com,* you can select a charity (from a huge list) and Amazon donates 0.5% of the purchase price. Sure, a pittance, but it does add up. From my account:

  Every little bit counts
  When millions of supporters shop at smile.amazon.com, charitable donations quickly add up.
You have generated $56.76 as of November 01, 2019.
Your current charity The Utah Avalanche Center has received $2,766.01 as of August 2019
All charities have received $144,958,582.84 as of August 2019

https://smile.amazon.com/gp/chpf/about/ref=smi_se_dshb_aas_saas

*: there are browser add-ons/plug-ins that will do this automagically for you when you go to amazon.com

Señor Arroz wrote:

Mountain Project and all the REI websites live on Amazon Web Services. Better stop posting.

If Ma Ja is concerned enough about Amazon so as to not use businesses that use AWS, well, there are over 1M, so.....

Besides Netflix, Unilever, Kellogg's, NASA, Pintrest, and Capital One there's also
Adobe, Airbnb, Alcatel-Lucent, AOL, Acquia, AdRoll, AEG, Alert Logic, Autodesk, Bitdefender, BMW, British Gas, Canon, Channel 4, Chef, Citrix, Coinbase, Comcast, Coursera, Docker, Dow Jones, European Space Agency, Financial Times, FINRA, General Electric, GoSquared, Guardian News & Media, Harvard Medical School, Hearst Corporation, Hitachi, HTC, IMDb, International Centre for Radio Astronomy Research, International Civil Aviation Organization, ITV, iZettle, Johnson & Johnson, JustGiving, JWT, Kaplan, Lamborghini, Lonely Planet, Lyft, Made.com, McDonalds, NASDAQ OMX, National Rail Enquiries, National Trust,   News International, News UK, Nokia, Nordstrom, Novartis, Pfizer, Philips, Quantas, Sage, Samsung, SAP, Schneider Electric, Scribd, Securitas Direct, Siemens, Slack, Sony, SoundCloud, Spotify, Square Enix, Tata Motors, The Weather Company, Ticketmaster, Time Inc., Trainline, Ubisoft, UCAS, US Department of State, USDA Food and Nutrition Service, UK Ministry of Justice, Vodafone Italy, WeTransfer, WIX, Xiaomi, Yelp, Zynga.

Señor Arroz wrote: 

Mountain Project and all the REI websites live on Amazon Web Services. Better stop posting.

Basically everything on the internet lives on an Amazon Web Services server. If it doesnt, it ends up there becasue the NSA likes to save things for later.

Amazon is the only large corporation normal people get emo about, and Apple. It's like telling someone they suck for wearing furs. It's hard to hear it when you're wearing it. The times have changed, and murdering animals for a coat isnt cool anymore. One day, treating people/employees like animals wont be either. You have to justify your use one way or another.  
I blame the mentality of beliving so little of yourself, you cant fathom having enough influence to affect change. We all stop spending money through Amazon tomorrow, and buy direct from manufacturers, the game is over, there's no more Amazon.

It just takes a shift in popularity. If Jeff Bezos was caught saying he wanted to kill everyone and live forever with robots, people wouldnt support his company any more, unless you're a Trump supporter, they seem unshakable. Now, if there is a threshold, then worker treatment, which has improved (with the wage increase), would be worth critical judgement, along with their corporate practices, which we are all obviously extremely concerned about these days (with BC and all), and their financial weaseling. Their record in all categories is horrific. And, personally, I dont belive Billionaires should exist, it's just not right. If no one was hungry, homeless, or uneducated, and there wasnt human trafficking, slavery, or unattended corporate externalities affecting the environment, then sure, go get your billion doooode! Until then, hoarding vast sums of money, for one individuals psychotic attempts to be immortal, needs to be put on hold so the Franklin's down the block can get dinner tonight.

It takes a lot of mental gymnastics to argue for Amazon, on a thread about corporate misconduct. Jesus Christ.

Looks like they heard us. They're firing the law firm and dropping the lawsuits.

https://gearjunkie.com/backcountry-fires-law-firm-drops-lawsuits-rebuilding-relationships

Has BackcountryGear.com been discussed?  I get emails from them every day.

Ian MacDonald wrote: Looks like they heard us. They're firing the law firm and dropping the lawsuits.

https://gearjunkie.com/backcountry-fires-law-firm-drops-lawsuits-rebuilding-relationships 

Fired the law firm that was doing exactly what BC hired them to do?  BC must think people are pretty dumb.

Ian MacDonald wrote: Looks like they heard us. They're firing the law firm and dropping the lawsuits.

https://gearjunkie.com/backcountry-fires-law-firm-drops-lawsuits-rebuilding-relationships 

Embargo lifted!

Jim Turner wrote:

Fired the law firm that was doing exactly what BC hired them to do?  BC must think people are pretty dumb.

Right...they only reason they're doing anything is because they were caught. It's still nice to see the power we as consumers can have on corporations though. 

Bad backcountry....but let’s be honest I will buy shit from wherever it is cheapest lol

Ian MacDonald wrote: Looks like they heard us. They're firing the law firm and dropping the lawsuits.

https://gearjunkie.com/backcountry-fires-law-firm-drops-lawsuits-rebuilding-relationships 

Good steps. Whatever ratio of conscience or self serving, I think they deserve some credit and to not be overly demonized.  They obviously needed a wake up slap to the head, but it may have worked. We'll have to see how the follow through goes.

see Ma Ja? Today is better than yesterday :)

I'll be interested to hear from my local guys if they come through with anything like an apology, appropriate reparation, and ​it isn't all under a gag order.

Best, Helen