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Getting divorced and climbing is a big reason why. Advice?

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Ben F · · Utah currently · Joined Oct 2020 · Points: 0

My wife and I are getting divorced and I feel pretty shitty and am hoping to hear some advice from anyone who has been through this.


We have been together almost ten years and have had our normal share of problems, but until the last 2 years when things really started going downhill, I didn't think there was anything out of the ordinary and we were by and large happy. She is only mildly interested in climbing and doesn't like suffering at all so we don't get out climbing together all that much. She had the patience of Job with allowing me tons of time to go climbing, including lots of shorter trips. There were a lot of trips where she would come and chill and hike or something while I went climbing too. I felt like I was conscious of the time component and tried to include her as much as possible and really be present with her the rest of the time but between our jobs, life, and my climbing time, it turns out that there might not be enough time for it all.


Thankfully the process of divorcing shouldnt be too bad since we have pretty equal assets/income, no kids, and we don't hate each other. But I feel pretty lost in general and second guessing a lot of my life. There were other issues that drove us apart but I'm still spending a lot of time wondering if I screwed up by spending so much time climbing. Are there climbing fanatics out there that actually make it work with a non-climbing or minimal-climbing partner and also feel fulfilled with the amount of climbing they get in?

Princess Puppy Lovr · · Rent-n, WA · Joined Jun 2018 · Points: 1,756

Did you try counselling? 

I think its hard to really know but I highly doubt climbing is as major factor as it may seem. Fundamentally my wife doesnt even really care that I am climbing, I could be go cart racing, her issue is often far more that she wants to spend time with me. We only have so much time in this world. If she expects you to spend 30% of your free time with her and you expect to only spend 10% then that is really more a communication problem than a climbing problem. 

I have been with my wife 7 years and I have been averaging probably about 400 pitches/climbs per year in that time span. The compromise is that I try to be at home/with her 95% of the year on any given night. I tell her, I will go wherever provided there is some rock climbs (I recently went climbing in philly) so we travel to places with not so good climbing but we are together. Maybe there is a compromise, maybe there isn't. Marriage is like a project, sometimes you need a little beta spray from a counselor to get that send.

Or just buy a dog.

Cherokee Nunes · · Unknown Hometown · Joined May 2015 · Points: 0

Some day you will be dead. My advice is try to pack in as much in the time you're blessed with. Your ex is clearly not on the same train as you. In time the lost feeling will pass. To accelerate, load your tray the fuck up at the climbing buffet of life. You don't have to pay the cashier till you get to the end of the line.

Fail Falling · · @failfalling - Oakland, Ca · Joined Jan 2007 · Points: 916

By your perception of your attempts to include and balance the time you spent between the aspects of your life pulling in different directions, you didn't screw up at all. The point is that you were being pulled in different directions. Different directions are the reason why good relationships don't always last and its ok when those relationships pass; not every partnership is a lifetime partnership. 

Obviously for climbing fanatics finding a partner that shares your fanaticism is the ideal, but barring that, finding someone that has their own "thing" that they spend their time on is ideal. In that situation, you can share your experiences with each other after returning from your separate adventures and effectively get two adventures for the price of one. The crux is to find that person that has their own thing that you care about hearing about and that cares about hearing about your climbing thing (which should be easy enough since the person you love should care about the things you love even if they don't care about the thing but experience has led me to learn that finding those sort of people is harder than it should be) 

Chuck Parks · · Atlanta, GA · Joined Jan 2008 · Points: 2,190

I've seen relationships cover the gamut from a partner who doesn't climb at all to both partners climbing together all the time. I've seen relationships fail across that entire spectrum, while others succeeded. I don't think climbing per se is a reason for people breaking up. It can become a wedge issue, just as money, kids, drugs, work, etc.

F r i t z · · North Mitten · Joined Mar 2012 · Points: 1,155

I can relate due to similar circumstances. I wish I had an easy answer to give you, but I don't. Hang in there and give yourself time and grace to heal. The relationship may be irreparable but things can definitely get better for you.

One thing that helped me above and beyond the cliche of climbing more and putting up new routes was finding completely new interests to develop. I picked up another instrument and worked with animals on a ranch, which was way different than the IT jobs I'd had before. Doing hard manual labor and caring for other creatures gave me a very different perspective on life.

Stay strong and stay well.

Andrew Gram · · Salt Lake City, UT · Joined Jan 2001 · Points: 3,725

I'm going through the same thing after nearly 16 years together right now, and know a bunch of others who are as well - it seems like the pandemic put the final nails in the coffin for lots of shaky marriages.  My ex and I get along fine, which is great since we have a kid to coparent, but we've effectively been roommates for a few years.

My takeaway is that marriage is hard, and you have to really actively work at it once you get past the honeymoon phase.  If you don't proactively stay out in front of communication problems, being much more grateful than critical, maintaining closeness, balancing partnership and independence, dividing work in ways that you agree are fair to both of you, etc things will seem great at first, then fine, then ok, and then you hit an exponential downward curve that ends in a trip to the courthouse.  

Activities are just a symptom, not an underlying cause unless you are a truly exceptional gone most of the year case.

Matt Himmelstein · · Orange, CA · Joined Jun 2014 · Points: 194

From what you wrote, she seemed to be accommodating to your interest and you did not force her to participate, but that is only half the equation.  Did you take an interest in what she wanted to do?  How many times did you take a trip where it was a shared interest or something for her where you were as accepting of her desires as she was of yours?  Maybe you did all that, but what you describe is more of trying to make the frequent climbing trips as enjoyable for her as possible, which just might not have been enough for her.

Only you can decide what is the most important way to split/prioritize your time. My wife does not do the outdoor things I do, so I generally don't take trips (except occasional weekends) to exclusively pursue my hobbies. Where I can, I try to make sure that the big trips are built around mutual interests, and maybe I can do a bit of what I really love while there. So maybe you take a trip to Thailand, but you only get to climb 2 out of 10 days. Something like that. Maybe that isn't enough for you, in which case you two just were not compatible. Maybe even those 2 days would be too much for her, which would result in the same end point. Maybe you never tried to reach that medium, in which case there was more you could have done.

Rollin · · SLC, UT · Joined Jul 2015 · Points: 974
Andrew Gram wrote:

I'm going through the same thing after nearly 16 years together right now, and know a bunch of others who are as well - it seems like the pandemic put the final nails in the coffin for lots of shaky marriages.  My ex and I get along fine, which is great since we have a kid to coparent, but we've effectively been roommates for a few years.

My takeaway is that marriage is hard, and you have to really actively work at it once you get past the honeymoon phase.  If you don't proactively stay out in front of communication problems, being much more grateful than critical, maintaining closeness, balancing partnership and independence, dividing work in ways that you agree are fair to both of you, etc things will seem great at first, then fine, then ok, and then you hit an exponential downward curve that ends in a trip to the courthouse.  

Activities are just a symptom, not an underlying cause unless you are a truly exceptional gone most of the year case.

In the same boat right now after 5 years together. Totally agree about the pandemic (lots of life changes and stress), and about your thoughts. Balancing all those relationship things is hard. It's not likely about the climbing, that just becomes an easy scapegoat. And it sucks, sorry dude.

Eric Chabot · · Salt Lake City, UT · Joined Jul 2011 · Points: 45

I'm sorry bud. Losing a love really sucks. I've gone through some hard changes in the last year including the end of a relationship. This might not be a popular opinion around here, but what it taught me was that climbing can be a really self-absorbed, pointless activity, and the meaning I ascribed to it was illusory and impermanent compared with the value of other people in my life. Maybe it's different for other people and climbing is no doubt super cool. 

But be honest with yourself about what your values are and let them dictate where you apply your energy.

bryans · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Jun 2006 · Points: 527

I won't repeat what has already been said. I will say I'm separated after 18 years together and 14 married - trying to reconcile and maybe will - and having some of the same thoughts you are about how climbing affected my marriage while we had and raised 3 kids. I know that during those years I was bro-ish in the back of my mind, like "climbing is so important to me, I'll never regret sending this rad route or putting up this new line while my wife is home with the kids because I already spend so much time with them, I'm a great dad!" Funny, turns out that's not enough.

And now those moments in the sun out at the crag don't sparkle as hard as I thought they would. Wasn`t it enough to climb 5.11 well? Would 5.12 have made me happier? Would 30 FAs have made me as happy as 40? There's diminishing returns to most things. You might almost say I regret tripling down on my "right" to "follow my bliss" directly at the expense of my marriage.  So yeah, some dudes will say fuck it, climb your heart out, and ignore your pain (and no judgment here, sincerely, every situation is different), but no crag is ever going to love you back.

Jake wander · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Aug 2014 · Points: 195

Every once in awhile mp reminds me of it’s value. 

M M · · Maine · Joined Oct 2020 · Points: 2

Climbing is absolutely meaningless compared to family. I'd take up bathtub water ballet over losing family over a hobby. Of course in my younger years I might/probably/almost lost family over it so there is that too.

Russ Walling · · Flaky Foont, WI. Redacted… · Joined Oct 2004 · Points: 1,216

If your climbing life only got you to where you three hang 10a’s you probably fucked up.  If you are a V12 / 5.14 crusher, her going to the curb is plus.  Enjoy the rest of your life, or not.

Dan Schmidt · · Eugene, OR · Joined Feb 2016 · Points: 349
Cherokee Nunes wrote:

Some day you will be dead. My advice is try to pack in as much in the time you're blessed with. Your ex is clearly not on the same train as you. In time the lost feeling will pass. To accelerate, load your tray the fuck up at the climbing buffet of life. You don't have to pay the cashier till you get to the end of the line

Laid out in bed, in an empty room save for a browser window open to my stellar 5.10+ tick list, I die without regrets. 

Lena chita · · OH · Joined Mar 2011 · Points: 1,667

Divorce is hard. Who knows if climbing contributed, in your case, or anyone else’s. There is rarely just one cause. I know you say you accommodated her while climbing, and she seemed happy enough, but what was her take? Have you guys fought about climbing often? Has she expressed frustration with your time away? If not, then it’s unlikely that climbing was the primary reason.

It sounds like you are going through an amicable divorce, that is something, at least! Maybe you can ask her… if not now, then a couple of years down the road, when you both aren’t so emotionally raw.

There is such a huge variation in expectations from person to person. One person’s “all-the-time” is another person’s “hardly-ever”. It’s not about a specific number of days apart, or number of hours together that would solve thx problem in the next relationship. If she felt like climbing was always coming first, if it seemed that when you were together, you really wanted to be elsewhere, it doesn’t matter that you thought you accommodated. That’s not how it felt to her.  

Tim Stich · · Colorado Springs, Colorado · Joined Jan 2001 · Points: 1,516

I am pretty sure your collective reasons for divorce are not actually being voiced by your spouses. My wife was unable to articulate a single, coherent reason for leaving the country and in fact asked me back after a month or two with someone that apparently treated her poorly. From what my therapist friend tells me, most women divorce because the men are not sharing all of the domestic chores, financial matters, and their share of "emotional labor." I put quotes around that, but you can look up the term. I'm allowing it to fade in memory for the moment. The climbing thing is just an add on sour note. I'm sure someone out there has written more on this, but suffice to say, most of us are in the dark about what is wrong with our relationships. This includes me, of course. 

They Don't Think It Be Like It Is But It Do.

In any case, I sympathize with everyone. I had a very painful break up about a year ago and not one bit of it has healed. Good times for sure!

[Emotional labor: the mental activity required to manage or perform the routine tasks necessary for maintaining relationships and ensuring smooth running of a household or process, typically regarded as an unappreciated or unacknowledged burden borne disproportionately by women.]

Bill W · · East/West · Joined Aug 2021 · Points: 0
Ben F wrote:

My wife and I are getting divorced and I feel pretty shitty and am hoping to hear some advice from anyone who has been through this.


We have been together almost ten years and have had our normal share of problems, but until the last 2 years when things really started going downhill, I didn't think there was anything out of the ordinary and we were by and large happy. She is only mildly interested in climbing and doesn't like suffering at all so we don't get out climbing together all that much. She had the patience of Job with allowing me tons of time to go climbing, including lots of shorter trips. There were a lot of trips where she would come and chill and hike or something while I went climbing too. I felt like I was conscious of the time component and tried to include her as much as possible and really be present with her the rest of the time but between our jobs, life, and my climbing time, it turns out that there might not be enough time for it all.


Thankfully the process of divorcing shouldnt be too bad since we have pretty equal assets/income, no kids, and we don't hate each other. But I feel pretty lost in general and second guessing a lot of my life. There were other issues that drove us apart but I'm still spending a lot of time wondering if I screwed up by spending so much time climbing. Are there climbing fanatics out there that actually make it work with a non-climbing or minimal-climbing partner and also feel fulfilled with the amount of climbing they get in?

Climbing is a huge time commitment, so is marriage. Pick one. The ones that get both are outliers.

Jkug Kug · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Nov 2020 · Points: 0
Bill W wrote:

Climbing is a huge time commitment, so is marriage. Pick one. The ones that get both are outliers.

Totally agree- climbing is different to a hobby. It is a passion and passions demand lots of time. Marriage should also be a passion but so often the partner feels that they rank behind climbing. Good luck to us all on this journey of trying to balance that which can’t be balanced except in rare circumstances 

Mark Pilate · · MN · Joined Jun 2013 · Points: 25

Don’t think too hard on it.  Climbing likely had little to do with it.  The main intractable issue is that many women labor under the delusion that there’s a decent guy out there somewhere. 

Jake Jones · · Richmond, VA · Joined Jun 2021 · Points: 170
Ben F wrote:

My wife and I are getting divorced and I feel pretty shitty and am hoping to hear some advice from anyone who has been through this.


We have been together almost ten years and have had our normal share of problems, but until the last 2 years when things really started going downhill, I didn't think there was anything out of the ordinary and we were by and large happy. She is only mildly interested in climbing and doesn't like suffering at all so we don't get out climbing together all that much. She had the patience of Job with allowing me tons of time to go climbing, including lots of shorter trips. There were a lot of trips where she would come and chill and hike or something while I went climbing too. I felt like I was conscious of the time component and tried to include her as much as possible and really be present with her the rest of the time but between our jobs, life, and my climbing time, it turns out that there might not be enough time for it all.


Thankfully the process of divorcing shouldnt be too bad since we have pretty equal assets/income, no kids, and we don't hate each other. But I feel pretty lost in general and second guessing a lot of my life. There were other issues that drove us apart but I'm still spending a lot of time wondering if I screwed up by spending so much time climbing. Are there climbing fanatics out there that actually make it work with a non-climbing or minimal-climbing partner and also feel fulfilled with the amount of climbing they get in?

That sucks Ben.  I went through that about 5 years ago.  Like your situation, there were extenuating circumstances and multiple "factors" but climbing was definitely a part of it.  It's never easy.  A decade was spent with this person, and I imagine you know quite a bit about each other.  It's like losing a part of yourself if your marriage was even the slightest bit intimate.  Believe it or not, it gets easier with time.  If anything I'd say to take stock of what really matters to you, and it'll probably be a while until you try to meet new people and that's ok.  Focus on yourself for a while and beating yourself up does no one any good.  People change as they age, and sometimes people grow apart.  If you're passionate about climbing and it brings you joy- that matters.  Life is getting more complex and more stressful as we venture further into the new millenium, and finding solace and a way to refresh becomes more and more important- particularly if you have people depending on you.  If climbing does that for you, then don't let it go.  If there were other factors, and you know more or less what drove you apart, take it for what it is and be honest with yourself.  It's ok to grieve for your loss and hers, it's a normal part of separating from a partner.  Be clear with what you want in a partner, if you choose to seek one again, and you should be ok.

I lucked out, I found someone that wasn't a climber but was interested in it, and now we climb together all the time and she is way better than me.  New rope gun.  We go on trips at least 8-10 times a year and climb at the gym together often, and manage a blended family of me, her, her mom, her daughter and mine all together in the same house.  There's hope my man.  Stay up!

Guideline #1: Don't be a jerk.

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