New and Experienced Climbers over 50 #44

Nick, Webster or Willard? I'm not remembering much in the way of rock routes on Webster---and ice routes are always 'chipped'!!!!

New thread photo bump.

Revisited this climb 35 years after I put up the first ascent in 77.

https://www.mountainproject.com/area/106940046/toms-thumb

T Hocking wrote:

New thread photo bump.

Revisited this climb 35 years after I put up the first ascent in 77.

Tad, where is this one? It looks faintly like Lovers Leap.

Brad, Susanville area and it is like a mini LL.

Pioneered this crag 77-78 while attending Lassen Community College.

More here;  https://www.mountainproject.com/area/106940046/toms-thumb

• Lost in the sun is the  5.6 on Webster that Chuck Woodman put up and reported that he had chipped one hold to keep it 5.6 causing a huge ruckus on NEClimbs. Had he put a bolt there and called it 5.6 A0 there's no  ruckus.  Silly human rules..  I will not out the local hero that is often used as an example of pure ism whenever someone suggests something outrageous like replacing a tat anchor on Cathedral with bolts  for having a heavy hand with a hammer 🔨 on upper Willard but it's the kind of thing that makes me laugh when folks climb up on their high horse over climbing ethics.  

While I don't know which route you are referring to on Upper Willard, so can't say whether or not it was chipped, I do know that much of the rock up there is quite rotten, so necessary ( even 'unintentional' ) loose rock removal may have been involved.

This seems like a good place to remind folks that July 20 is the last day for public comment in support of climbing and anchor maintenance in Wilderness and other Forest Service lands.  The deadline for comment to the National Park Service, BLM, and fish and wildlife servixe are in August I believe.

before you make another comment here, please speak up for climbing and anchor maintenance on the routes we love.

More info and details at the link below.

https://safeclimbing.org/federal-directives

MM. I was just giving Nick a hard time. I have climbed a bunch in Acadia Over the years. 

Alan. It was absolutely chipped. Isa and I both agreed on that on the 2nd ascent . Then I brought in an expert from Rumny and he confirmed.   And yes there is a fine line between cleaning and enhancement but its totally fine to drill bat holes and smash in bashies.  The man who started the whole concept of bolt wars has a bolt ladder named after him.   Just know that not all is as pristine in our climbing world as many would like to think it is. Ethics tend to be situational and often judged on who you are and know rather than what you are actually doing... and because of that largely full of shit. That certainly does not mean that I think Snake dike should have been sport bolted. It just means that I know that the folks who screamed the loudest about chopping the bolts  probably are not as squeaky clean as they like to think they are and almost certainly their hero's are not as innocent as they portray themselves.

Nick Goldsmith wrote:

Alan. It was absolutely chipped. Isa and I both agreed on that on the 2nd ascent . Then I brought in an expert from Rumny and he confirmed.   And yes there is a fine line between cleaning and enhancement but its totally fine to drill bat holes and smash in bashies.  The man who started the whole concept of bolt wars has a bolt ladder named after him.   Just know that not all is as pristine in our climbing world as many would like to think it is. Ethics tend to be situational and often judged on who you are and know rather than what you are actually doing... and because of that largely full of shit. 

What route? Spill the beans it's fine

Why bother. well over a decade ago. The Northeast is a great hider of climbing transgressions. If it doesn't see a lot of traffic it simply grows over again... I don't even know the name? Upper Willard.  two pitches. First one is face to OW. P2 face that goes at 10a thanks to a few heavy hammer blows BINTD ;)  It's all good and a fun route. I just think it is hilarious that people have climbing heros and think that those hero's are somehow morally superior to the rest of humanity.    I thought it was pretty awful how bad everyone piled on Chuck at the time that he chipped that one hold to keep his climb at the grade. I would  have placed a bolt and yarded on the nylon bucket. Not because I think that is morally superior to chipping a single hold but because I know that's the rulze. And it is probably easier to simply place the bolt. 

Thanks Nick, I truly do you pointing out the hypocrisy.

Dan, the ethical (yes, very loaded word) thing is to chop the rungs. The bigger dilemma is who does it?

Oh, and the chalk lightning bolt on midnight Lightning is different and should stay.

Yes, that's me owning my own hypocrisy!

Yes, AQI came down, we got out on Betty today.

Todd - Actually, I think the ladder rungs in the photo on page 1 look pretty cool, and I'd be sorry if they were chopped (though it's doubtful that I'll ever climb there). They're so unusual, and now kind of historical.

bus driver wrote:

This seems like a good place to remind folks that July 20 is the last day for public comment in support of climbing and anchor maintenance in Wilderness and other Forest Service lands.  The deadline for comment to the National Park Service, BLM, and fish and wildlife servixe are in August I believe.

before you make another comment here, please speak up for climbing and anchor maintenance on the routes we love.

More info and details at the link below.

https://safeclimbing.org/federal-directives

bus driver, I left a comment on the directive.

That's crazy beautiful out there.  Is it busy?

Daniel Shively wrote:

Interesting placements on Bush the Imbecile, Tranquility Wall, Wheeler Crest.  All in all a fun route climbed about twenty years ago with Denise and Bill Lundeen. The ladder rungs were placed by the FA to bypass some circuitous mid 5.11 climbing. 

A fun and very unique climb! Bizarre is probably the more appropriate description with those crazy rungs in the rock.  Great day cause I was hangin' out on the Wheeler Crest with Dan and Denise. Can't get much better than that!  

Seems like a lot of work to place those when you could just batman on the draws.  Thinking Aincient Art. 

I'm forgetting where it is but I recall reading about a climb ( in Europe) that had artificial holds bolted on so that it was possible to 'free climb' a seemingly blank short section---interesting 'compromise'.

we did the Via Feratta in Telluride and it was an absolute Hoot!

I had to work yesterday. It was dark yesterday shutter speed had to be a bit low for the task... 

I cut way back this year. only 5 gigs total. 4 down and one to go!  Might skip it completely next year....  Big changes... 

Yeah, nothing like shooting a horse show in the rain. Actually I know that was eventing. When I used to occasionally work for my friend, Stan Phaneuf, I remember shooting a show down around Harrisburg. And it was really wet. I always did the hunters and jumpers because that's what I used to ride. I called it working hunters underwater(instead of under saddle). Got a killer shot of someone falling off into a giant mud puddle unfortunately, they didn't buy that shot. Oh well.