New and experienced climbers over 50 #37

Jim, I have no ties to California…I am just calling out not opinions you may have, but your blatant factual falsehoods, and that when you are called on it, you just deny your prior statements or just change the topic. That is what I find exhausting. 

Jim U., I don't know where your forebears are from, though making a safe bet that they haven't been on this Continent forever, and likely arrived from somewhere. And, wherever it was they arrived from, it is almost guaranteed that at least some of those already here---and likely a good number of them, were opposed to 'their kind' being allowed into the country and demonized them in a very comparable manner as you just did concerning our most recent arrivals. Even the earliest European settlers in what eventually became the US, in addition to how they treated the earlier indigenous inhabitants, were quick to reject, demonize, ostracize, even try to outlaw, later arrivals who were from elsewhere or had somewhat different religious beliefs---with the Quakers being just one example. Such attitudes continued basically unabated as new waves of immigrants from different places or with different beliefs arrived here.

While there are obvious cultural differences among people of different backgrounds and different levels of assimilation ( especially for the first generations), most who arrive here want to become 'Americans' , the same as previous generations of new arrivals---not all of them, of course, but the vast majority---and more often than not, the differences they do bring end up adding positively to our social fabric.

Ward, I am very afraid that the world depicted in 1984, though several decades later than Orwell envisioned, is much closer to realization than ever---and the threat is coming from both the right and the left. I am aware that you tend towards a libertarian approach, but even among that 'persuasion', we have Peter Thiel controlling a data-mining organization ( named after a Tolkien ' magic ball' that gives a distorted view)--a threat to us all.

Now, I would love to get back to climbing---just wish it were cooler and drier around here---and I was younger!!!!!

Jim has it correct about California. You east coasters don’t really have a good picture of all the rot in government here.
LA is in a deep deep hole financially. Going to cut fire department, police, animal control and everything we actually use need. But don’t worry Karen Bass has a plan! She was able to save DEI funding and the Olympics are coming to town soon! It will be a “green car free Olympic Games” … this sounds great. I can’t wait for the international press to get on a Metro train filled with homeless drug addicts, thier feces, the trash and the vicious panhandling. That’s a really good look for our city.
Don’t get me started on state government… the freaking “hi-speed train” is going nowhere quickly and the only thing hi-speed about it is the rate it gobbles up tax money. The biggest boondoggle.
But heck everything is fabulous.

Going Climbing over the holidays.
Happy Birthday America, hang in there. 

It's hard not to join in the fracas here.  I've lived in California my entire life.  I wouldn't live anywhere else.  I'm sure Randy can be more eloquent about this.  But I get irked with the lack of gratitude for all we have here... for the forward-thinking aspects of this state.  I am profoundly in awe at the beauty of our oceans, rivers, mountains and deserts.  And our universities, like Santa Cruz, tucked into the redwood forest, UCLA (my alma mater), Humboldt and all the many other centers of learning.  And our agriculture and farms, which feed most of the US.  

I know we have problems.  I would prefer to be a problem-solver. I would rather find solutions to our homelessness, and our wasteful use of resources, than to complain and blame.  

When I lived in Placer County, a friend thoughtlessly told me he believed that all the local homeless and drug addicts should be dropped off in Sacramento County, a Democratic county, because Placer County has a 'high bar'.  He didn't realize that he was talking about my youngest son, who at that time was struggling with addiction.  So... move them out of the rich red county and dump them on the blue.  California has recently spent $24 Billion on homelessness, but it hasn't solved the problem.  However, it's not nothing.  And we're fighting monied people who think of them as vermin. (and then complain about them)

In my neighborhood people are complaining about the cost of home insurance, and blaming Gavin and the 'greedy insurance companies'.  Mine just tripled. I have been wondering how any insurance company can afford to insure a property that is very likely to go up in smoke at any time.  But while we are complaining, we also have a federal government that is committed to ignoring global warming.  Our state is on fire again.  It is now a year-round thing. Just over 1,000,000 acres of California burned in 2024.   And somehow, Gavin Newsome is to blame. (!?!)  But no one seems to take the responsibility for the 'drill, baby, drill' and the skyrocketing CO2 levels, the warming of our planet, the drought we are experiencing that now makes our fragile ecology a tinderbox. We've been warned... by scientists, for decades and told the explicit actions we must take to avoid further calamity.  Project 2025 literally laughs at this.  I did not see one iota of personal responsibility in any lline of Project 2025, only derision. 

The more we insist upon ignorance, the more expensive this gets.  I believe in 'set expectations'... I guess if we believe that Gov Newsome, or our Democratic congress, can fix this on a dime, then we will be nothing but disappointed.  

And that just touches upon one subject.  I watched a video this morning of two Latino gentlemen being arrested in their gas station in Downey... hauled off in their uniforms, gas station now shut down. our farms are bereft of harvesters. Food rotting in the fields.   Way to go!  But don't complain about prices later.  More than that, it's the intentional cruelty.  How can we ever be proud again.   

I'm sure there are plenty of statistics to show that people & businesses are leaving California, but there has been virtually zero practical evidence of this to me in the form of traffic, lines for anything, and tourons in my little mountain town. California is as populated as it is because the diversity of the environment and cultural opportunities far exceed anything else in the country- I just returned from a trip to south-central Florida, which only heightened that contrast. I'd be more than happy to see this Cali-haters evidence of population decline in my area, believe-you-me...but it just ain't happening.

Lori,

I won't quote you, but excellent post above.

Now I will attempt to flood the zone with some climbing talk.

Probably anyone who lives to climb, has a major climbing area minutes away, and a lot of free time on their hands begins to start soloing climbs. I know many on this thread have, and maybe still do. It is something I have done on many occasions off and on throughout my climbing career, and after six years of steady climbing at Smith I find I am doing more of it than ever. It is not something I commonly talk about unless asked, so believe me there’s a bit of awkwardness in talking about it here, but this thread is in need of some climbing content and this is what I got.

Before you write me off as an unhinged kook let me assure you I approach them in a very methodical way. Nowadays, as a brittle senior citizen, everything I solo I have done roped before with at least one run where I run it out to the point that I am effectively soloing most of the climb anyway. The climbs I choose are all crack climbs 2 to 3 hundred feet long, some may have the odd face move thrown in but you never have to go far to get another jam, and all are 5.9 or easier. Here is a bit of journaling about the pursuit of one of these climbs.

The pursuit of White Satin as a free solo

Early June 2025,

We have been having some unseasonably cool weather, so it has been great conditions for climbing on the tuff. Since this is Smith we are talking about, where daily you hear people talking about their projects, this would be an example of how I project climbs compared to say how sport climbers do it. Over on the Smith Rock group there is a climb called White Satin 5.9. It climbs high above the main area with the crux coming at the very end some 250' off the deck.

Probably due to my heavy fixation on Smith’s basalt climbing, I somehow in six solid years of climbing somewhere in the neighborhood of 250 days a year at Smith, I had never gotten around to doing this classic until a few weeks ago. Belayed by my good friend Emily I led the whole thing on about six cams. I had heard in advance from another friend that it was mostly #2 and 3 camalots up in the business, so I brought 2 each and one each #1, .75, .5 and .4 for a rack. The first pitch is a back and foot chimney with a bit of 5.6 passing a chockstone, where some sport climbing schmuck has added a bolt since the first ascent in their quest to put up new routes above. I skip the bolt like it is radioactive, because people were able to free climb it 56 years ago without it, in footgear way primitive compared to what I’m wearing today.

This leads to a cozy ledge and two bolt belay on top of a heart shaped feature. Alan Watts describes the first pitch as “unpleasant” but it is actually kind of fun if you like that sort of thing. The next bit is your typical lumpy wavy smith hand crack in a shallow corner, great locking jams but not so straight forward protecting with cams, you must focus on finding the straightest sections to place in. Suddenly, the corner ends and you are on top of a pointed flake broader than the hood of a luxury sedan and 12 feet high. You grab the top of the flake and step to the outside and hand traverse down the other side of the flake stepping left into another corner with a hand crack that sweeps up in a graceful ever steepening curve to a slightly overhanging finish. At the top I find just the right slot to use my remaining two cams to build a belay and bring Emily up. End round one.

Round two,

On Thursday my buddy Will agreed to belay me while I led White Satin on a rack of four hexes and the two cams for the belay, with my aim being to really focus on where the boundaries of my comfort zone lie. I wound up only using two of the four hexes, and felt completely in the zone, so round two a resounding success!

Afterward, we went down and Will led the inside corner of the Awl the first 5.10 by a decade at Smith, now rated 5.10c and done by Jim Ramsey in 1961. It is a brief but severe stemming problem with a crack in the corner that would be generous to call it tips. Will is a strong lad and not only sends the rig but sews it up as well. He sets up a belay at the top of the difficulties and I have to resort to a little A0 to get the nuts out on the follow. From there I lead an easy bolted slab to the top of the Awl. As I am clipping a bolt, I tell Will "looky here I'm sport climbing, don't you fucking dare tell anyone." While tainted by my shameless use of aid, another Smith tower is in the bag.

The Awl with the inside corner just left of the foreground juniper

Friday,

Reinforcing the head space, I head down to the dihedrals hoping to do some of my regular solo circuit, I have to work the crowd a bit to get started since there are top ropes on the first pitches of most everything easy that tops out and I have to settle for a 5.4 instead of the 5.6 I was planning on, no biggie though because the real prize is over the ridge. Once on the ridge, I walk up the ridge to intersect the “Spiderman walk off trail” which goes down the west side with a 5 easy downclimb move to get the base of Spiderman Buttress.

I solo the climb Spiderman, a 200' long 5.7 crack that is mostly hands but it also has a nice section of killer finger locks on a dead vertical wall capped by an exciting roof pull. I would consider it Smith’s finest 5.7 route.  From the top of Spiderman Buttress, I traverse back over to the ridge and down climb the same 5.4 I used to get up there. From there I backtrack to the misery ridge trail and go up it to the base of the Red Wall and solo the route Moscow 5.6 it is about 300' long, and features a 120’ long hand to fist crack laid back at a friendly angle that finishes the route.

pano from the top of the Red Wall

Saturday,

White Satin again, this time shoes and a chalk bag and my flyweight walking off slippers on a sling over my shoulder. A bit of trepidation while at the base, but none once underway, it goes as beautifully and smooth as I hoped it would. While at 5.9 it is rather insignificant by todays standards, to me it felt incredibly significant, since it had been 17 years since I have soloed 5.9, and is only about three notches below my onsite level at current time. On the way down I also climb the 5.2 northwest corner of the Arrowpoint, the second highest point of the Smith Rock group giving the whole experience a mountaineering feel and connecting with the roots of how I started this climbing thing.

I suppose, for those who do not understand what drives me to intensify my climbing experience to the degree of going ropeless I should explain. For one, I already get most of my mileage via top rope solo so going out partnerless is standard operating procedure, then there is the feeling of mastery of skill (never do I climb better), coupled with the ultimate freedom of it all, completely unfettered by gear, ropes, the needs of a partner etcetera, you cover a lot of ground quickly, it is all pure movement with no interruptions, plus I get to carry an extremely light pack on the walk in and out.

the cave on the west side of Arrowpoint

fossilwrote:

Lori,

I won't quote you, but excellent post above.

Now I will attempt to flood the zone with some climbing talk.

Probably anyone who lives to climb, has a major climbing area minutes away, and a lot of free time on their hands begins to start soloing climbs. I know many on this thread have, and maybe still do. It is something I have done on many occasions off and on throughout my climbing career, and after six years of steady climbing at Smith I find I am doing more of it than ever. It is not something I commonly talk about unless asked, so believe me there’s a bit of awkwardness in talking about it here, but this thread is in need of some climbing content and this is what I got.

Before you write me off as an unhinged kook let me assure you I approach them in a very methodical way. Nowadays, as a brittle senior citizen, everything I solo I have done roped before with at least one run where I run it out to the point that I am effectively soloing most of the climb anyway. The climbs I choose are all crack climbs 2 to 3 hundred feet long, some may have the odd face move thrown in but you never have to go far to get another jam, and all are 5.9 or easier. Here is a bit of journaling about the pursuit of one of these climbs.

That was a great post fossil. I don't solo these days but have in the past. Like you it was never onsight (at least not on purpose) and the hardest I ever did was easy 10 which was well below my limit at the time. Being able to cover a lot of rock quickly without having to focus on gear, switching belays, rope management etc made for some of the most rewarding days I've had climbing.

And while soloing is dangerous the reality is I've done far more dangerous things on a rope. Onsighting a runout trad line near my limit or an alpine route in the Alps when I was nearly taken out by a basketball sized rock were much riskier even though on the surface they may not have appeared that way.

Lori and fossil--very disparate posts but both excellent----shows what a good thread this is where we can--and do--touch on so many things!!!

Lori. I don't always agree with you on a number of topics, or, at least, look at things differently, but I'm with you 100% on this one.

Ward Smithwrote:

I've read a lot of dystopian novels many times, but 1984 only once.  Really a disturbing book that everyone should read once, and only once for me.  My 13 year old daughter is into the Hunger Games, and I'm reading it again and enjoying it.  That series, and Fahrenheit 451 (which I love and have read many times), at least have a somewhat hopeful ending.   1984 not so much: "‘If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face – for ever." 

 

I've read 1984 three times over the years. I've also read 'Julia' by Sandra Newman a look at 1984 from the perspective of Winston's girl friend. There is an interesting twist at the end.

Ward Smithwrote:

I've read a lot of dystopian novels many times, but 1984 only once.  Really a disturbing book that everyone should read once, and only once for me.  My 13 year old daughter is into the Hunger Games, and I'm reading it again and enjoying it.  That series, and Fahrenheit 451 (which I love and have read many times), at least have a somewhat hopeful ending.   1984 not so much: "‘If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face – for ever." 

 

The boots are being primed by a whole lot of bootlickers right now(both sides even). The Hunger Games is basically a part two to the dystopian books many of us have read, I'm happy that my kid has read a ton and possibly that series twice even. It probably seems like science fiction to them until they are old enough to really get it, certainly Orwell and Huxley did to me, now those books mean more than ever as I have a kid who isn't purely white growing up around a bunch of brainwashed lunatics who think our country needs to be more white. They are eating dogs ya know.

Today was a two-fer for me, climbing rock in the morning, working around the house mid day and gym in the evening,  sleep will be amazing with temps in the 50s tonight! 

A lot of this current  political conversation started about the 14th amendment…. Unlike the first 10 (usually referred to the ‘Bill of Rights’) I hadn’t really carefully read the rest of the Amendments to our Constitution.  I thought this would be a good time to do that.    

Some here claimed it was solely concerned with addressing the issue of slavery, and was being incorrectly applied to issues not related to slavery.

A careful reading by someone who has no training in or knowledge of the law (What  I do know if you know is, if you NEED a lawyer, it’s bad; and when you get to the judge level, it’s really, really bad…) showed:

In the 275, or so, words of the 14th Amendment, the word ”Slavery” does not appear once; nor does any synonym for “slavery” that I recognized appear.

If I were a “strict constructionist”  I would be forced to believe that this Amendment had nothing to do with “Slavery…” otherwise the authors would have said it was about “slavery.”  

The fact that they didn’t specifically say “children born of former slaves” but  said: “all persons born or naturalized…” can only mean one thing.

If you’re born here, you can be a citizen.

If the 14th amendment got it wrong, there are legal ways to fix it; but, you can’t ignore it.  To do so shows ignorance and hubris….

ed “ Who lived in Newark, NJ for a decade in the ‘80’s, I think I know racism when I see it…” e

Victor Creazziwrote:

I've read 1984 three times over the years. I've also read 'Julia' by Sandra Newman a look at 1984 from the perspective of Winston's girl friend. There is an interesting twist at the end.

Orwell knew why it would happen, and Huxley had a slightly more accurate idea of how it would happen, I think. 

Now, I would love to get back to climbing---just wish it were cooler and drier around here---and I was younger!!!!!

You're not too old, but the weather won't be cooperating for a while, unfortunately!

Daniel Joderwrote:

You guys are hilarious!

Daniel, how’s the heat in Spain? Always curious for updates from around the globe

Well, thanks for asking! It’s hot and humid here in Barcelona with temps into low 90s at times (30-34C)—combined with the humidity it makes for a very uncomfortable experience. We have been using our air conditioning a lot to be able to sleep comfortably. We could use some of that cold Arctic air about now.
I went sport climbing yesterday near Montserrat and by 1pm the crag was losing its shade and it just sucked in the sun, so we called it a day.
I, too, have been enjoying the variety of posts here, yes, including the political posts with contrarian views. Lots of folks over here are a bit bewildered and even a bit scared about everything going on the the States and I find it hard to explain things to them.
This weekend I’m headed up to a peak in the Pyrenees called Pedraforca that has been on my bucket list forever… we have chosen a long, historic, classic, easy, adventure route (Estasen) for my first time there. I’ll try to post up some pics when I get back.

It's been humid and has rained out every day I could have climbed. Resignation of a future living in a 3rd world shit hole because that's what this bill and the GOP agenda is accomplishing. I paid a 28 percent tax rate last year and billionaires are the ones who need a tax break.......

Brutal hot and humid here at West Point lately as well! 

Dewpoint of 74 F yesterday and 73 two days ago with rain everyday!

Getting dumped on daily but it is not supposed to rain here again until later tomorrow afternoon!

Praying that the cliffs dry out as I am planning on meeting up with Bill early tomorrow morning and hitting the Southern Pillar for the first time (and maybe rapping down afterwards to finish the true third pitch of Tipsy Trees) and then possibly Dennis or Jackie before meeting up with Dragons and hopefully getting a few .3's/.4's in the Nears that I haven't done yet!

That would have me finished off all of the 2+ star routes that are .4 and under for the Gunks on MP (except for the CCK area of closed routes, and Skytop of course-I'm not that posh and flush with money!!!).

Fingers crossed!!!

Climb On and do good things for random people!

Rando pic of me leading on the Petit Grepon two years ago because we need more climbing photos here!

fossilwrote:

I suppose, for those who do not understand what drives me to intensify my climbing experience to the degree of going ropeless I should explain. For one, I already get most of my mileage via top rope solo so going out partnerless is standard operating procedure, then there is the feeling of mastery of skill (never do I climb better), coupled with the ultimate freedom of it all, completely unfettered by gear, ropes, the needs of a partner etcetera, you cover a lot of ground quickly, it is all pure movement with no interruptions, plus I get to carry an extremely light pack on the walk in and out.

Okay, I get it, but on the other hand... what can replace the utter delight of standing on tiptoe with every muscle taught taut, as you try to figure out, for what seems to be unending minutes, why the 0.5 C4 is too large but the 0.4 C4 is too small for the only pocket you've come across in 20 feet? Not to mention the brain-stimulating challenges of overcoming rope drag, deciphering the tugged semaphores from your partner when the walkies have failed, or retrieving a pink tricam that has descended into the depths of a corkscrewing crack? And then there's the realization that you're still in touch with your "beginner's mind" when your partner points out that you're z-clipped. All things you'll never get to enjoy when soloing!

dragonswrote:

Okay, I get it, but on the other hand... what can replace the utter delight of standing on tiptoe with every muscle taught, as you try to figure out, for what seems to be unending minutes, why the 0.5 C4 is too large but the 0.4 C4 is too small for the only pocket you've come across in 20 feet? Not to mention the brain-stimulating challenges of overcoming rope drag, deciphering the tugged semaphores from your partner when the walkies have failed, or retrieving a pink tricam that has descended into the depths of a corkscrewing crack? And then there's the realization that you're still in touch with your "beginner's mind" when your partner points out that you're z-clipped. All things you'll never get to enjoy when soloing!

Ha!  Brilliant!

Be honest, Dragons, you're talking about me here!  Watching me over and over again on my leads ALWAYS picking the too large sized cam first and then picking the too small size, and then finally, after three tries, getting the correct sized cam for that horizontal crack!

;)

As for soloists, I've no beef with them as long as they are not solo'ing above me.

I don't need a meat crayon heading my way approaching terminal velocity when I'm climbing!

dragonswrote:

Okay, I get it, but on the other hand... what can replace the utter delight of standing on tiptoe with every muscle taught, as you try to figure out, for what seems to be unending minutes, why the 0.5 C4 is too large but the 0.4 C4 is too small for the only pocket you've come across in 20 feet? Not to mention the brain-stimulating challenges of overcoming rope drag, deciphering the tugged semaphores from your partner when the walkies have failed, or retrieving a pink tricam that has descended into the depths of a corkscrewing crack? And then there's the realization that you're still in touch with your "beginner's mind" when your partner points out that you're z-clipped. All things you'll never get to enjoy when soloing!

Or sport climbing---except for the 'z-clipping' bit!!!

Buck---quite an ambitious day you have lined up---especially in our current 'not exactly ideal' conditions here in the Northeast.