The latest, greatest 2:1 hauling kit

Quinn Hatfieldwrote:

Post #1

Followed by 15 pages of people doing it differently 

If you only read post #1, you miss out on the discussion about the cable dog bone failure.  

Christopher Chuwrote:

If you only read post #1, you miss out on the discussion about the cable dog bone failure.  

Absolutely!   Gear failure is something everyone needs to be aware of!!   Keep an eye on your gear and know it’s limitations!  

Michael Shulerwrote:

I believe I've read every page of this post and thought I'd cobble together a system with the parts and cord I have on hand, just in case I need to haul a body up a thing.. I'm still discussing larger objectives with a couple partners, but that'll be a while, so learning what I can. Anyway, this setup worked pretty well, thanks to decent pulleys that are part of my crevasse kit. I ordered a micro traxion and I'll swap the 7mm accessory cord for something more static - those are my next changes. My test was to haul a Miata transmission up about 15-18ft to my anchor up in our carport rafters and it was surprisingly easy. My question is opinions on whether the titan cord can take some decent abuse here. It seems like an OK option for a time and didn't get in my way, but I'm questioning myself. Thanks!

Get yourself a micro as soon as you can.  The efficiency of it over the ropeman will instantly be apparent,  even just when pulling the haul slack out.  

Skot Richardswrote:

Get yourself a micro as soon as you can.  The efficiency of it over the ropeman will instantly be apparent,  even just when pulling the haul slack out.  

It delivered yesterday, and the microtrax is much, much better. Waiting on another chunk of titan cord. Now wondering if I keep using the jumar, since I would have it and need to clip it into the system, or to use a dedicated device for simplicity..

Michael Shulerwrote:

It delivered yesterday, and the microtrax is much, much better. Waiting on another chunk of titan cord. Now wondering if I keep using the jumar, since I would have it and need to clip it into the system, or to use a dedicated device for simplicity..

Keep your eyes peeled for a good deal on a Petzl Croll or Petzl Basic.  There is at least one used Basic on eBay at the moment.  

Brian Rwrote:

Keep your eyes peeled for a good deal on a Petzl Croll or Petzl Basic.  There is at least one used Basic on eBay at the moment.  

I like to just use the handled ascender I’m already carrying rather than bring an extra piece of gear up the wall. 

Michael Shulerwrote:

It delivered yesterday, and the microtrax is much, much better. Waiting on another chunk of titan cord. Now wondering if I keep using the jumar, since I would have it and need to clip it into the system, or to use a dedicated device for simplicity..

I definitely recommend a dedicated rope grab like the Basic.  Not only does it allow you to have your haul kit intact and ready to deploy,  but it’s shorter than a standard jumar allowing you to dock the bags higher when finished with the haul.   

FYI If in need of a dedicated ascended for a 2:1 haul kit there is a barely used Petzl Basic, purple version, with (I think) a Petzl William locker on eBay for $55.

**Not my listing

anyone seen this chonker? petzl.com/US/en/Professiona…

800g? wow.. that is a chonk! My whole, now complete, kit is just over 1lb. I was super surprised at how much smaller and lighter the "new" Basic is, and I do agree a dedicated device makes really good sense at its tiny weight cost.

Maybe this is explained somewhere deep in the 15 previous pages, but, none of the set ups have a backup for the microtraxion. Is that because the ropegrab and 2:1 cord / pulleys are functioning as the backup?

Patsywrote:

Maybe this is explained somewhere deep in the 15 previous pages, but, none of the set ups have a backup for the microtraxion. Is that because the ropegrab and 2:1 cord / pulleys are functioning as the backup?

I would add one to be on the safe side, it’s quick and doesn’t require much gear.  I always pretend that when it’s not shown it is to make it easier to clearly see the more exciting parts of the system.  This is because having a backup was always mentioned/shown and greatly stressed as necessary when I was first learning about hauling systems. 

Brian Rwrote:

I would add one to be on the safe side, it’s quick and doesn’t require much gear.  I always pretend that when it’s not shown it is to make it easier to clearly see the more exciting parts of the system.  This is because having a backup was always mentioned/shown and greatly stressed as necessary when I was first learning about hauling systems. 

How exactly are you backing it up?

and what would happen if the MicroTrax did catastrophically fail?

In Kevin’s post- he suggests  backing it up (with a QuickDraw?) while you have someone counterweight’ing the free end.. which makes sense as you’ve got weight on either end of the rope in that scenario - and double the load

but in a normal 2:1 hauling system the rope is free on the other end of the Haul Line.. 

Brian Rwrote:

I would add one to be on the safe side, it’s quick and doesn’t require much gear.  I always pretend that when it’s not shown it is to make it easier to clearly see the more exciting parts of the system.  This is because having a backup was always mentioned/shown and greatly stressed as necessary when I was first learning about hauling systems. 

Great point.  

When in doubt back it up.  

Kevin DeWeese wrote:

Climbing Technology CRIC

This will be an interesting point of gear for the lower pulley and grab in the zed cord. 

The ability to flip it also makes it applicable for 1:1.  Haven't seen data on the sheave size, but it looks larger than a RollnLock based on the pictures with the carabiner.  Can assume 90% efficiency.  Looking forward to the data sheet release.

Kevin DeWeese wrote:

Climbing Technology CRIC

This will be an interesting point of gear for the lower pulley and grab in the zed cord. 

That thing looks awesome for far-end hauling (if the bag is attached to the haul line with a microtrax) to do 2:1.

It would also be nice for sport climbing style rope ascension with a gri gri on the harness

Kevin DeWeese wrote:

Climbing Technology CRIC

This will be an interesting point of gear for the lower pulley and grab in the zed cord. 

Climbing Technology is coming out with some cool gear lately.  They also have a new adjustable daisy/PAS that uses rope rather than webbing (looks *really* cool on paper).

Would like to see some demos of this progress capture device. 

Quinn Hatfieldwrote:

How exactly are you backing it up?

and what would happen if the MicroTrax did catastrophically fail?

In Kevin’s post- he suggests  backing it up (with a QuickDraw?) while you have someone counterweight’ing the free end.. which makes sense as you’ve got weight on either end of the rope in that scenario - and double the load

but in a normal 2:1 hauling system the rope is free on the other end of the Haul Line.. 

The same way Kevin suggests, using a quickdraw.  Counterweight hauling is definitely the best example of a reason why you’d want to back it up.  I’d just assume always be in the habit of adding that quick extra step, just in case (say your partner gets to the belay and starts helping you haul by hanging on the free end of the haul line…back up is already in place).  Also this extra step of backing up the main pulley/progress capture device became part of my haul set up protocol during the time that the hauling device of choice was the Petzl Wall Hauler.  I don’t think anyone would have recommended using one of those for the things a Micro Trax regularly is like top rope soloing, simul climbing, and belaying from above.  It certainly wasn’t as robust as a Pro Trax or Micro Trax.  

Peter Zabrokwrote:

I use a Micro-Trax only for hauling my gear pig, and upside-down on top of my main loads as a Far End Hauler so I don't have to faff around with a plastic bottle "knot protector".  No knot = no knot protector required.  I would never 1:1 haul a Grade VI load with a Micro-Trax; the pulley is too small.  

For a 2:1, it doesn't much matter what you use to hold the weight of the pigs, because you're lifting with the other part of the system. Still, it is concerning to me to see a device only rated 2.5 kN a side with the cam engaged. That surprised me...

For my money, the Kong Block-Roll is far and away the best hauling device. It is a PERFECT fit to put a 2:1 over top of, and once you have drunk down the weight of all your beer, and you want to switch to 1:1, it's a great device for that too because of its big ass 3" pulley.

Would you use a 2.5 kN carabiner in your system? Would you rappel from it? Would you clip it to a bolt? These are things to think about...

A Micro-Trax would be my haul device of choice on a Grade V wall with light loads, or to haul my gear pig. But not a full-size Grade VI or big wall camping load - it just ain't burly enough. You guys know how hard it is to wrestle a heavy ass load up a difficult slab or what have you. Do you really want a Micro-Trax for that application?  Don't you want something burlier.  I like burly.  

The Micro Traxion has a 4kN MBS as a rope grab, and the Kong Block-Roll has a 5kN MBS in the same mode.  Not really a large difference.  

Brian Rwrote:

The same way Kevin suggests, using a quickdraw.  Counterweight hauling is definitely the best example of a reason why you’d want to back it up.  I’d just assume always be in the habit of adding that quick extra step, just in case (say your partner gets to the belay and starts helping you haul by hanging on the free end of the haul line…back up is already in place).  Also this extra step of backing up the main pulley/progress capture device became part of my haul set up protocol during the time that the hauling device of choice was the Petzl Wall Hauler.  I don’t think anyone would have recommended using one of those for the things a Micro Trax regularly is like top rope soloing, simul climbing, and belaying from above.  It certainly wasn’t as robust as a Pro Trax or Micro Trax.  

I completely agree!  
anyone who would set up a haul and not back up their partner who might end up ‘space hauling’ is crazy. I’ve climbed as a party of three and jugged a weighted haul line without any fear because I know it was backed up to the anchor.
There have been several times my partner has cleaned the pitch, arrived at the anchor before o finished the haul, (something I always tried to avoid). But, the second would sometimes clip their jugs onto the deadend of the haul line and counter weight the haul to help space haul. I’ve even been my own counterweight when pre hauling to heart. Jug up, set up a progress capture device, grigri into the rope and then run back down the pitch to zip the bags up to the anchor, once the bags hit the anchor, throw on my jugs and pump back up to the high point.