Help me set some goals

I have never really set goals in climbing in terms of grade. My goals have always been to see certain places. Well for the next six months I will be living in London which means I'll be gym climbing A LOT. This is also new to me. I've probably had 30 or 40 serious gym sessions in my entire life.

While I hope to get to the good climbing in the UK and Europe, I will have to find a way to motivate myself in the gym or else I'll end up quitting. I know the first key will be to find a good group of climbers and if anyone knows of some London climbers I'm all ears. But mainly I'm looking for a way to stay psyched so when I get to road trip again next fall I can climb at the same level I do now or harder.

If you don't like me or I've pissed you off recently please stop reading now because here comes the spray.

I onsite 5.10 everywhere, every style, very consistently... like a warm up. I've onsited 11c sport more than several times, all styles. I've onsited 5.11 trad in many areas, mostly cracks but face routes as well. I am a better face climber than crack climber but it's real easy to place gear in cracks... IE easy to onsite.

I've red-pointed .12c a few 12b's and more 12a's,usually within 3 or 4 goes. The 12c took me 8 tries which is the most I've ever tried a route to date. I've never been on a 5.13.

I've read the SCC and loved it... will probably read it again and loosely follow the book this next six months.

My question is this: Is now the time for me to start working hard, training, projecting stuff? I mean I always thought that I'd project something when it really called to me... not the neon orange route in the gym. But to be honest I see no other option.

I want to take this opportunity to be one of those people that goes insane in the gym, gets super strong while also building my technique more, and just crushes. But I have two problems/questions with this.

First, can I expect to see gains outside from making gains inside? Maybe it's better to just try and onsite stuff at the gym (forgive me for using that term when talking about gym climbing), and just trying to maintain my strength and stamina until I get back on the road?

Second, am I asking to get hurt? I've never had a climbing injury before and don't want to start now. If I stop climbing I want it to be for my own reasons, not because my finger exploded.

So what do I do?

First question: Don't expect gains to directly correlate. When I boulder hard outside I can't climb inside and vice versa. It's not uncommon to see people crush inside and then hardly get off the ground on real rock.

Second question: All of my tendon injuries have been on plastic. If a hold hurts in a gym, don't use it. If your fingers start to hurt, lay off for a while.

As for what to do in a gym, if you're climbing a lot you're going to send everything within your ability in most gyms in a week or two. Then the only option is work things out of your ability level or run laps. I do both...

Good Luck!

Ryan Williams wrote:The 12c took me 8 tries which is the most I've ever tried a route to date. I've never been on a 5.13.

I don't have a lot to say about gym climbing (don't do it much), but I have a lot of experience in projecting. I can say that if the longest you've projected a route is 8 tries, then you are not truly climbing at your limit. If your goals have anything to do with climbing harder routes, then the above quote needs to change.

Why not use the gym as a way to just keep up your skill level - i.e. climb say, ten 5.10s with minimal rest to keep your stamina up and your flexibility good...or ten 5.11s.

Or, even better, do that one day a week and 'hard' stuff another day of the week?

Caveat: I'm definitely not super-experienced (~3 years climbing) nor super-strong (~mid 5.11) but those are the types of workouts that seem to help me the most.

1. Yes, you can see tremendous gains outside, given you already have the outside experience, and are now using this as a training method to enhance your ability.

2. Not if you warm up and stretch properly. Spend at least half an hour doing this. I start by doing some long routes about 3 grade levels below my red point ability, or just a really long traverse around the gym, followed by stretching, then doing a few routes (2-5 depending) about 2+/- grade levels below RP, then some more stretching, maybe eat an energy bar, take my shoes off, make sure I rest at least 10-15 mins, then get on something just below my RP, then I'm good to go; this can take an hour or more, but it's worth it.

3. Pick out a handful of routes that look fun and hard, and maybe a couple that seem out of your limit. Then, just pick away at them till they start going down. This can be adjusted depending on what you want to focus on; I try to have at least a few that work my weaknesses.

4. At the end of the session I try to focus on some aspect of training, either endurance, strength, dynoing, carefully campus-boarding, working on my one-arm, etc.

5. Try to get ahold of Mcleod's book, 9 out of 10 climbers...

6. Settle on the fact that it's a gym, and then try to have as much fun as possible with your imagination on the routes available, forget about the outside and just live in the moment knowing when you get back outside, you'll be stronger and more psyched.

Boulder often. Add a couple V grades to what you can do in the gym. When you hit a crux above gear in real life you will know it is well within your physical ability.

Do laps on routes.

Jay Knower wrote: I don't have a lot to say about gym climbing (don't do it much), but I have a lot of experience in projecting. I can say that if the longest you've projected a route is 8 tries, then you are not truly climbing at your limit. If your goals have anything to do with climbing harder routes, then the above quote needs to change.

That's what everyone says but I just get kind of bored. Of those 8 tries, only about half were fun. The first 3 and the last one ;)

I guess everything changes and I'll find a way to enjoy climbing no matter what kind of climbing it is that I'm doing.

AJS wrote:Why not use the gym as a way to just keep up your skill level - i.e. climb say, ten 5.10s with minimal rest to keep your stamina up and your flexibility good...or ten 5.11s. Or, even better, do that one day a week and 'hard' stuff another day of the week? Caveat: I'm definitely not super-experienced (~3 years climbing) nor super-strong (~mid 5.11) but those are the types of workouts that seem to help me the most.

We're probably not all that different. I've been climbing for a long time but really only seriously for 3 years. And I don't even consider myself a mid 5.11 climber yet but that's semantics. Good advice, thanks.

Thanks guys and gals. Some good words there. I do need to just accept the fact that it's a gym, don't worry about being outside, don't be jealous of my friends that are still living in their shitty trucks in the desert, and don't get down on myself.

I've heard McLeod's book is great, I'll try to get a copy. Sure they'll have it in London!

Bouldering has been what I've enjoyed the most inside. I think if I can get psyched on bouldering and gaining more power while keeping my endurance close to where it is now then I'll be good to go.

Now, how the hell do I keep my approach lungs/legs. Our plan is to do RMNP, Wind River Range, and lots of stuff in between. God I had to think about those hikes after spending 6 months in a city. I am going to get a bike though and will be riding to and from the gym every day.

NOW GO TO THE CLASSIFIED FORUM AND BUY MY STUFF SO I WILL HAVE ENOUGH MONEY TO EAT IN THAT GOD AWFUL CITY THAT I'M MOVING TO!

You've got 6mo. Plan 2 training cycles. Look at the Anderson bros cycle. Do one cycle with an ARC phase, the second without. That'll work out to about 6mo.

Projecting in the gym is a recipe for injury IMO. Too easy to keep trying things until something breaks because your skin doesn't wear out and it's too easy logistically...time is rarely an issue (like it would be if you had to hike an hour each way to your project outside, or it's only warm/cool enough part of the day), time getting to the top of something to set a TR is never an issue, brushing/cleaning/inspecting gear placements between attempts doesn't happen, figuring out where to clip from is rarely an issue. So you end up trying and trying and trying until "ping" WTF was that? Another pulley/shoulder/wrist injury...or the day after you feel the elbow tendonitis flaring.

Add to that, you've been working your proj in the gym, show up for a session and...WTF?! it's been taken down. Bummer braahhhh, shoulda sent last week.

I'd focus on doing two "by the book" cycles, with a shitload of supplmental core, yoga, general cardio/aerobic work. Then come home from the sodden isle, and crush it.

Your climbing level is a few letter grades higher than mine, and you're evidently bolder above gear, but we're close enough in ability that exchanging notes is likely not a waste. A bit of background: I've been wallowing at roughly the same level for a while. I'd get stronger bit by bit when I focused on climbing but had some nagging overuse-related elbow and shoulder pains; I'd get weaker, especially bouldering, during my more cardio (competitive cycling and trail running) training times.

A bit of frustration with my lack of consistent progress and the fortuitously-timed beginning of winter, and I'm embarking on my first semi-periodized climbing training cycle as per rockprodigy on that other site . While I'm not as rigidly structured as I could be, I've been diligently doing 1-2 hangboard workouts per week focused on hypertrophy, as well as 2-3 gym sessions each week focused on strength-oriented bouldering (this was hard at first, as I fancy myself a trad climber and don't particularly enjoy bouldering). The hangboard workouts are astonishingly short (19-20 minutes!), but for the first time in a while I feel like I'm making good, steady gains in strength and ability without obvious overuse pains.

Thus I end my inconclusive, overly-long, and rambling endorsement of a periodized training scheme. Give one cycle a try; you've got ample gym time and no dry rock nearby, so it's the perfect time. I might also suggest that you give the program your all _without_ a route grade in mind; while having a goal to work toward is good, I've found it's helpful (for me, anyway) to measure progress through training (ie. increasing intensity of hangboard workouts, or bouldering harder routes) as opposed to the end goal (for me, comfortably climbing 5.10 gunks trad). If I think too much about the goal, I end up wanting to lead in the gym a lot instead of stick to a training plan.... which hasn't helped my climbing very much.

ramble ramble ramble,
Goran

Will S wrote:You've got 6mo. Plan 2 training cycles. Look at the Anderson bros cycle. Do one cycle with an ARC phase, the second without. That'll work out to about 6mo.

Who are they? I forgot what ARC means but I've heard it before...

Buddy right above you linked the article with Anderson's cycle. "making of rockprodigy".

Ryan Williams wrote: Who are they?

+1

Ryan Williams wrote: Who are they?

they were in all 6 of the Star Wars movies...as the Force

they can light a fire by rubbing two ice cubes together

they can kill two stones with one bird.

AJS wrote: they were in all 6 of the Star Wars movies...as the Force they can light a fire by rubbing two ice cubes together they can kill two stones with one bird.

I think that's the hardest MP.com has EVER made me laugh! EVER!!

We take this all a bit to seriously don't we?

quit navel-gazing, forget the numbers, go climb and have fun

Ryan Williams wrote:If you don't like me or I've pissed you off recently please stop reading now because here comes the spray.

Telling statement.

I think you're goals are a bit off. How about try not to be such an ass on mp for six months. You are an admin for god sake.

just my observation.

could someone please flog me.

Eric Krantz wrote:quit navel-gazing, forget the numbers, go climb and have fun

Exactly. If you want to get better on the rock then dont hurt yourself in the gym, its simple. Go there and stay strong and psyched for the rock, fuck risking even a tiny injury in the gym. Work at belaying/spotting all the chicks instead. The payback for that can be priceless.

P LaDouche wrote: Exactly. If you want to get better on the rock then dont hurt yourself in the gym, its simple. Go there and stay strong and psyched for the rock, fuck risking even a tiny injury in the gym. Work at belaying/spotting all the chicks instead. The payback for that can be priceless.

Happily married but I do enjoy belaying/spotting the wife.

And I know it's simple... and stupid to worry about grades. But I'm in a three week period where I can't climb anything, not even inside, so I'm bored. And I have to have some kind of goals or I'll just stop climbing. The gym sucks and I'd rather just go to the bar but I have a chance to climb a lot next fall and want to stay in shape. I've just never had to climb inside before so looking for some advice that's all.

Ryan Williams wrote: That's what everyone says but I just get kind of bored. Of those 8 tries, only about half were fun. The first 3 and the last one ;)

Why were you bored? Projecting is all about learning, and I bet you learned something on each of those tries.

Sometimes I get bored climbing routes that I know I can do. Pushing into the unknown--sometimes it's fun, but it's almost always informative.