First ascents at each grade?

duncan... wrote:

To expand on Daniel's comments, The Open Book may be the first route to have been given the number 5.9 and is possibly the first route of that difficulty in the US but harder routes had been climbed at least 30 years previously in Saxony (Germany), the eastern Alps (modern Italy and Austria), and the Peak District (UK). A few US climbers had climbed routes comparable to European standards by the late 1950s, notably Gill and Robbins. US climbers were pushing world standards from the 60s to early 80s, since then first-of-the-grades have been largely European again. 

A timeline of notable ascents: en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/His…

Grade milestones: en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lis…

I perused that Wiki article with a timeline of notable ascents. Check it out and scroll down to where they list ascents in the 19th century and then by decade after that. Humans were (and are) amazing. Some pretty hard and scary routes were put up WAY back in the day. Thanks, duncan. 

So was Valhalla the first recognized 5.11 then? I understand people had done as hard/harder moves or routes prior but I’m curious was the first “official” YDS 5.11 and 5.10 and 12 was 

what is idiotic is California always claiming to be first despite loads of evidence to the contrary. 5.10 was being climbed in Germany in the 30s but Cali is always first in the world and as Donini mentioned the native people did some burly climbing long before Europeans arrived here in the states. 

Yes I understand people have climbed much harder elsewhere and earlier, i’m just looking for information on the evolution of the YDS specifically and which routes broke through each grade 

wivanoff wrote:

"Teufelsturm"  6a (5.9) in  Elbsandstein, Germany - Oliver Perry-Smith, W. Huenig, Rudolf Fehrmann in 1906 !!!

"Vector" (5.9) at Ragged Mountain, Connecticut - Fritz Wiessner 1933

"Open Book" (5.9) at Tahquitz - Royal Robbins 1952

Might add Goodros Crack in Big Cottonwood Canyon to this list,  except that it is 5.10. Done in the 40's IIRC. It's an excellent little climb.

 I suspect there would be pre ww2 5.10's in Europe. 

But California always claims first...

Nick Goldsmith wrote:

But California always claims first...

How true. Sometimes it even is true. Sometimes not.

in this case it has never been true but they always roll out the same claim.

the history of firsts is whitewashed bs

Tanner James wrote:

Yes I understand people have climbed much harder elsewhere and earlier, i’m just looking for information on the evolution of the YDS specifically and which routes broke through each grade 

Tanner, trying to stick to your specific question as posted above, still isn't easy.

As far as I am aware, the first routes graded 5.10 under the YDS ( though more correctly the TDS) were, not surprisingly, at Tahquitz. In the 1962 edition of his guidebook, Chuck Wilts gives 3 routes, all freed in 1960 by Tom Frost, the 5.10 grade--Dave's Deviation, The Blank, and The Big Daddy. I'm not sure which of the 3 was the first to be given that grade, though have a vague memory of being told that The Blank was the 'first'.

As for 5.11, I believe that Pat Ament graded Supremacy Crack in Eldorado Canyon as 5.11 when he first free climbed it on top-rope in 1965, then led it the following year ( though this ascent had the 'taint' of a brief rest, he reportedly repeated clean soon after). The route is currently graded 11c. So that climb was several years before Valhalla and of a completely different style.

I believe that the first 'official' 5.12 was either Fish Crack by Henry Barber or Hot Line by Bacher and Kauk---both in 1975 in Yosemite. I think Fish was freed first.

Again, as others have stated, routes at all these 'levels' had been climbed elsewhere earlier than these examples, sometimes by decades, but I believe that these are the specific 'firsts' to receive their grades under the 'US Decimal System'.

Very cool that’s what I was looking for. Thanks Alan!

While I seem to have a fair amount of such useless trivia ( whitewashed bs, as stated above) cluttering my brain, I am far from certain that much of it is accurate. So if others have corrections or additions, please post up.

Bolting Karen wrote:

I don't want to hijack the thread but mostly structural remnants in various stages of decay, some two or three stories tall. Rock art was pretty common as well, with some of the areas that being the main focus it seems. Ladders were more common than most think, I agree, and we have a lot of evidence to back that up. Some of the places though, logistically and structurally it wouldn't make sense with abrupt changes in the angle of the wall and it would appear that the obvious crack systems were more likely the access point. Some still had cut sticks jammed into them where the climbing got more difficult, but they were absent in the easier sections. Who knows if that was intentional or just what remains.

Also, we don't know the ground levels before 1200 years of erosion.

I believe these were the routes people identified for each grade for a comparison/standard.  However you can look-up the history if these routes. 

The Trough, East or West Lark,  Angels Fright, Mechanics Route, Open Book

I think White Maidens and Finger Trip might have been on that list.

Eric Craig wrote:

Might add Goodros Crack in Big Cottonwood Canyon to this list,  except that it is 5.10. Done in the 40's IIRC. It's an excellent little climb.

 I suspect there would be pre ww2 5.10's in Europe. 

Yes, there were lots of routes harder than 5.9 done before WW2 (some before WW1). Several are on Clint's list.

But, I was only addressing 5.9 in reference to Open Book. Because, apparently, I'm an idiot. Of course, I noticed that Cherokee chimed in, too. 

How about moses on mount sinai? Was that just a hike or did he do some 5.0 scrambling?

Wivanoff, I apologize. 

Alan R, I think your post looks good. I certainly don't know any better. And apparently I got sidetracked. 

Redacted Redactberg wrote:

How about moses on mount sinai? Was that just a hike or did he do some 5.0 scrambling?

The descent was the crux carrying those breakable tablets, especially wearing those robes.

Tanner James wrote:

Yes I understand people have climbed much harder elsewhere and earlier, i’m just looking for information on the evolution of the YDS specifically and which routes broke through each grade 

I will go with Alan Rubin's points. Ament did Supremacy in Eldorado Canyon before Valhalla. 

Fish Crack is probably before Hot Line. I could easily imagine Hot Henry getting pinched on recognition: because localism. He showed up all over and put the torch to many.

Super Crack in the Gunks was another early 5.12 by John Bragg I think? I bet there are other Gunks routes that deserve consideration. 

Remembering Scott Franklin at Smith Rock on Scar Face 14a, maybe the first of that grade.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=I48hr8HhDv0&pp=0gcJCfwAo7VqN5tD