New and Experienced Climbers over 50 #32

Guy Keeseewrote:

Damm it bone…. Now I need to go back and listen to the original speech. I studied that 45 years ago.
A quick internet search lead me to Wiki… not a very reliable source. That list him saying “foreign influence” …. You say “entanglements” . I said “agreements” …… 

I’ll listen to the replay….

Colden …. Best of luck with the interview 

Another good speech is Eisenhower’s farewell where he says that the greatest danger facing us is the Military Industrial Complex.  It has only gotten worse since then.  There is no profit in peace.

Ward Smithwrote:

Last day in Arizona, cold and windy and climbing in a down jacket. Made a new high point, move 10 of an 18 move problem, but no send.  I need to really train up for this one.

Hey Ward, congratulations on your progress on your boulder.  (does it have a name?) I’ve been following with interest, although I missed the whole history of this endeavor.  How long have you been at it?  And what is your plan… to go home, continue to train, and then come back?  Do you have a workout in mind?  I have to say the move on this picture looks… miserable.     But well worth it.  Is this the crux move?

Something we haven’t talked much about on this thread is projecting.  I guess the first big decision is whether a rock/route is even worth working on.  And if so, for how long—at what point do you decide to commit or walk away?  As a relative newby it’s a strange experience to get my heart fixated on a route and to become a bit obsessed with it.  Stranger still is the relationship formed.  I still moon over the one that got away and tell myself, I’ll be back! 

On my current project, Bob has suggested I might want to do some pushups.  Some leg/quad presses.  Sit ups/ ab work.  Stretches, daily.  Endurance work, via hiking up our stair master trail, frequently.  In other words, a complete body overhaul!    That’s ok with me, but it may take awhile.  

I guess the other thing… also very recent for me, is the desire to do it ‘right’.  Climb it clean, and gracefully.  On my one other ‘project’… we returned to this route over and over in 2022.  On the very last day of the season, I climbed it with one slip.  Because I was on a top rope, I could never say for sure whether it was  a fall.  Bob called it a ‘wobble’.  I thought about it all that summer, and had to go back one last time in the Fall to climb it wobble-free.  What a victory.  

K Mwrote:

Lori, 

In 2018 I spent a total of 5 weeks in ICU and another 7 weeks bouncing around 6 different medical facilities due to a clot in my intestine. During the process I had surgery with complications, heart problems, lung problems. I was intubated long enough that if I couldn't come off the respirator I would need a tractotomy. Dialysis to remove excess fluid and to help my one surviving kidney hopefully keep functioning. A feeding tube for about 10 weeks of the journey.

All this to say I and none of my family ever had the feeling that the medical community was doing less than their best to promote a good outcome. Never!

Maybe my situation is due to location. I don't know. But I will say I could not have been treated better.

As for the nutritionist, once I could prove I could swallow again I was almost force fed to the point I was flushing food down the toilet to make it seem like I was eating it all.

Yes it was a tough journey. From re learning to swallow, eat, walk and even think. But thankfully the system knew what was was needed to get me back home.

I wish you and Tony the best. It can't be easy going through all of it by yourself.

K M, thank you for sharing this.  It sounds like you were in a true life/death situation, and so glad you pulled through.  I’m sure every member of your medical team worked hard to get you there.

This subject is hard for me to write about because I know it’s an eye-roller for most people, boring or redundant, and I wish we had a separate thread for health-related topics.  I studied a healing science from India (Ayurveda) for 30 years.  I learned it primarily from a Neurosurgeon in San Diego, who taught at Scripps, and I took formal training for 2 years.  In one week-long workshop he related how when he was a primary care physician he learned to look at a patient as a medical problem, run through.the PDF in his mind, and try to match the patient up with the drug and/or surgery.  That all changed when he started to see the human being in all its complexity and to identify disease from the earliest stages… way before Western medicine would identify a disease state.  He became a master at guiding a patient back to health before the problem became a crisis.  

So, imo, we treat the crisis here.  I’m asking ‘what will it take to be strong, healthy and vibrant into old age?”  That’s not a question Kaiser is going to answer.  So, we are really here for emergency medicine, and I am VERY grateful we have that.  See a specialist with a serious problem, they will get right to it.  If I get a snake bite, I’m headed for the ER. 

In Ayurveda a typical doctor visit would focus on diet, sleep, exercise, joy, social connection and the heart.  That visit could take upwards of 2 hours.  Then the patient is prescribed health-supporting recommendations, which may include prescription drugs, but usually not.  Walk into a Kaiser waiting room (or Eisenhower) and it is clear that no one has been given this kind of care.  

In this specific case, Tony went to a Vascular surgeon to get an aneurism checked out, and it was determined he needed to have it repaired in a simple one-hour surgery, with a brief overnight stay.  No follow up necessary.  Since then it’s been a cascade of bad events, one doctor after another, and now he is in a nursing home laying alone in a room.  I’m meeting with the lead Nurse today to discuss the diet.  There are specific guidelines within this state for nutrition in Nursing Homes.  Also, there were probable blood clots in Tony’s legs, for which STAT ultrasound was prescribed, last Thursday.  As of last night, there was no ultrasound.  

I can advocate for Tony.  but who can advocate for the dozens of other residents?  

This is why the situation is getting frightening.

“KYIV, Ukraine—Ukraine fired long-range missiles provided by the U.S. into Russia for the first time Tuesday, days after President Biden gave approval for their use despite Russian threats of retaliation.

Ukraine used the Army Tactical Missile System, known as ATACMS, to strike an ammunition storage facility in Russia’s Bryansk region, a Ukrainian official said.”

“The Kremlin announced that Putin had approved an updated nuclear doctrine — a document that governs how Russia uses its nuclear arsenal — including the declaration that Moscow could unleash a nuclear strike if subject to an attack by a non-nuclear country that has the support of a nuclear state.”

Carl, I may join you in SA.

Li Huwrote:

This is why the situation is getting frightening.

“KYIV, Ukraine—Ukraine fired long-range missiles provided by the U.S. into Russia for the first time Tuesday, days after President Biden gave approval for their use despite Russian threats of retaliation.

Ukraine used the Army Tactical Missile System, known as ATACMS, to strike an ammunition storage facility in Russia’s Bryansk region, a Ukrainian official said.”

“The Kremlin announced that Putin had approved an updated nuclear doctrine — a document that governs how Russia uses its nuclear arsenal — including the declaration that Moscow could unleash a nuclear strike if subject to an attack by a non-nuclear country that has the support of a nuclear state.”

Carl, I may join you in SA.

Relax. ATACMS is a short-range tactical ballistic missile. Until they used up their post-Soviet stockpile, Ukraine has been firing Tochka-Us ( same range/less advanced) into Russia since the beginning of the war. Also, keep in mind that ATACMS have been used in Crimea (part of Russia, according to Russia) for a year now. This is nothing more than saber-rattling, same as what we heard from Russia when Ukraine got GMLRS, Leopards, M1s, F-16s, Scalp/Stormshadow cruise missiles, etc.  

Frank Steinwrote:

Relax. ATACMS is a short-range tactical ballistic missile. Until they used up their post-Soviet stockpile, Ukraine has been firing Tochka-Us ( same range/less advanced) into Russia since the beginning of the war. Also, keep in mind that ATACMS have been used in Crimea (part of Russia, according to Russia) for a year now. This is nothing more than saber-rattling, same as what we heard from Russia when Ukraine got GMLRS, Leopards, M1s, F-16s, Scalp/Stormshadow cruise missiles, etc.  

Yes, Ukraine has already been blowing up huge ammo dumps at further range with their own drones. And it goes right back to Russia committing suicide if they were to use nukes. I think Putin likes to be alive and also has family who likely would like to remain alive.. If a nuke war happens, going to SA is not going to help you much. You will probably only linger a bit more.

philip bone wrote:

On the Beach

Even on this Over 50 thread there are probably a significant number who are too young to remember that movie!!!!

I don't know if I watched the entire film as a kid. The book, however, is relevent to the discusion.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=-c-XPeH_tt4

I’m not good at this you-tube stuff let’s see… 

I don’t think George would be too happy with our Nation right now.

Bone….. he never said anything thing using those words. I know what is burned into my brain, by a few good professors, is blurred due to time and by the fact that while in class I was most likely day dreaming about how to pull the crux on Wheat Thin.

Georg’s message is extremely clear. We would be better off as a nation to remember what he said to us. 

philip bonewrote:

I don't know if I watched the entire film as a kid. The book, however, is relevent to the discusion.

I remember that film.

If the unthinkable happens….
Im heading out to Tahuqitz to take my best shot at Turbo Flange free solo.

Lori…. With all due respect. You guys go to Kaiser. A huge medical conglomerate. One size fits all should be thier motto.
I don’t have any idea what is better though. My Father passed, at 93, a few days before he was to get a knee replacement. He was under the care of “the best Doctors you can get in Southern California…” of heart failure! It seems, to me, that the incentive was to get that knee replacement done at all costs.

Keep fighting for Tony, he needs you.
Oh … I need to ask this. How does Tony like his In-n-Out??? Animal style? Well done fries?

Ward..chasing the grail keeps one motivated! Good luck with it.

Later all 

New Jack last weekend. 

philip bonewrote:

New Jack last weekend. 

Has one actually climbed in New Jack City if one doesn't KEEP TRACK of the routes they've done? Have they been there if they don't even know what CLIFF they're climbing on?

SOME PEOPLE NEED WAY MORE OCD. Sheesh.

Lori, we did it from the stand two years ago at V5 and named it The Monolith.  We worked on the sit last November, and I went back again in February with my brother, but it was brutally cold in the shade.  So this is my third trip working on the sit.  I figured out ways to make formerly stopper moves easier this trip, so I am optimistic, but might not get back until next November.  There is no real crux, just very continuous moves.  It is also at almost 8,000 feet elevation, so it takes a few days for flat landers like me to get used to the altitude. I definitely will be kilter boarding and bouldering a lot this winter.  I also need to keep my endurance training up once ot twice a week, then train power endurance for a few weeks before getting back on it (a weak point this trip) since it is 18 hand moves and well into the anaerobic lactic energy system.

Li Huwrote:

This is why the situation is getting frightening.

“KYIV, Ukraine—Ukraine fired long-range missiles provided by the U.S. into Russia for the first time Tuesday, days after President Biden gave approval for their use despite Russian threats of retaliation.

Ukraine used the Army Tactical Missile System, known as ATACMS, to strike an ammunition storage facility in Russia’s Bryansk region, a Ukrainian official said.”

“The Kremlin announced that Putin had approved an updated nuclear doctrine — a document that governs how Russia uses its nuclear arsenal — including the declaration that Moscow could unleash a nuclear strike if subject to an attack by a non-nuclear country that has the support of a nuclear state.”

Carl, I may join you in SA.

I believe the safest place in a nuclear war is New Zealand based on winds etc. but SA is pretty safe too. 

If I am right , the Ukranian war is pretty much over with. Nonetheless, until a peace accord is agreed upon there will be lots of last minute fighting as the two countries jockey to consolidate their positions. All the players are now getting their quid pro quo ducklings-in-a-row. Here's a flow chart of what I think is going on:

Trump wins election>> Putin signals he is ready to talk>>Zellenskyy is ready to talk but only upon condition that Ukraine gets the long range missiles as insurance>> Biden is told to allow Ukraine to use those long range missles>>Putin comes up with a "new" nuclear strike policy to turn up the temperature and to counter Biden's putative change of policy on the missle use.

The final agreement could take many forms but generally there will be land swaps ,i.e., Ukraine will give up their recent gains in Kursk for some partial regaining of select territory now occupied by the Russians, etc.. 

BTW, If  Zellenskyy and his commanders were gaming this entire scenario several months  back --then the Ukrainian incursion into Kursk is revealed as a truly brilliant stroke , on several levels. In fact , the Ukrainian's war effort in general has been stellar, to say the least; to the same extent the Russian's  has been abysmal.

I’m guessing it’s more like Trump wins election>> removes all US support to Ukraine>> Russia makes final crushing moves>> Putin pats his lapdog Trump on the head>> Putin continues imperialistic agenda>> US eventually gets drawn into wider conflict in Europe.

We’ll just have to see how that plays out…what could go wrong?

Edit: It is so weird to be in a position of calling out the threat of Russia and Putin to those on the Right…

apogeewrote:

I’m guessing it’s more like Trump wins election>> removes all US support to Ukraine>> Russia makes final crushing moves>> Putin pats his lapdog Trump on the head>> Putin continues imperialistic agenda>> US eventually gets drawn into wider conflict in Europe.

We’ll just have to see how that plays out…what could go wrong?

I neglected to mention that the end of this war is beneficial to All concerned except the American Left who regard Orange-man-bad getting any credit whatsoever as being a worse evil than war itself.

All of this deranged talk about  "Putin's lapdog... "  really is desperately silly stuff.  

 " Russia makes final crushing moves"

Oooookay.

Li Huwrote:

“The Kremlin announced that Putin had approved an updated nuclear doctrine — a document that governs how Russia uses its nuclear arsenal — including the declaration that Moscow could unleash a nuclear strike if subject to an attack by a non-nuclear country that has the support of a nuclear state.”

Carl, I may join you in SA.

Just so you know, the Kremlin also announced this "change" in September.  And according to news sources I've heard, Russia has essentially had this policy for years. So it is almost literally "sabre rattling". It is calling attention to an already existing threat, as though it was new, just to make a point. 

GO

GabeOwrote:

Just so you know, the Kremlin also announced this "change" in September.  And according to news sources I've heard, Russia has essentially had this policy for years. So it is almost literally "sabre rattling". It is calling attention to an already existing threat, as though it was new, just to make a point. 

GO

Well ,now the Russians have trotted it back out for the reason I gave in the above-- but in a slightly retreaded version. Also they were probably ticked that this putative policy announcement got very little coverage everywhere but in the European press when it was originally announced.

Alan Rubinwrote:

Even on this Over 50 thread there are probably a significant number who are too young to remember that movie!!!!

Or the book?