Walking a cam up a handcrack?

Just saw a video of someone climbing a crack that started with about 20 feet of thin hands. The whole time, they were walking a single #1 up the crack. It was a little unnerving to me, as when they moved it, they were pulling it out of the crack entirely and then re-placing it higher. It was their first and only piece. The way they did it seemed to suggest it was pretty natural though, so I'm curious if I'm just out of the loop? I know walking cams in OW/chimneys is a thing but is there any reason to do it in a hand crack?

Willow Jordanwrote:any reason to do it in a hand crack?

When you only have two #2s for Generic Crack. Bump cams if you don't have enough gear for the pitch. It takes a little more energy than climbing past the gear and placing new pieces, but if you really want to climb a route that needs a ton of gear you don't have, bumping is an option. 

Bumping your first piece is pretty dumb, in my opinion. And you're spot on that sliding within the crack is perhaps better than fully removing the cam.

"Bumping" is the term I was looking for. My bad.

Bumping pros:

• Carry less gear up a pitch
• Save pieces for harder sections or for the anchor
• Have a piece near you if you blow it
• Reduce rope drag (route direction dependent)

Bumping cons:

• If you blow it mid bump, you're going for a big ride
• If your piece fails, you're going for a big ride

The cons above are pretty unlikely but you can mitigate them in a few ways:

• If you're trying to bump on really hard moves, consider placing another piece and back cleaning the lower one. That way you always have something in. It's more effort but might be safer.
• Alternatively, you can bump two pieces placed very near each other. Again, this is more effort. 
• Extend the piece so you're not pulling up rope every time you bump.
• Try to keep the piece in the crack as you bump. It's lower effort and can be safer.
• Consider leaving enough pieces in to avoid decking in case of an unexpected fall. 
  
  

Willow Jordanwrote:

Just saw a video of someone climbing a crack that started with about 20 feet of thin hands. The whole time, they were walking a single #1 up the crack. It was a little unnerving to me, as when they moved it, they were pulling it out of the crack entirely and then re-placing it higher. It was their first and only piece. The way they did it seemed to suggest it was pretty natural though, so I'm curious if I'm just out of the loop? I know walking cams in OW/chimneys is a thing but is there any reason to do it in a hand crack?

Yea, if you don’t have enough of the right size cam. I would walk 2x but if you’re solid, you’re solid.

If I'm more concerned about protecting a fall from the top of a section of hand crack than from the bottom/middle, I might feel comfortable not placing any gear until I get up to the top. If I want to make that decision a little safer, I might place a cam low on the section and walk it up with me to increase safety for myself on lead. I'm usually placing gear in hand cracks to act as directionals to protect my follower, or to build anchors.

Willow Jordanwrote:

Just saw a video of someone climbing a crack that started with about 20 feet of thin hands. The whole time, they were walking a single #1 up the crack. It was a little unnerving to me, as when they moved it, they were pulling it out of the crack entirely and then re-placing it higher. It was their first and only piece. The way they did it seemed to suggest it was pretty natural though, so I'm curious if I'm just out of the loop? I know walking cams in OW/chimneys is a thing but is there any reason to do it in a hand crack?

That sounds like our boy Timmy's video on Inhibitor at the Red. I also noticed that part and thought, "I wouldn't do it that way." I climbed it the other day and my fat paws didn't feel so secure there, so I bumped 2 cams up that section to always have one protecting me. But his hands must be a fair bit smaller than mine; he seemed quite comfortable in that section so I can't really fault him too much, as long as he understood the risk.

Augie Wagnerwrote:

That sounds like our boy Timmy's video on Inhibitor at the Red. I also noticed that part and thought, "I wouldn't do it that way." I climbed it the other day and my fat paws didn't feel so secure there, so I bumped 2 cams up that section to always have one protecting me. But his hands must be a fair bit smaller than mine; he seemed quite comfortable in that section so I can't really fault him too much, as long as he understood the risk.

That's the one

Just did this friday in a dihedral crack with a 2. Bumped it up like 25’ when my hand jam was solid. Didn’t have a second piece that would fit for a while and the crack got wet right at the top before narrowing to .75 and was seeping wet. Didn’t want to reach the wet thin hands with my number 2 so low, and didn’t want to run it out so much because it was at night and only had one 2 left. This way once I gained the slippery wet crack, I could place a .75 and focus purely on the climbing above and be safe with a small nest of gear. It ain’t always about being safe all the time, its sometimes about anticipating difficulties and other risks, and accepting some risks in easier areas to mitigate risks in more difficult situations 

Bumping cams aka "skating" cams is an appropriate technique at times - HOWEVER!! - it can degrade the interior of a crack. Especially finger cracks and this practice SHOULD BE AVOIDED WHEN POSSIBLE. 

See Sig Sauer and Fingers in a Light Socket.

So what I'm hearing is I should get two link cams and that's the only rack I need. 

OK so this is a very exciting video and I'm grateful for this thread drawing my attention to it. But I was pretty worried about the way he walked the cams up, not just the red cam at the start but also the Number 6 he kept bumping after he got into the offwidth. Seemed like he was really struggling through this part and for a while there it appeared to me if he blew it, and the Number 6 didn't hold or if he was in the process of bumping it, he would hit the ground. When he started bumping the No. 6 and 5 together I felt a lot better. Anyway righteous send and it's hard to tell exactly how high he is so maybe I'm wrong and the stuff below could still catch him. 

SethGwrote:
OK so this is a very exciting video and I'm grateful for this thread drawing my attention to it. But I was pretty worried about the way he walked the cams up, not just the red cam at the start but also the Number 6 he kept bumping after he got into the offwidth. Seemed like he was really struggling through this part and for a while there it appeared to me if he blew it, and the Number 6 didn't hold or if he was in the process of bumping it, he would hit the ground. When he started bumping the No. 6 and 5 together I felt a lot better. Anyway righteous send and it's hard to tell exactly how high he is so maybe I'm wrong and the stuff below could still catch him. 

Offwidth is NOT the same as hand/finger cracks. Bumping cams in offwidth is the norm (basically top rope the whole way). In an offwidth the skating of the cams has less of an impact on the crack itself. 

;) Ok ok, I do not want to outright say that doing that with the number 1 was necessarily a good way to do things, however, I was very very comfortable in this thin hands section and had already tried the route once before so I knew I could handle it no problem. I also only had a double rack and knew I needed another number 1 for the top bit. Obviously, if thin hands aren't your strong suit, bumping is a terrible idea and should be avoided, but in this case, as I said before, I knew I was very comfortable with this section.

As others had mentioned regarding the bumping of the cams in the off-width, If I were to look at this video objectively I'd be more concerned with this section. However, once established in the off-width, there is virtually no way to catastrophically fall out of it. I was struggling yes, but just because of the off-width grungy nature of this section. I felt as though I could've completely relaxed and just slid down into the crack and been fine. I would've preferred to have 2 number 6s but I only had the one 6 and the one 5. Again, I had tried this section on lead before and knew although it was difficult I could handle it and would not just fall out of the section completely.

I also have enormous hands for my body but was still locked into the thin hands section. I <3 crack

Tim Wheatleywrote:

;) Ok ok, I do not want to outright say that doing that with the number 1 was necessarily a good way to do things, however, I was very very comfortable in this thin hands section and had already tried the route once before so I knew I could handle it no problem. I also only had a double rack and knew I needed another number 1 for the top bit. Obviously, if thin hands aren't your strong suit, bumping is a terrible idea and should be avoided, but in this case, as I said before, I knew I was very comfortable with this section.

As others had mentioned regarding the bumping of the cams in the off-width, If I were to look at this video objectively I'd be more concerned with this section. However, once established in the off-width, there is virtually no way to catastrophically fall out of it. I was struggling yes, but just because of the off-width grungy nature of this section. I felt as though I could've completely relaxed and just slid down into the crack and been fine. I would've preferred to have 2 number 6s but I only had the one 6 and the one 5. Again, I had tried this section on lead before and knew although it was difficult I could handle it and would not just fall out of the section completely.

I also have enormous hands for my body but was still locked into the thin hands section. I <3 crack

Thanks for this response! I think the most important thing is that you are aware of the risks and made a reasoned decision as to how to handle them. Great job on the climb, keep sending!

Dr Illogical wrote:

While another one left halfway up the hands section would of course be ideal, you seemed fine and locked in on the first part. Plus, while it would have sucked to fall on the thin hands section, probably wouldn't have been catastrophic due to the low height. Good thinking with saving the other #1 for later. I mostly wished you had had headlamp on for the squeeze. But from what I could see, didn't look like there was any way to really fall out of that gruntfest and your gear beta for the top was dialed. You looked safe. Great send. 

Tape the Velcro on those bd gloves. Love the gloves, hate that cheap velcro closure. 

OH MY GOSH THOSE FUCKING VELCRO STRAPS. I was so over it and ofc now I tape them but man they are so so so shitty like come on?!!!

As i sit here in my office...i can only dream. Truly awesome! Good to see that people are still making the most of their lives!!! Keep up the awesome l-i-v-i-n'