Yosemite Helo Rescue 7/10 - Half Dome ?

I've been thinking about Anna non stop since I learned of this accident. That could easily be any of us, on this route or any other, no matter which side of the retrobolt debate unfolding here. Blink of an eye and our lives are changed forever. 

I'm about double Anna's age and I feel my chest tighten when I reimagine my last 20 years facing the challenges that she'll face in her next 20. Strength and courage to you, Anna. 

I gave at the link and hope everyone sounding off here will as well. Our words here don't really mean shit in the scheme of things, but giving does.

Edit: For the record and in the don't-mean-shit category, I've climbed the route maybe six times. I'm against anyone retrobolting it. fwiw, and to people who haven't climbed it: if a hypothetical retrobolter were stood at the base of p1 and given green light on adding five bolts anywhere on the route, but had no knowledge of Anna's fall, this spot likely isn't where they'd choose to place any of their five bolts. 

Greg Daviswrote:

If we are to believe the detective work and assume she fell at or above the traverse on the 3rd pitch, that's a very reasonable place to fall and there is ample information online and elsewhere that warn of the route finding and hazards 

She fell on the second pitch, not the third. 

Marc801 C wrote:

Seems logical, but factually, we'll never know. 90% of her injuries could have occurred in that first 40'. Recall (see page 1 of the thread) that there was another fall supposedly of 200' resulting in....bruises, scrapes, and "...a broken ankle maybe more..."

Which has been confusing to me since I heard about it. How was she so badly damaged by an 80' slab fall? I can understand a few broken bones from clipping edges and such, but breaking "nearly every bone in her body?" From the shots of where she fell on the MP page, I can't see the features that would have done that. 

Dire Ten wrote:

The force from a drop that distance must have been enough to break bones, regardless of topological features.

Climbing is inherently dangerous because of the heights.

There's no "drop" on slab falls. That area of the climb is low angle enough that you're immediately just sliding on the rock. I can see tumbling down the slab due to the angle of your body when you start falling, but I can't imagine a tumble that continually breaks as many bones as this climber suffered. (To be clear, I'm not questioning  that it happened, just can't comprehend how it happened) 

Unfortunate accident. As always, hard to read about them. The mountains are harsh and unforgiving. They will always be there, the goal is to be there as well.

I believe this accident is one of inexperience and exceeding one's ability. Spotting gear locations on a sea of rock can be difficult. One needs to take the time to locate the next good gear before launching off from one's last good gear. That may not always be possible, as such one learns make a few moves, stop, and take a look around. Repeating until the next good gear is found. Once found and depending on the distance, one's mind or sphincter may relax. (Note: I used the term gear as a generality, the gear could be a bolt, pin, horn, cam/nut placement, etc.). 

Missing a gear location is easy while actually climbing (e.g. moving) as one tends becomes rather focused at the task at hand. Especially when climbing around one's limit. The route leading to the second belay of Snake Dike slants slightly right with the belay anchors are to the left. If one is focused on the dike going by the anchor is certainly possible. And seems to be the case here.

Something else I will note. From the Climbing article it would appear the two arrived from New Zealand 30 July, 31 July drove to Yosemite and climbed Swan Slab, 1 Aug, hiked to the base and Snake Dike. That is a lot of traveling beforehand (jet lag). As such, even for strong 21 year-olds there are going to be some side effects physically and mentally. As such, that too could be a likely contributory factor.

Finally, make sure you have adequate health insurance coverage. Out of network health care coverage in the USA is brutal.

Gina Schaeferwrote:

I see what you're saying, the article's description is a bit confusing because it says more than once that she was climbing ON the dike and I know the leader I climbed with found the traverse to be the crux which is why I speculated what I did.  However, re-reading, you're correct in that the quotes specifically from her belayer sound more like she climbed past the P2 anchor to the right.  Thanks for the insight.  The takeaway remains the same regardless of where she fell though imo.

If that's the case then that's a 5.9 slab variation and is awfully misleading because you can see the bolts which would make sense that one might fall there if they don't climb 5.9. Crappy either way. 

There’s plenty of virgin rock on Half Dome and all over the Valley. The folks talking about retrobolting historical routes need to consider developing a new amazing, safe and well equipped route on HD or somewhere else in the valley instead. I’ll be first in line for sure and spray to my friends about how sick it is. I love safely bolted clip-ups. It’s a shame people would contemplate ruining the sense of adventure for others looking to climb Snake Dike and other well established classic climbs when they could just add more climbs for the community to enjoy. Yosemite is far from tapped out of potential. Get your hand drill out, spend hundreds of dollars and hours bolting a new 1000’ classic with bolts every 10’. I will thank you at least, I’m sure others will too. 

Gumby Kingwrote:

Fuck
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This is why I find the old school ethics of massive runout slab unethical and disturbing (We live in a new climbing age). When I read accidents like this, I curse the old school ethics and wish the "hard men" could reflect on the culture they created and continue to hold on to. I hope one day, some of the leaders in these ethics I disagree with will open to some retro bolting.

Climbing is and always be inherently dangerous, but we can help reduce some of the risks as a community.
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I hope the climber has a good recovery and if you're reading this, please stay positive.

Edit: Dear grumpy armchair climbers who are opposed to reviewing the climbing norms. Please read the climbing.com article and look at her picture before commenting.

This would be a perfect application for “Retro-Development”.

It’s just tragic that the egos of the FA party caused this accident many years later, but I’m sure they had no ill intent, it was just an unintended consequence.

Does anybody know the capability for healthcare systems to collect on medical bills internationally? I’d worked in admitting at a hospital once upon a time and my understanding was that it’s nil, but that could well have changed or been a simplification.

This sport can be cruel, I wish Anna the strength to fight on and find her joy out of this tragedy.

Snake Dike **has been** retro-bolted for safety. And with FA'ist permission.

From Steve Roper in Snake Dike's Supertopo Book:

"... Two years later I grabbed a stranger named John Gibbons and we set off at dawn from a campsite in Little Yosemite, armed with a hefty bolt kit. Ordinarily, taking a bolt kit for an easy second ascent would have made me a laughingstock. But Beck, Bridwell, and Fredericks, feeling that they had created a potential death route for beginners, had given me permission to replace their bad bolts and stick in new ones where I deemed necessary. This was the first time in Valley history that first ascensionists had given someone permission to add bolts to their route..." [1]

What this accident shows is that reasonably safe routes become a lot less safe when you skip bolts and go off-route.

[1] Page 147, supertopo.com/topos/yosemit…

James Jenwrote:

Snake Dike **has been** retro-bolted for safety. And with FA'ist permission.

From Steve Roper in Snake Dike's Supertopo Book:

What this accident shows is that reasonably safe routes become a lot less safe when you skip bolts and go off-route.

[1] Page 147, supertopo.com/topos/yosemit…

Huzzah! This is also the first known incident of Retro-Development!

Austin Donisanwrote:

The description in the report matches up exactly to pitch 2, not 3 as you're describing. The report calls it the "crux pitch," which I think is just confusing/inaccurate.

I have only climbed it one time and lead the entire thing with a guy who had only done 1 day of top roping (he had years of climbing in a gym and was a good climber just was young and didn't have outdoor experience) before going out with me. I climbed directly from the first XX anchor to the next XX anchor on the topo. Is there a reason why people don't do it this way and transverse out to the right? I know the way I did it other than that one lip it is all really smooth slab but is the correct way of doing it less slabby and easier? I also feel like there was another XX anchor at the very bottom of the dike not on the topo. It has been over 10 years since I climbed it so I may just not be remembering everything exactly right.

In understand people saying to bolt it but it will forever change the climb if you do that. I know of alot of climbs I would love to do but I don't have the guts to climb the way they are bolted (I would love to climb mountainproject.com/route/1… but the story about the FA is that it has one bolt for 110ft pitch because he bolted it on lead and it was the only spot he was comfortable enough to put one in) but if you were to bolt it the route mentally would be completely different and never be the same. You accept the risk when you start climbing.

I think one of the biggest differences is climbing for an adventure vs climbing as an everyday activity.

…Says the abiguous keyboard warrior with fake name and no ticks.  Riiiiight.   

Pete Swrote:

…Says the abiguous keyboard warrior with fake name and no ticks.  Riiiiight.   

Was that my post you are referring? I made ticks public if you want to see but they are really outdated because I don't spend alot of time on mountain project anymore and as a software engineer I save my ticks on my own software. This is mostly because my original account got deleted by mistake at some point and I lost alot of the data with it so I remade one for a while to keep some of the data before making it private and making my own software.

Colonel Mustardwrote:

Does anybody know the capability for healthcare systems to collect on medical bills internationally? I’d worked in admitting at a hospital once upon a time and my understanding was that it’s nil, but that could well have changed or been a simplification.

This sport can be cruel, I wish Anna the strength to fight on and find her joy out of this tragedy.

I have an American friend who owes the hospital upwards of 200k from having pneumonia in his lungs for two months without insurance. That was about 8 years ago, and he hasn’t paid a dime of it. He went to trade school for underwater welding while owing that money and now makes around 100k a year. Pretty sure he still doesn’t pay the debt. He said something about the debt just goes away after a certain time frame 

Erik Strandwrote:

I have an American friend who owes the hospital upwards of 200k from having pneumonia in his lungs for two months without insurance. That was about 8 years ago, and he hasn’t paid a dime of it. He went to trade school for underwater welding while owing that money and now makes around 100k a year. Pretty sure he still doesn’t pay the debt. He said something about the debt just goes away after a certain time frame 

Your friend is wrong. The debt doesnt go away unless you file for bankruptcy. He won't go to jail or anything, but it will become increasingly difficult for him to access credit or loans the longer he goes without paying.  Eventually his debt will be sold to a collection agency that will sue him and then garnish his wages for an incredibly long time.  If he's proactive he can negotiate his debt down to probably a pretty small fraction of 200k.

James Jenwrote:

Snake Dike **has been** retro-bolted for safety. And with FA'ist permission.

From Steve Roper in Snake Dike's Supertopo Book:

What this accident shows is that reasonably safe routes become a lot less safe when you skip bolts and go off-route.

[1] Page 147, supertopo.com/topos/yosemit…

It's not a reasonably safe route. The 6 feet she went past the bolt probably added very little to the consequences of her fall.  We're talking about tumbling 60ft vs 80ft.  Not arguing for it to be retrofitted but this is not a reasonable takeaway from this accident.

Edit: Steve Roper's account doesnt make a lot of sense to me.  He says he got tired of bolting after 2 pitches, there's literally 1 bolt on the first 2 pitches.  So it seems like his contribution was replacing the anchors and adding 3 new bolts on a 1000ft climb.  Oh yeah, way more safe now. 

Walker Flynnwrote:

It's not a reasonably safe route. The 6 feet she went past the bolt probably added very little to the consequences of her fall.  We're talking about tumbling 60ft vs 80ft.  Not arguing for it to be retrofitted but this is not a reasonable takeaway from this accident.

I'd argue that it is a reasonably safe route.  It gets climbed all the time, by the new and the experienced alike, and there have been very few accidents, despite the huge runouts.  There's no risk of rockfall or holds breaking off, and despite what happened here, the route finding and communication is very straight forward.

It's a high consequence route, for sure.  

Jason Kimwrote:

I'd argue that it is a reasonably safe route.  It gets climbed all the time, by the new and the experienced alike, and there have been very few accidents, despite the huge runouts.  There's no risk of rockfall or holds breaking off, and despite what happened here, the route finding and communication is very straight forward.

It's a high consequence route, for sure.  

I think our only disagreement is on the semantics of consequence vs safety.  I'd argue that the route finding gets quite weird on the last two pitches but its so easy at that point and you have cracks for pro again so whatever.

Walker Flynnwrote:

Your friend is wrong. The debt doesnt go away unless you file for bankruptcy. He won't go to jail or anything, but it will become increasingly difficult for him to access credit or loans the longer he goes without paying.  Eventually his debt will be sold to a collection agency that will sue him and then garnish his wages for an incredibly long time.  If he's proactive he can negotiate his debt down to probably a pretty small fraction of 200k.

I never paid about $30-40k student loans. I was broke. It went to collections, I received a lot of lawyerly mail, and for 7 years I couldn't answer my phone. But it's now off my credit report and I can answer my phone freely. I have not tried to get any type of large loan since, but my credit report shows my FICO score is "very good" mid 700s and shows no outstanding debts. 

I am NOT recommending this. (And I'm fearful enough about it that I made a throwaway account to post this.) but....

abandon moderation wrote:

I had the same thought; as far as I know they have no way to collect. Once she can get back to NZ, I don't think there's anything preventing her from pretending the bills don't exist.

That said, without insurance, it's possible they're asking for upfront payment for surgeries, etc. I know a hospital will give you emergency care without payment but a lot of required care isn't considered "emergency" care.

Yeah, EMTALA is the law of the land. If they don’t consider her stable to transport home, I wonder how that works that out.

Idle speculation, but I’d hope she and her family don’t start paying anything till they consult with a knowledgeable third party since the hospital will obviously not be transparent.