any devices made FOR top rope solo?

Seems like a reasonable cost to me. If that goes on sale, it'll be even better. Looks like it'll last longer than most devices too. Camp Goblin/Turbolock may end up being the most bomb proof setup of all time, if that is your primary concern, which it is for me.

I was expecting to see the Turbolock at $200+ the way you all were talking about it and considering it was revealed in the rope-rescue realm.  I also expected it actually be larger/heavier than it is.  

Didn't the microtrax come out at around $125?  Easier to find on sale now, but I assume the Turbolock will be in a few months, too.  

I don't see myself picking one up, because I have 2 micros and a ropeman that provide enough options, but the Turbolock does look like a good option if just starting to buy gear for TRS.  

Obviously heavier than most other options, but it certainly appears to be more robust/durable.  The mechanism that locks the teeth open looks harder to accidentally engage than the micro, and the range of rope sizes it works with I imagine is a plus to some folks.  I can see the ability to load and unload without unclipping having benefits, also.

A big question re the Turbolock that can’t be answered till someone tries it, is how much drag there is on the rope. MT, Goblin, R’nL, etc. have very little drag and you hardly know they’re there.

No devices actually made for TR solo. Lots of devices that can be used, against manufacturers recommendation... even if they provide pics for the people who will do it anyways (thanks Petzl!).

I seem to remember the Silent Partner manual stating that it could be used, but it was not a good experience. That would also fall within against manufacturers recommendation. Maybe I am mis-remembering.

As there is not real standard for TRS, there are no devices... unless you consider a gym autobelay to be similar to TRS... A real TRS certified device would have a pretty high resistance to desheathing or cutting a rope, that eliminates microtrax, lift, etc... would be able to seamlessly transition to lower under load, would feed up and down a lightly weighted or better even a not weighted rope, would have been specifically engineered with TRS in mind on static and dynamic ropes, not merely larger industrial static ropes, etc... TAZ is probably about the closest currently to ideal... but from what I understand lowering is not as smooth as would be desired, ratings are for static rope, etc...

Think only the soloist is made for TRS. That said love the goblin: catches well, takes in place, and let's you down climb. 

Re: backup knots - I only use them if climbing with 1 device. I skip them on trs with dual devices

Re: turbolock- seems like a bigger version of the roll n lock at microtrax prices

Desert Rock Sportswrote:

TAZ is probably about the closest currently to ideal... but from what I understand lowering is not as smooth as would be desired, ratings are for static rope, etc...

Lowering/rappelling with the Taz is really fine.
It is rated for dynamic rope. The early Taz Lov2 versions don't officially have the rating printed the device, but the later Taz Lov2s and Lov3s do. The dynamic rope is not for all of its functions, but that's academic as we are using the device in a way it is not tested for anyway. 

Desert Rock Sportswrote:

No devices actually made for TR solo.

Whats the croll made for then? Whats TR soloing anyways....you mean ascending a rope?

abe rwrote: ...you mean ascending a rope?

Thats a great point. In that respect, there are a lot of TRS devices. Side note, I always wondered why Camp called their basic ascender the Camp Solo.

So I got my hands on a Camp Turbolock.

It's a very cool device, but I think of it more as an improvement on a Petzl Pro Traxion--same size pulley, has a beckett hole, etc. It's lighter and smaller than a Pro Traxion and I think more elegant. Also no chance of the device opening up like the Pro Traxion (at least the old version).

I'm going to try it with my Taz Lov 3 for TRS, but I think the disadvantages are a) it is significantly heavier than a micro traxion and b) the rope can certainly disengage the cam, I think far more easily than an MT. The rope basically runs over the lockout lever when set up for TRS. As for whether this actually happens in practice with a Taz above it--hard to say. Disabling the cam lockout or making the button smaller seem like potential options. It does have even less friction moving up the rope than an MT, which is cool.

There are devices made for this, they are heavily tested and approved by industry under the EN 353-2 standard, the petzl ASAP among others fit in this category. As long as you use a certified rope to go along with it you're golden, so golden that in industry its perfectly acceptable that it is your primary device (no backup needed). 

Camp lift on top, no teeth, microT as backup, seems to work pretty well if you want to save $$$. Nowhere near as cool as Taz backed by microT tho. 

Grandwall uAscend is very similar to the Lift but feeds easier because the spring is not as strong so it causes less friction. About the same price via: verticallstore.com/GRANDWAL… $58.95 ca ($45.62 us)

Ryan Franzwrote:

So I got my hands on a Camp Turbolock.

It's a very cool device, but I think of it more as an improvement on a Petzl Pro Traxion--same size pulley, has a beckett hole, etc. It's lighter and smaller than a Pro Traxion and I think more elegant. Also no chance of the device opening up like the Pro Traxion (at least the old version).

I'm going to try it with my Taz Lov 3 for TRS, but I think the disadvantages are a) it is significantly heavier than a micro traxion and b) the rope can certainly disengage the cam, I think far more easily than an MT. The rope basically runs over the lockout lever when set up for TRS. As for whether this actually happens in practice with a Taz above it--hard to say. Disabling the cam lockout or making the button smaller seem like potential options. It does have even less friction moving up the rope than an MT, which is cool.

I've been very interested in this device for sometime now, so thanks for posting this! It's promising that it runs so smoothly on the rope. I'd be grateful to hear more about the locking mechanism once you done some testing. I would use it to backup my Taz Lov2. It could be used as a primary or a backup I'm sure. 

Can it be loaded & unloaded without unclipping?

How easy is it to raise the cam with the button?

Could one rappel with it attached without the cam accidentally reingaging?

Be nice to hear about accidental open of the cam too, because that wouldn't be ideal.

Any photos would be greatly appreciated.

Noel Z, did you get around to reevaluating the "Roll'N'Lock collecting dust in the back of a drawer" when paired with the Grivel Clepsydra S?  I ask because these devices are superficially similar.

Mike JF wrote:

I just use a gri gri haha

This is probably heresy to say, but I had a neighbor and friend of mine in Yosemite, fantastic climber. All of the routes he could set up TRS he would just climb with a grigri or microt and no backup and hes still out crushing it. My point being, be as a safe as possible always, but used/inspected properly the devices we already have are pretty damn bomb at least in terms of TRS. If you wanna get into LRS, that is a different story.

From the instruction manual for the older version (Petzl B08) of their Basic Ascender. A couple years ago they changed the design so it's more like the Croll, and AFAIK Petzl doesn't condone its use for TRS.  On the bright side, you can still buy the same type of device from Climbing Technology (CT) and other manufacturers. It's been my main device for >20 years.

Webfootwrote:

Noel Z, did you get around to reevaluating the "Roll'N'Lock collecting dust in the back of a drawer" when paired with the Grivel Clepsydra S?  I ask because these devices are superficially similar.

My Roll'N'Lock is still in the drawer. It not so much that I don't recognise its pedigree, but more that I just have too much gear. I can imagine that it will pair very well with that Grivel Clepsydra S and that your advise is solid. The Roll'N'Lock needs a suitable carabiner, in my opinion.
I have found this carabiner AustriaAlpin Ovalock, which pairs well with just about any device I've tried. It's oval, has a fat ANSI style gate and has split chamber to keep the device and connection point apart. I have bee told it's hard to get outside Europe though.

Sorry to practice some necromancy here...

Got my hands on a CAMP Turbolock. In TR Solo application there is a pretty easy to replicate failure mode which would happen if the pulley side got trapped/pushed down low while vertical progress is made or rope is pulled through. IE slab, roof pull, beach whale, etc...

Pulley side restricted, note lockout button touched:

Lockout button engaged due to vertical movement while pulley side restricted:

Locked out:

Potential janky "fix" is to have a chest harness to keep pulley end higher than carabiner end so rope wouldn't move to touch button... but would put a bend in rope making it feed not quite as smooth.

Elastic as above would not be sufficient. Even a chest harness may not fully be able to prevent this failure mode if one were to do enough of a crunch / forward bend...

So I'd absolutely not recommend it for TRS unless you file off the lockout catch or otherwise prevent it from being able to be locked out. I personally think that a slim 3D printed then sintered metal powder insert that prevents depression of the lockout button with magnet to retain its installationin the cam (assuming magnetic metal of the cam) could be cool.

Have vids, but a pain to try to upload and share them without making an account somewhere and I think the pics are sufficient explanation of the failure mode.

Potential mod to "fix" would be to add a metal rod in the location of the sharpie dot, such that neither cam function nor button function is restricted. The post would prevent the rope from touching the button, but would be a surface that the rope would rub against adding friction. A pin and rolling sleeve setup could improve that, but now your getting into quite of bit of engineering when there are other devices without this issue.

Edit: or the obvious solution to file off the catch, but then you lose nice functionality for hauling.

An oval (and probably several other viable setups with cord and a suitable piece of metal tubing or something) can be used to prevent the rope from being able to touch the cam. Kinda janky.