Advice from Alpine Climbers

I am looking for insight/advice from climbers who have experience in the Central Alaska Range. Let me know if willing to chat!

There was an ask for specific questions, so here are some to get discussion started:
- What are some of the most important rescue/contingency skills have you cultivated over the years? (i.e. specific components of rope rescue, "what to do if" situations)

- What advice would you give yourself earlier on

- Any resources anyone would recommend re weather? Obviously weather reports/altimeters, but any additional insight would be helpful.

- Any Alaska-specific advice, especially for anyone w experience climbing in the Central Alaska range

Is there a question? Maybe the discussion can be public so others can benefit from any ideas that come up.

Hi Molly, I would suggest doing some waterfall ice climbing - it helps a lot to dial in your technique for steep sections. I'm a beginner alpine climber myself and have a lot to learn, but I think the only way to build mountain sense is to spend time in the mountains. Keep it up!

I can't speak much to your specific questions (except just getting out for mileage/experience, as you already noted). However, if you don't already have a copy of Freedom of the Hills, it will help introduce you to some of the material and concepts required to succeed. Between that and mileage, you will be able to go a long way. Maybe a class on self-rescue if you don't already know how to do things like escaping the belay.

That being said, I could also probably benefit from any advice here so a public discussion would be welcome!

You asked:
If anyone has any advice on the following, would love to hear it!
- What are some of the most important rescue/contingency skills have you cultivated over the years? (i.e. specific components of rope rescue, "what to do if" situations)
Learn how to rescue a leader who has fallen more than 1/2 a ropelength "out" on a pitch on a multi-pitch climb and is injured . 

- What advice would you give yourself as you started out?
1) Learn to Trad climb before learning sport climbing. Route finding is key. Learn to look at the next 30-50 feet of rock and assess it's approximate grade, or at least whether you can lead it. Look at a cliff and "read" where the fault lines lie.  
2) Learn a little aid climbing.  You might never aspire to climbing the Nose, but knowing how to aid over an overhang can open up a lot of climbing. 
3) Find a good mentor...ideally one that will be able to judge when to "let you go off" on your own.
4) If you don't get yourself  in at least some "hot water" you're probably too conservative.  Learn from your  mistakes. 

- How did you learn to read weather? Any resources anyone would recommend? Obviously weather reports/altimeters, but any insight into generally being able to read conditions would be helpful.
There are lots of good pamphlets to books on learning to "read" the clouds to determine when the weather is likely to change. Use whatever resources are available, and don;t overlook the "locals", ASK...In each area there are usually certain things it's good to know (like in NH on Cannon, the cliff totally hides most oncoming thunderstorms; on Whitehorse & Cathedral if the weather is clouding over, once the clouds hit the top of Mt Kearsarge (across the valley) you usually have only 1/2 hr to 45 min. before it starts to rain.)

- Any advice on cultivating strong navigation skills?
If you want to get someplace to climb, and there's no trail you sort of need these. While GPS and all the new stuff is great, knowing how to use a map and compass to get where you're going, and to know where you are, is still a very good thing to have  in your "bag of tricks".  With visibility about 1/2 a rope length in the fog, I once had to follow a compass bearing for 2 miles across a glacier to get back to camp. I put my partner in front with all the "iron" (it was the days of pitons) and walked behind so that she was just barely visible, directing her left or right to keep us straight and on course. 

- Beyond just gaining mileage/experience, do you have any specific tips for gaining "mountain sense"?
As the great photographer Capa said " F-8 and be there".  Just Do.

- Any Alaska-specific advice?
If they cut Alaska in half and made two states, Texas would be the 3rd largest state. 

Molly M wrote: 
If anyone has any advice on the following, would love to hear it!
- What are some of the most important rescue/contingency skills have you cultivated over the years? (i.e. specific components of rope rescue, "what to do if" situations) Crevasse rescue / self crevasse rescue/ let a friend know of your plans / Never lose your cool / Stop, breath, think.
- What advice would you give yourself as you started out? Work on your cardio / Don't put all these useless heavy crap in your backpack, you re gonna regret it!  Your climbing partner is here for you, rely on him/her like he/she can rely on you / There is no such things as too much communication between partners / This objective is uber cool yes, but is it worth your life?
- How did you learn to read weather? Any resources anyone would recommend? Obviously weather reports/altimeters, but any insight into generally being able to read conditions would be helpful. No special advice, ABC watch, checking websites before going, knowing the weather of the week prior, asking locals, guides offices and SAR team always help
- Any advice on cultivating strong navigation skills? For me this is the most difficult part of alpine climbing, I wasted countless hours looking for routes (even with the guidebook in hands!), so maybe my advice could be: be ready to get lost and don't go crazy over it (which also means you need to plan ahead and have enough margine, in terms of time, to get lost)
- Beyond just gaining mileage/experience, do you have any specific tips for gaining "mountain sense"? Indeed, mileage will be the most helpful. As far as techniques goes, when you arrive to the alpine with a strong hiking/sport climbing, ski, ski touring, and some trad climbing background you already have a lot in your hands to know what to do. You will also quickly realized that mountaineering is a lot of  (easy-ich, at first) soloing 
- Any Alaska-specific advice? nope, never been there

A couple of thought (in bold letters) following your questions. Have (safe) fun in the alpine!

Winter backpacking and mountaineering in the Sierra, Rockies, Cascades will provide crucial preparation.

First, you're asking the wrong questions. Here are some examples of the more important questions

Q1) how do I avoid getting killed by rock fall, ice fall or slab avalanches.
A1) I don't know, luck helps, but take an AIARE class. Maybe others have better ideas?

Q2) How do you build a life/develop a lifestyle that (a) gives you the money and health insurance you need to climb, (b) gives you the time you need for traveling and climbing in remote ranges, and (c) develop and maintain real friendships with your climbing partners that go beyond simply climbing buddies (this is essential if you plan to convince them to travel to the ends of the earth and hole up with you for 2-8 weeks at a time). You need all three, but most adults only get to pick 2 of the 3.
A2) again, I don't know, but some ideas: become a school teacher (summers off) and/or marry a climber. I didn't do either, but I've seen both play out often enough that I think there's something to be said for it. And don't take this as some kind of gendered comment. All the school teacher alpine climbers I know are men, and for every woman I know who married a climber, there's a man who married a climber.

Now for your questions,

Molly M wrote: I am looking for insight/advice from experienced alpine climbers (especially those who have experience in California or Alaska). I've done mountaineering (mainly in Cascades) for several years and recently started leading alpine ice (~WI2+) and trad (~5.6). I am based in SF so Sierras are my main training ground. My ultimate goals are moderate alpine ice/steep snow routes in the Alaska Range (i.e. Mt Frances SE Ridge). Alpine can be a tough world to navigate (particularly as a female) -- I would love any insight/advice from experienced folks and/or mentors who'd be willing to chat with me. Please feel free to message me directly!

If anyone has any advice on the following, would love to hear it!
- What are some of the most important rescue/contingency skills have you cultivated over the years? (i.e. specific components of rope rescue, "what to do if" situations)

Being prepared for an unplanned bivy.

- What advice would you give yourself as you started out?

Get competent on multipitch trad rock to 5.8 and ice to WI4. Then go to the Alps and take advantage of the cable cars to get in lots of mileage on technical alpine terrain fast.

Cut living expenses by 30%. Unless you move to Boulder, Canmore or Chamonix (see next point). Then 20% should suffice.

Move somewhere with a strong climbing community.

Join the American Alpine Club. Lots of benefits, some especially helpful for climbers who are just getting started.

- How did you learn to read weather? Any resources anyone would recommend? Obviously weather reports/altimeters, but any insight into generally being able to read conditions would be helpful.

Sign up for simuawps, or download zygrib or a similar program. Inspect GFS and ECMWF models of 500mb isobars at continental scales, and read weather.gov forecast discussions for areas of interest. Cross reference the forecast discussion with the model graphics. Watch weather on the ground and learn how it corresponds to those pressure systems.

Spend time multipitch rock climbing or peak bagging during thunderstorm season. Fear learning is powerful. It'll teach you the subtle cues that indicate an incoming storm. The kind you detect using your nose and skin rather than your eyes, because you can't usually see what's coming at you.

- Any advice on cultivating strong navigation skills?

Don't fuck around with white outs. Get a GPS tracker with built in downloadable topo maps, and be prepared to wait them out rather than fall into a crevasse. Ease into glacier travel and pay attention to where the crevasses form. Otherwise don't stress navigation. Make collective decisions with your team (you have to trust each other, which can often feel like an act of faith when you can't come to agreement, which is why it's so important to actually have a meaningful non-climbing relationship with the other person). The average decision of a collection of idiots is often better than the decision of a single expert.

- Beyond just gaining mileage/experience, do you have any specific tips for gaining "mountain sense"?

Travel widely, to many different ranges, but pick a few and specialize there. Both breadth and depth are important. Different ranges have different characteristics, but you can't learn more than superficial ones if you don't see them evolve over the seasons and years. Climate change adds an extra twist to this. You'll learn how to factor this in  by studying a single range frequently over multiple years across all it seasons.

- Any Alaska-specific advice?

No.

There’s not really any secrets to it, just experience. Get comfortable with camping in the cold and then go up there and try something with a partner you like and trust. You’ll either love It or not. Desire is the most important quality to possess.

Norm Larson wrote: There’s not really any secrets to it, just experience. Get comfortable with camping in the cold and then go up there and try something with a partner you like and trust. You’ll either love It or not. Desire is the most important quality to possess.

There are definitely secretes. For instance. 'alpinism' is really a deceptive term for trad mixed climbing, because nobody wants to admit to the latter, it's just weird and gross, while "alpinism" sounds romantic and lofty.

The Sierra Nevada is not very alpine. Winter mountaineering there is good experience for extended snow camping that is necessary in Alaska, and if you camp up high you'll get a sense of how you do at altitude. But it's sunny and mild California compared with anywhere else.
Steve House has posted some great stuff. Try this link and surf around from it: https://www.uphillathlete.com/fail-climb-descend-well/
"Success as an alpinist is dying of old age, in bed, surrounded by loved ones. Success on a climb is going up, making good decisions, and coming back down safely." Note, nothing about finishing a route or summit. Just get back mostly intact. Second priority is, have fun or at least a fulfilling collective experience. If you totally have that worldview in your non-alpine climbing, you're set up really well already.
Only the very most badass partner or party can get someone back who has had a big fall in truly alpine settings, unless it's the Alps which buzzes with helicopters. So learn how to not fall in sketch-land and have partners who also don't.
Crevasse rescue and better still learning how to travel amongst them without falling in is an essential skill. Nowhere really to practice that in California. Crevasses exist, as a species, but you need to go further afield to master that. There's some good guidance on reading a glacier in Freedom of the Hills and other sources, but really, what's needed is mostly just logging many days walking on them, observantly.
Though it's true that anyone (e.g. Alex Lowe) can get obliterated by a big slide of something, training yourself to be out of the line of fire of stones and small slides at all times that it's possible is a vital survival skill. Every belay, or pause while leading, or rest stop, and especially bivy sites.
I've never been to Alaska, but it sounds like the weather is a whole step worse than just about anywhere else but Patagonia or the Alps when something bad rolls in. Maybe Poland. Those Polish climbers seem to be cheerful in weather that most of us wouldn't go out in.

This may sound weird, and “new agey”  but one thing you can start practicing now, and which applies to developing a “mountain sense” as well as natural navigation skills is to develop your 3D mind and allow it to fill and absorb your surroundings wherever you are.   Ween yourself as much as possible from using your phone to navigate anywhere - even for mundane daily travels around home.  Practice doing things with minimal or no light almost like a blind person.  You want to be a like a proverbial “Zen master” essentially.  

Bogdan P wrote:

There are definitely secretes. For instance. 'alpinism' is really a deceptive term for trad mixed climbing, because nobody wants to admit to the latter, it's just weird and gross, while "alpinism" sounds romantic and lofty.

Secrets come from experience grasshopper. 

I don’t wanna know where “secretes” come from however...

Mark Pilate wrote: This may sound weird, and “new agey”  but one thing you can start practicing now, and which applies to developing a “mountain sense” as well as natural navigation skills is to develop your 3D mind and allow it to fill and absorb your surroundings wherever you are.   Ween yourself as much as possible from using your phone to navigate anywhere - even for mundane daily travels around home.  Practice doing things with minimal or no light almost like a blind person.  You want to be a like a proverbial “Zen master” essentially.  

A big thumbs up for this!   Too many people these days depend on some tech gadget to keep them safe... and it has the opposite effect.    

 If you can get “in tune” and hone your sixth sense within your present surroundings, it readily transfers and gets even sharper with experience, in the mountains. 
The mountain will send you tons of important subliminal messages.  You want to be able to receive them. 

                      LOST
 
   "Stand still. The trees ahead and bushes beside you
    Are not lost. Wherever you are is called Here,
    And you must treat it as a powerful stranger,
    Must ask permission to know it and be known.
    The forest breathes. Listen. It answers,
    I have made this place around you,
    If you leave it you may come back again, saying Here.
 
    No two trees are the same to Raven.
    No two branches are the same to Wren.
    If what a tree or a bush does is lost on you,
    You are surely lost. Stand still. The forest knows
    Where you are. You must let it find you."
   
Translated by David Wagoner, chair of poetry at the University of Washington. This is a Native American poem, that has been handed down from generation to generation, in the form of a story.

And oh, several people have mentioned getting experience, which means making mistakes and hopefully getting out of the situation intact.  Experience is what you get when you don't get what you wanted.

Get Steve House's book Training for the New Alpinism. It reads like a text book but its fantastic. Also, watch his series of Alpine Principles videos. These are no substitute for a real mentor, but they will give you some ideas of what to focus and work on.

Also, learn how you body reacts to extended activity. Go for a trail run/hike, or link up a bunch of easy climbs. Its better if the activity goes on through the night. Pay attention to how you feel physically and mentally after 12, 18, 24 hours, etc. Learn how stay hydrated and keep your calorie intake up during these trials. Make sure the food you eat mimics what you would eat on a longer alpine route. 

Here's a different point of view. This is from a little book called "The Organization of an Alaskan Expedition" by Boyd Everett (1933-1969). It was published back in 1966 but in many respects it's still relevant. But bear in mind that he died in an avalanche in the Himalayas.

"Rarely do pure technical difficulties exceed the technical competence of an Alaskan expedition. For those expeditions that are not successful the two most common scapegoats are bad weather and avalanche dangers. Almost without exception, however, the real causes of expedition failure are bad group morale or bad organization. When either morale or organization break down, it is certainly convenient to use a stretch of bad weather or a temporary objective hazard as an excuse to call the project off. The contingency of bad weather can be allowed for and permanent hazards, such as hanging glaciers, should be visible in advance and thus avoidable...

In choosing an Alaskan route it is likely that most climbers will be unnecessarily conservative in estimating what they can do technically. The size of most Alaskan mountains seems to make even good technical climbers more cautious. Caution is in practice warranted when evaluating possible avalanche hazards but pure technical problems often work out more easily than anticipated... the writer recommends that climbers of reasonable technical competency and mountain experience be fairly aggressive in choosing routes - recognizing, however, that they may be "psyched out" at first by the size of the mountain and that objective hazards must be carefully evaluated...

Whereas climbers often overestimate the pure technical difficulty of a route there is a definite tendency to underestimate how many days a route will take to climb. Climbers accustomed to looking at 2,000' and 3,000' vertical rises in the Canadian Rockies will have difficulty gauging distances when they look at photos of Alaska's 8,000' to 10,000' (and larger) vertical rises. Even when the mountains are properly evaluated for size, climbers usually overestimate their ability to move in them... For many climbers there are psychological barriers... A not bad rule of thumb in estimating the length of an expedition is to calculate the number of climbing days the route ought to require under good conditions and multiply by two..." 

Good questions!  First thing I'd suggest is to bump up the level of your ice and rock skills.  Get comfy on WI3 and 5.8 by being able to climb a bit harder.  That way, you'll more quickly dispense with "easy" ground at the WI and low fifth class levels...faster, safer.

What are some of the most important rescue/contingency skills have you cultivated over the years? (i.e. specific components of rope rescue, "what to do if" situations)

I benefit from having a small tool box so all the Z by C hauling stuff might work, but, really, anchoring skills mostly.  Snow, ice and rock.  Build anchors.  Gobs of them.  Doesn't matter how many hauling systems you know if you don't have a solid anchor.

Get some basic crevasse rescue skills.  Mostly avoiding the touch (instead of touching the void...ha ha).  Learn how to read glacier terrain and avoid snow bridges, or, anchor solid then cross.

What advice would you give yourself as you started out?

Find some partners and do trips.  Like minded, safe folks.  Learn to be a good climbing partner.  Show up.  Cull the folks that don't.

How did you learn to read weather? Any resources anyone would recommend? Obviously weather reports/altimeters, but any insight into generally being able to read conditions would be helpful.

Ongoing, continual process.  Get a few books on mountain weather.  Practice every time you go outside.  Get the forecast, see what really happens, make some mental notes.  

Learn the different cloud formations and what they mean.  Get an idea of wind direction, speed, precip rates both normal and from changes in weather patterns and what those changes could mean if you're in the hills.  Especially related to snowfall and avalanches.

Any advice on cultivating strong navigation skills?

As a kid, I was kinda taken by orienteering.  Lot of time outside reading a topo map and using a compass.  I play "guess the direction" all the time, still.  Then check with a compass.  Get a compass.  Learn how water courses and drainages work with regard to topography and navigation.

Kinda never understood how folks, either early at sunrise or at sunset, can't figure out which direction is East or West.  Should be kinda intuitive.  Doesn't hurt to know where the north star is and to be able to orient by starlight.

Spend some time off trail going from point a to b with a map and compass, cross country.

Beyond just gaining mileage/experience, do you have any specific tips for gaining "mountain sense"?

Besides time in the saddle, try to pay attention with a purpose.  Look at terrain options as safe versus not as safe.  Easy versus unnecessarily hard.

Any Alaska-specific advice? 

Find a mentor and go do a trip.  Or, a like minded partner.  Plan a trip and go.

Edit to add:  learn to enjoy winter camping out of a backpack. 

Anyhow...random thoughts...good luck in your journey!

People. Real, live people with TONS of experience are the resource to seek out. Anyone who really knows a place or the skill you want to learn. The best CPR class I ever took was from the fire department. Guy who actually did CPR, not just teach it, BITD before AEDs.

Hunt out classes from SAR groups, if they start up again, consider a guide, etc. Go outside of climbing, too. Backcountry pilots need weather info for the same places, and it's a much bigger pool than climbers, more info out there.

Last though? Be very real about your self. Push your limits, as Dalin suggested, but safely. Most of my mountaineer types here are shut out on trips pretty stinking often. Are you truly good to have that happen? Back off early? Don't push past that first mistake and make more? Spending many hours hiking in and up (find out how you do with elevation!)....and finding the ice isn't in after all. Going to Alaska...and spending a week sitting in a tent with your bros. Training, hard, for that bucket list trip to Denali....in 2020. Everything canceled.

Okay, but it's subtle sometimes too. That sixth sense others mentioned? You really need to cultivate and listen. My friends are (mostly) alive and well. Mostly. There's that also. Are you okay with living through a disaster? It's a real question. I don't know anyone who hasn't either lost friends or had really close calls.

And no, I don't pursue the big stuff. Entirely out of my skill set. It just happens to be what the people I care most about are passionate about.

I'm also often the one trusted with the call-in info...who gets to sweat it out waiting.

Best, Helen

 Mileage and experience. Gently tap and kick rocks to make sure they are solid, it can be a game of Jenga out there.
Don’t be afraid to turn back if you’re not feeling it, don’t let your ego get you in trouble. 

Some Sierra weather tidbits:

• Stable weather can last for weeks. But summer can also bring monsoon periods with severe, potentially deadly thunderstorms. These can also last for weeks. Or they can only last for a day or so. In monsoon periods, the moisture often comes from the southeast. This is the opposite of the "normal" east to west flow.
• puffy clouds before 9am usually mean trouble by 2pm
• Use the NOAA point forecasts for where you want to go. The forecast discussion is very helpful for general trends but they often don't discuss what will happen above the highest roads. 
• If NOAA says there is a 20% of thunderstorms, that's really a 50% chance. If it says 30% or greater, consider it a 100% chance. Be in a safe place by noon in both scenarios
• If you see building, darkening thunderheads, it's probably already too late. They will not "miss you." Sometimes the clouds appear to be moving but really they're growing. They'll sit right on top of the highest peaks-right where you want to climb.

These may or may not apply to any other thunderstorm-prone areas.