New and Experienced Climbers over 50 #7

rgold, could you label those climbs in the pics?

Bradley

the museum

the museum wrote: rgold, could you label those climbs in the pics?

I added some captions.

Carl Schneider wrote:

Sometimes I think I should just close my eyes, scream like a little bitch and fall FFS.

I think one thing we all need to ask ourselves is, "Why is it that I don't want to fall right now? Is it because I'm in a 'no fall zone'?  Don't trust my gear? Don't trust my belayer?  Wearing brand new snazzy Patagonia pants I don't want scuffed? Want to do this route clean as I'm not sure I have the energy to give it another whirl today and lead it cleanly?"

I think, really, the only valid reason of those above is the first; being in a no fall zone, i.e if I fall now I'll hit the deck, a ledge, etc.  I think IDENTIFYING a no fall zone is critical to being able to safely lead a sports route and that and ALSO knowing if the gear you've placed is any good is critical to leading trad.

Having said all that, like I said, I'm a namby pamby who hates falling, so in answer to your question, for me, no, the trepidation never leaves...

   This evokes an image, Carl.    

As always, I SO appreciate the words of support and wisdom coming from this forum.  I've said all along that I didn't think I had any ego in this... I just wanted to enjoy climbing, and do the best I could with this body, at this age, and with some limitations.  I'm pretty sure I'm wrong about not having an ego after all.  That word 'can't' is a fighting word for me, especially now,  but it can take the joy out of the journey.  And also, I want to get out and play with the boys and girls, so when there's a wall, I want to punch through.  

A wise friend suggested off line that I mock lead everything in sight.  (paraphrased   )  This probably solves the problem for now.  There is no harm in taking a lead rope up with me whenever the route is not too crazy...   in time the answers will appear.  Yesterday at the gym Ryan said "Now we can talk about climbing in ways we couldn't before because you just weren't there yet. Now you have enough experience that you can understand what it is we want to do."

It's amazing to me how this climbing journey unfolds just about on schedule for everyone, and in a predictable order.  Can't rush it, and can't force it.  One day, the next step is just there.  

Lori, if it makes you feel better, last year I seriously down-climbed more leads than I finished. I call it my "backing off" season. 

I think I already mentioned this, like 3470 posts ago, but I did a Warriors Way falling clinic last year. It was a revelation. The general thing in climbing is don’t fall. Sport climbers generally just get used to it. Arno’s idea is pretty simple, in essence. Falling is part of climbing, so learn how to do it with intention. It applies to top roping as much as leading. Since you are so engaged with your state of being while climbing, I think you’d love it.
I was shocked how much I got out of it, even after 20 years of climbing. I believe your choice to lead (or not) would be served by developing better judgement and skills with respect to falling.
Lastly, every thing I’ve ever read about climbing past 50 says the same thing: Don’t get injured. Falling skills would certainly help with that.

Victor K wrote: I think I already mentioned this, like 3470 posts ago, but I did a Warriors Way falling clinic last year. It was a revelation. The general thing in climbing is don’t fall. Sport climbers generally just get used to it. Arno’s idea is pretty simple, in essence. Falling is part of climbing, so learn how to do it with intention. It applies to top roping as much as leading. Since you are so engaged with your state of being while climbing, I think you’d love it.
I was shocked how much I got out of it, even after 20 years of climbing. I believe your choice to lead (or not) would be served by developing better judgement and skills with respect to falling.
Lastly, every thing I’ve ever read about climbing past 50 says the same thing: Don’t get injured. Falling skills would certainly help with that.

Victor, thanks for writing. I am surprised how many people totally disagree with Arno... but maybe they don't really understand what he does.  I've read both his books, and heard about his classes.  It's nice to get your feedback.

This falling thing is a real problem for anyone who has coached me.  I feel like THEY need some Xanax before we go out.     I get why they say "Don't fall"... but, it would be nice to have some skills. Otherwise, I'm hanging on for dear life and have no idea what to expect if I let go or trip up.  It would be nice to have some practice.  Even indoors, I can see that Ryan has his limits.  I felt like I needed to soothe him before I took the one intentional fall, it went just fine... he looked exhausted.      I really don't think it's me with the problem.

I get that this doesn't count as a 'fall', but three times on top rope I did fall on a traverse, and took a large, fast and careening pendulum swing into adjacent rocks.  There were a few bumps along the way, I hit my noggin'... but had a helmet on.  Maybe a 20 foot swing, no big deal.  

Whether or not you want to engage with his philosophical framework, the falling clinic is actual skills training that you can practice, which I do. I’ve been climbing about 2 letter grades harder over the course of the last year, mostly due to a better climbing head that resulted from this practice. In some ways, I think it’s better for people like us, who started as middle aged people. Our brains don’t have the plasticity of young minds, the grooves are deep..

Victor K wrote: Whether or not you want to engage with his philosophical framework, the falling clinic is actual skills training that you can practice, which I do. I’ve been climbing about 2 letter grades harder over the course of the last year, mostly due to a better climbing head that resulted from this practice. In some ways, I think it’s better for people like us, who started as middle aged people. Our brains don’t have the plasticity of young minds, the grooves are deep..

I love it.  I have no idea how much of climbing is a head thing... but I'm sure aware of how it all factors in.  I wonder if he will do a workshop around here anytime soon.  In the meantime, I'll re-read the falling chapters of his book.  
I was a big fan of Carlos Castaneda, where he got a lot of his material, so I do entirely appreciate his philosophical framework.  

On a related note, I really soaked up his advice on 'letting go'.  In one exercise he suggests you recall the last thought/s you had before you let go during a climb... not 'fell' but let go.  Even in the gym I'm seeing how often it isn't a fall, but a giving up or letting go.  The  thoughts just preceding that are usually ones of surrender--something negative--"I can't".  Those thoughts are important!  

Alicia Sokolowski wrote: Lori, if it makes you feel better, last year I seriously down-climbed more leads than I finished. I call it my "backing off" season. 

Alicia

I remember one of the times that I ways leading the Dangler at the Gunks, Jean tells me to take off some of my lead gear to make the climb a little easier. I did not listen to her. I did take 2 leader falls. I was doing a downward dyno that day. Once the gear was off, the climb was a lot easier.

Some days climbing is easy and some days gravity is a little heavier.

John

Oldtradguy wrote:

Alicia

I remember one of the times that I ways leading the Dangler at the Gunks, Jean tells me to take off some of my lead gear to make the climb a little easier. I did not listen to her. I did take 2 leader falls. I was doing a downward dyno that day. Once the gear was off, the climb was a lot easier.

Some days climbing is easy and some days gravity is a little heavier.

John

John, 

I sincerely appreciate the kind words. I am certainly not giving up the fight! This year has been going a bit better so far, and sweet fall temperatures often help me find my groove. I really hope I have the pleasure of running into you and Jean again! You two are truly a dynamic duo! 

Alicia 

Do not give up the fight Lori!!! Keep moving forward (climbing a lot) if you do that you will achieve what you really want! TR something you like a bunch when your ready lead it Lori. Don't back down.

Jeffrey Constine wrote:
Do not give up the fight Lori!!! Keep moving forward (climbing a lot) if you do that you will achieve what you really want! TR something you like a bunch when your ready lead it Lori. Don't back down.

TY Jeff. Coming from you that means a lot. :-)

Just a Saturday morning thought, before I get into my day. (picking the last of the plums from my tree, making pies, canning, enjoying...)  

Jeff's note of encouragement was an upper.  I have pictures all over the place... they seem to pop up at the right moments and make me realize that indeed, I have been climbing!  When I see what folks here are doing, the levels of commitment and ability even among the least of us... I'm just totally heartened and stoked.   Perhaps you all will share your recent favorite climbing pictures???
 
Lately I've been focused on all the things I can't do... but this morning I realize that may be bullshit.  So far, I have found no limits--who knows what further persistence and hard work will do.  So go ahead and dream.    

I'm also so grateful for the veterans, and the great climbers here, who keep reporting in, keep encouraging, and share their experience, pictures and expertise.  This is all pretty amazing.  Thank you.

I lead in the gym a lot.often back to back routes to get ready for outdoors— helps! Gotta push the grades though 10s and 11s!

I lead back to back route outdoors So I can be rad in the gym

Most of the lower graded gym routes are two juggy to replicate outdoor climbing realistically. The back to back technique involves leading a route, lowering off pulling the rope entirely through (by leader to keep pump going), then a pinkpoint lead of 2nd nearby route. This second ascent also involves lugging up the gym’s toprope, which has been clipped on a bite to the leader’s harness while he/she was pulling the lead rope after first lead. You can do this routine and extend number of leads if a given anchor permits. Helps reduce over-gripping due to nerves over time. This works best with 3 or more climbers but can be done with just two. I would also suggest doing different routes rather than the same one multiple times.

Have some reasonably tough PG13s on the agenda for Rushmore Jeff, but I will Be very happy to lead them just once! 

This was the only Gym I ever really climbed 210 wall 1992/4

 Tidwell on lead Rt Piller 210 wall 1992

Jeffrey Constine wrote:

 Tidwell on lead Rt Piller 210 wall 1992

Where's this exactly, Jeff?  I know you climbed under Suicide Bridge in Pasadena as well?  During the late 60's we spent a lot of summers atop the arches of those bridges, or sliding down the moss on the river underneath.  I can still hear the music we played...