Don't assist the bat survey, they'll close our crags

A biologist is looking for climber assistance in identifying bat nesting sites along the front range. Don't assist them in closing our crags.

The stated reason is looking for white nose syndrome in bats. This syndrom is often spread via contact with humans, as the fungus clings to clothes and gear. The mitigation plan is area closure.

While the scientists say they don't intend for the areas to be closed, land managers obviously have other ideas. Many federal and state action plans call for the closure of the area. 
For us here in Boulder we've seen this before with raptor nesting sites. It took us years to force local, state and federal governments to come up with a less heavy handed plan for closures. The same tactics will be used for bats, however there's a lot more affected crags. Happy hour crag, Cobb rock, Avalon, the list goes on and on. 
Don't help them close our crags.  

Its really fun when you know tons of bat nesting sites that the biologists can't find.  

"Why do we keep coming up with no bats in our surveys, but the campers tell us they see them at night?"

Shhhhh....  

So climbing rock is more important than the earth now?

Wanna help the bats? Stop urban sprawl. Don't let them close our crags. 

Bats live on the earth.  Rock is earth.  Save the rock, save the bats?

Sounds like solid logic.

Too bad I'm a miner - we're all f'ed.  But you have a computer. Thank me.

Links to these action plans that call for closures as mitigation? 

See Here for the 2016 action plan, specifically sections 3.7 and 3.7.1. 

Listen to the non-biologist tell you about bat biology.

White nose syndrome is not commonly spread by contact with humans, because that involves a human coming in contact with a bat, or with a surface contaminated with the fungus.  White nose syndrome can be spread by humans, which is much different than it being commonly spread.  I mean, you'd basically have to be in a bat hibernaculum (e.g., a cave) that is already contaminated with the fungus to even have the possibility of spreading it somewhere else.  If WNS isn't in Colorado (which it doesn't appear to be), the possibility of spreading it within Colorado is absolutely nil - because it doesn't exist.

Even if it were in Colorado, WNS may not be that much of an issue (compared to other areas), because the hibernaculums probably aren't very large in size, meaning, not a lot of bats per hibernaculum.  Much more of a problem in places with large cave systems, where WNS can literally wipe out hundreds of thousands of bats.

Regardless, certainly not a veiled attempt to shut down your crags.  More of an attempt to stop the spread of a fungal disease that is killing bats at an incomprehensible magnitude.

Sean - as a climber, biologist and veterinarian I would ask that you re-assess your position. White nose syndrome is very real, bat deaths all over north america are very real and the impacts on our ecosystems are very real. There are other rocks to climb. This biologist does not want to prevent you from climbing, but to save lives and advance science (I don't know them, but I'm sure they don't want to stop you climbing).

Notice how the climbers for bats site doesn't mention anything at all about closures. Not one bit. Lots of talk about working with land managers though.

Don't help them close our crags. 

Sean Brady wrote: See Here for the 2016 action plan, specifically sections 3.7 and 3.7.1. 

I don’t see anything about closures. I understand that could be an option for mitigation but nothing specific to closures is listed.

It would seem that working with agencies as stewards of the land would go further in preserving future access than trying to sensationalize the potential outcome of a monitoring program.

Sean Brady wrote: A biologist is looking for climber assistance in identifying bat nesting sites along the front range. Don't assist them in closing our crags.

Savage ignorance...

As a caver of 40+ years, a biologist, and a definite bat lover, I'm all for WNS research; however, based on what happened with well-meaning cavers, Federal agencies, and closures due to erroneous suppositions about humans spreading WNS, I would not be so dismissive of those who might be skeptical about assisting the same Federal agencies in climbing areas. There are numerous well documented websites discussing how the WNS issue has affected caving and how Federal efforts are not quite up to snuff.  In short, closure of all caves on Federal land in most of the US east of the Mississippi.  This despite recent data that indicate humans are not a significant vector in the spread of WNS.

I would really want to know how the data are to be used, with assurances knee jerk reactions (such as happened with full-scale cave closures) would not result before entering into any agreement to provide data points.

Must save

I don't think you realize how much bats indirectly contribute to your quality of life. Besides, climbers working with biologists to help protect bats and the cliff ecosystem looks pretty darn good for climbers in the eyes of land managers. Threads like this don't look quite as good to somebody who is trying to balance conservation with recreation. 

Sean Brady wrote: A biologist is looking for climber assistance in identifying bat nesting sites along the front range. Don't assist them in closing our crags.

The stated reason is looking for white nose syndrome in bats. This syndrom is often spread via contact with humans, as the fungus clings to clothes and gear. The mitigation plan is area closure.

While the scientists say they don't intend for the areas to be closed, land managers obviously have other ideas. Many federal and state action plans call for the closure of the area. 
For us here in Boulder we've seen this before with raptor nesting sites. It took us years to force local, state and federal governments to come up with a less heavy handed plan for closures. The same tactics will be used for bats, however there's a lot more affected crags. Happy hour crag, Cobb rock, Avalon, the list goes on and on. 
Don't help them close our crags.  

But it’s okay to tell them about those crags?

So has anyone here actually met with the surveyors or with CPW to ask them what the closure plan would be.
Please ask them how they intend to close, be it a crack/route or an entire area.

Ask them if they think that climbers are hard to police and if they intend single climb closures or area closures.

I'm supposed to have tea with one of the lead researchers soon (been busy) and will be asking about this, as another biologist has given me reason for caution.
But I will go in with an open mind.  Yes, Of course I have known where bats might be, and I leave them alone.  But that's is different than aiding in closing of large amounts of cliff if I am not reassured of policy to prevent overly-broad reactions.

I imagine that the best way to handle this is to talk to the researchers first (as I intend to) and then make an informed decision that you can live with about what is the likely outcome of telling them, and of not telling them, and going from there.

IIRC, all caves on forest service land in Colorado we’re closed for two years when a possible WNS case was found in Oklahoma. And I believe access is still restricted to this day.

Bat biologists don’t care about caving or climbing and even if they did, are not the decision makers about closures.
Zealots like those in the Center for Biological Diversity will sue and force a closure based on the remotest chance that climbers might carry the fungal spores.

I am in favor of reasonable measures to protect bats, but trusting the researchers and the preservationists is a losing proposition. 

I had to laugh at the biologist's statement where he claims they would never close down climbing areas due to the discovery of bat colonies. But they have closed every cave where they even suspect bats are living in due to wanting to suppress the spread of white nose syndrome, a highly contagious fungus. Closing areas due to raptor nesting is commonplace. Why would they not close bat nesting areas? It's as easy as putting up a sign and saying "All beyond here be closed." And this site is perfect for getting the closure word out.

I am in favor of reasonable measures to protect bats, but trusting the researchers and the preservationists is a losing proposition.

Sadly, I have to agree. They did it to themselves with past policies. The rule of thumb with nature vs humans is that if humans make nature go down any measurable amount then that's BAD. Humans can't have any impact at all, ever. And they don't need a study to close an area, just feels.

And as for white nose, not all bats die from the disease. The resistant ones survive and go on to pass those genes to future generations, all without the help or control of people. This could take many years to happen. But don't let any of that keep land managers from closing areas to pretend that they are doing something helpful.

Here in CO Springs, a group called the Western Native Trout Initiative closed a great hiking trail along Bear Creek in the foothills next to town. Their reason? Trout populations could somehow be affected negatively by silting from boots and bicycle tires. But oh, what about floods when the waters are completely sullied for days on end? Doesn't that kill all of the fish, or you know, set them back just a bit? it's ridiculous. They fenced off the trail and cut down hundreds of small trees to dump in the trail. I guess trees don't matter next to the lives of fish. Then they filled the trail up with rock walls to foil bicycles. This is along an entire mile of trail! It must have taken dozens of people a long time to do this. All to look like they are helping a fish that was transplanted to the watershed by early settlers and is not native at all, OR endangered. 

Mobes Mobesely wrote: So climbing rock is more important than the earth now?

Nice straw man. smh

Mobes Mobesely wrote: So climbing rock is more important than the earth now?

Of Course!  ;-)