Teenagers that Aid?

John John wrote:Climbing is cheap. It costs 1200$ for a surfboard and a wet suite. How many thousands and millions of kids surf?

F@cK don't even get started on mtbs

Hans Radish wrote: The problem is just getting there on our own, but the scheming has already begun...

Scheme on, and wishing you many, many more decades of same!

Best, OLH

Hans Radish - I hope that you did not interpret my reply as trying to shame you. I was a bottle of wine deep when I read your initial post (before you revised it), and it came across as boasting so I replied accordingly.

Money aside, it boils down to passion for climbing. It sounds like you have a strong healthy passion for aid climbing--which is awesome. But I can't imagine that I'm too far off from the truth in my answer to your original question.

No worries man.

Daniel Evans wrote:No worries man.

No worries at all.... the post got edited so no worries.

Im just a geezer who is getting tired of the WP stuff.... life has never been easy, ever.

Hans Radish wrote:Not many big walls in the lovely state of Washington...

umm, say what? maybe not big big walls, but definitely some decent aid routes.

Hans Radish wrote:Part of it really is the passion thing. Why don't more pre-college kids get so into to climbing outside? I was hooked after just one or two trips outside for top roping, but lots of my friends that have climbed outside like it but still just view it as a sport and go back to doing more training for competitions.

let me take a guess...:)
do you find that everything you do, you do 110%?? a lot of us are super compulsive (OCD), that manifests itself as passion. i think a common theme of people that got into outdoor climbing is the strive for self dependency and that you enjoy figuring out difficult problems while enjoying nature. i know that when i first started climbing, it wasn't a half fun thing, i was hooked on real rock from the first time i started climbing on it. just my 2.234 (dam inflation) cents

I've been caught in a few crap storms out halfway up a few pitches so bad weather happens to everyone who climbs:) It definitely sucks... I guess one reason I don't aid very much is because I never have never really had the desire to on the rock we have in Kentucky. I mean, I've set and pulled on a sequence of gear but have never actually set out on an full aid climb. I really enjoy trad because I (sometimes) know when I am going to whip. I respect aid climbers like you choose to put ur weight completely on a slotted micro nut.

Hans Radish wrote:Part of it really is the paassion thing. Why don't more pre-college kids get so into to climbing outside? I was hooked after just one or two trips outside for toproping, but lots of my friends that have climbed outside like it but still just view it as a sport and go back to doing more training for competitions.

Hans, based on my own experience, and what I've seen, I truly think "climber" is a person you discover that lives in your body. You are, or you aren't. We know it, too.

Then, there are people who also happen to enjoy climbing, as a reasonable part of their lives. Nothing at all against them, that's fine, but, again, we know them pretty quickly too.

This is why I get so pissed off so quickly when this forum pisses on noobs, or gets on high horses over grades, style, or any of it.

Best, Helen (hopelessly hooked)

what about checkered demon / witch doctor / thunder road or other routes on witch doctor wall? or voodoo wall or some of the aid routes on the east side of exfoliation dome? maybe something on the NF of baring? i take it you have already done all of the harder routes on liberty bell? seems like there are a ton of routes that would be pretty tough to do in aid style in a day or less.

if you can do a bunch of these without a bivy, then canada is probably your best somewhat-near-by bet.

Daniel Evans wrote:It is likely because most kids your age can't afford to drop hundreds of dollars on aid/trad gear. I grew up in a middle class family and there is no way that my parents would have ever supported me had I asked them to pay for aid climbing gear.

Most people I know that got into trad in high school worked and bought their own gear. Many of them were from families where mommy and daddy didn't have hundreds of dollars to drop into soccer or football. A double set of cams is, what, $700 bucks? That's affordable on a burger flipping salary if you save up for a few months, or more realistically slowly accumulate gear over a longer period of time. Not so much of a "privilege" issue so much as a "willingness to work hard" issue, which I know is also a hurdle for a lot of people, both teenagers and adults.

I'm fine with easy to moderate aid. Shallow camhook shit though? No thanks. And by itself? Not totally interested. However, gotta get up the big walls somehow.

BigB wrote: F@cK don't even get started on mtbs

These are definitely true, but climbing gear is still going to be more expensive, even if you get used gear because you can't buy too sketchy of stuff. My first surfboard was $20 from a garage sale and a $30 wetsuit from craigslist. I mountain bike too and my first bike was my dad's old rigid frame til I tacoed the front tire. Just sayin, because I started climbing about a year ago and haven't even begun to start building a trad rack, let alone aid gear.

ckersch wrote: Most people I know that got into trad in high school worked and bought their own gear. Many of them were from families where mommy and daddy didn't have hundreds of dollars to drop into soccer or football. A double set of cams is, what, $700 bucks? That's affordable on a burger flipping salary if you save up for a few months, or more realistically slowly accumulate gear over a longer period of time. Not so much of a "privilege" issue so much as a "willingness to work hard" issue, which I know is also a hurdle for a lot of people, both teenagers and adults.

thats me!!! if only $700 tho, in order to climb trad ur looking at rope, shoes, quickdraws, nuts, cams, alpine draws, helmet, crap ton of carabiners... i just got to the point where i feel comfortable leading an entire pitch on the gear i have, and i'm looking at over $1500... instead of burger flipping, i work construction during the summer, and weekend work during the school year. pretty much it comes down to is, is your willingness to work strong enough, not to go on a rant, but i think america's getting pretty f-d up with people who don't want to work for anything, i feel like i should not be entitled a thing, if i want it i should work for it. and ur darn right i will.

Daniel Evans wrote:Since you edited your post, I'll edit mine. It is likely because most kids your age can't afford to drop hundreds of dollars on aid/trad gear. I grew up in a middle class family and there is no way that my parents would have ever supported me had I asked them to pay for aid climbing gear. Soccer? Football? Sure, but not thousands of dollars for me to go kill myself (how they view it). Climbing gyms are relatively cheap, provide easy access, and offer a social platform for many kids to interact.

Like some others, I disagree that kids don't get into trad or aid because of the cost. For one thing, most kids who work have more discretionary spending money than adults because most nacessities are taken care of by their parents. It's mostly exposure to the sport and personal preferences. Most kids never even heard about rock climbing, be it aid, trad, or sport. And out of the ones that do somehow come across it and would have access to outdoor climbing, what fraction of those have the personality for it?

normajean wrote: Like some others, I disagree that kids don't get into trad or aid because of the cost. For one thing, most kids who work have more discretionary spending money than adults because most nacessities are taken care of by their parents. It's mostly exposure to the sport and personal preferences. Most kids never even heard about rock climbing, be it aid, trad, or sport. And out of the ones that do somehow come across it and would have access to outdoor climbing, what fraction of those have the personality for it?

Depends on where you live and what you do. Back in the 90s in rural New Zealand,we went rock climbing and Abseiling with the School when we were about ten years old. Along with Biking and Kayaking ect and we did it every year after that. Between the ages of 5 and 10 I used to go skiing with the school twice a week. And I bet you that almost all people of my age from New Zealand could tell you the same things.

But then again, we are one of the best Mountaineering Nations on Earth.

John John wrote: But then again, we are one of the best Mountaineering Nations on Earth.

Debatable

grog m aka Greg McKee wrote: Debatable

Who was the first to climb the highest Mountain in the world? And who, still to this day, are the main guides on the Mountain?

Hans Radish wrote:I realized I sounded that way, and it is not what I was intending. For the record, we started out using knotted slings as aiders and a set of nuts and a couple old small cams. Being able to climb, I recognize that I am inherently privileged, but there are so many kids (that I know) who spend a lot more money flying to national competitions and trips to major sport climbing areas. There are quite a few climbing areas close to where I live, which definitely is a privilege. I grew up in a climbing gym like a lot of people do now, but for some reason I like being outside and don't care whether I am sitting on gear or pulling really hard moves. I occasionally read things about the loss of adventure as a part of climbing and I'm wondering how many other young people there are that get a kick out of wandering up unknown routes, not knowing whether it will be a free route or not.

Good for you lads .. Anything outside is better than pulling plastic in a sweaty gym . I myself have never been on plastic and never will..

John John wrote: Who was the first to climb the highest Mountain in the world? And who, still to this day, are the main guides on the Mountain?

I'm sorry, I have to do it......The Sherpas are from New Zealand? ;)