Greenpoints in Whiterock

I'm sorry, but I can't resist telling about my friend, Chuck Calef, (69 on Friday) who yesterday completed his project of climbing the "Fab Four" (as he calls them) without clipping any bolts.This is at Below the Old New Place and the climbs are: Wailing Banshees, Scandinavian Airlines, Flesh-Eating Gnats, and Monsterpiece Theater. He used wires and small cams in pockets and he did rehearse the placements….but still…! (He doesn't know I've written this.)

Awesome!

Thanks for sharing this, Darien. That's some badass stuff right there. Those all very difficult routes, especially Monsterpiece Theatre (!). I've never even looked for gear placement opportunities on those lines. Super proud.

Just doing what he did when I'd watch him in the Gunks 35 years ago
Still holding TRUE!!!

Finally I've figured out how to put a video here! This might be of interest to those who know Monsterpiece Theater...
youtu.be/FgQcZUR-rXo

Rstrang wrote:Just doing what he did when I'd watch him in the Gunks 35 years ago Still holding TRUE!!!

Respect!
Sweet!
Yowza !
THat Chuck!,
After long rivers & the Grand roller coaster of life, that is inspiring to see!
Darien, he will be, To humble, to admit it but Chuck & Great,
& Rock Solid, have gone together in the same sentence, since forever,

that was great of you to share. Thank you

Hey Chuck, way to keep 'gatttin' after IT'

but, I keep tellin' everyone there IS NO climbing in New Mexico;)

(rant ahead)

I don't think that the term "Greenpoint" has ever fallen into common usage. One of the climbing mags tried to push it as a climbing terms a few years ago, but it never caught on. This is because it is quite frankly a ridiculous term. There is nothing "green" or environmentalist about placing gear instead of clipping bolts. You'd be better off riding your bike to the crag instead of driving if you're really concerned about the environment.

Plus, if someone were to try to "greenpoint" a sport route, and take a fall on some piece of gear that in any way alters the sport route by breaking a hold, that person is a grade-A douchebag.

By Chuck Calef
Apr 25, 2013

In 1989, my first summer in Los Alamos, I learned to climb this route with Miki Enoeda, a visiting Japanese chemist at the lab. I immediately realized the climb's abundant pockets would provide ample natural protection for a clean ascent; indeed, if the route was at an area with strong ground-up traditional ethics (like the Gunks) it would have been sent back in the seventies. But it was not till 24 years later, on March 18, 2013, my sixty-sixth birthday, that I finally got it together to accomplish this ascent. I'm a poor face climber who always struggles with this route, and not wanting to die in case of a tumble I rehearsed placing the pro on top rope. On my ground-up ascent I placed twelve pieces of gear (and of course ignored the bolts). I climbed on two 9 mm ropes, one for placements left of the arete and one for those right of the arete. The sketchiest pieces, unfortunately, are just before the first crux section between the first and second big ledges. I had a #3 orange Metolius wire in the large flared pocket right of the arete a few feet above the first ledge, a blue Metolius TCU in a horizontal slit about 1 foot left of the arete, and a black "tri-sham" in the same slit. Half way up the route is the second good ledge where one can get a two-hands-off rest by clever body positioning. At this ledge I placed four bomber pieces -- a red trisham, two wires, and a green alien. They had to be good because there was no way I was going to stop while climbing that last 15 overhanging feet of rock to fiddle with gear. If I plopped off from the final move of the climb I would take a long fall but not hit the ground. I messed up the final crux section somewhat by stepping too high and thus putting more force on my tired fingers, but it all ended well. A ground-up, on-sight, clean ascent of this route would be a proud achievement.

You get a great buzz from accomplishing a climb like this even if it's not a birthday present to yourself. It makes you think, what next … Flesh-eating Ants?, Scandinavian Airlines?, Monsterpiece Theatre???</em.

TO LONG ? DID NOT READ?

Pnelson wrote:(rant ahead) I don't think that the term "Greenpoint" has ever fallen into common usage. One of the climbing mags tried to push it as a climbing terms a few years ago, but it never caught on. This is because it is quite frankly a ridiculous term. There is nothing "green" or environmentalist about placing gear instead of clipping bolts. You'd be better off riding your bike to the crag instead of driving if you're really concerned about the environment. Plus, if someone were to try to "greenpoint" a sport route, and take a fall on some piece of gear that in any way alters the sport route by breaking a hold, that person is a grade-A douchebag.

You, Need some schooling' son,
are You sending 4 pitches of stiff 10C - 12a in a push on wires?

Scandanavian airlines `

` monsterpiece-theatre

` flesh-eating-gnats

`Wailing Banshees `

TR'd into submission or not, lets see you match it, Oh no problem, ?
good come back when your a silver hair, pushing 70!? , , , , ,

crikey, - Way to go Chuck !!

You should read up, it took me 2 minutes,
Respect those who have been there before you, who are getting it done, & in better style.

By Chuck Calef , from the comments of - Wailing Banshees -, Apr 25, 2013

In 1989, my first summer in Los Alamos,
I learned to climb this route with Miki Enoeda, a visiting Japanese chemist at the lab.

I immediately realized the climb's abundant pockets would provide ample natural protection for a clean ascent;

indeed, if the route was at an area with strong ground-up traditional ethics (like the Gunks) it would have been sent back in the seventies.

But it was not till 24 years later, on March 18, 2013, my sixty-sixth birthday, that I finally got it together to accomplish this ascent.

I'm a poor face climber who always struggles with this route, and not wanting to die in case of a tumble I rehearsed placing the pro on top rope.

On my ground-up ascent I placed twelve pieces of gear (and of course ignored the bolts).
I climbed on two 9 mm ropes, one for placements left of the arete and one for those right of the arete.

The sketchiest pieces, unfortunately, are just before the first crux section between the first and second big ledges.

I had a #3 orange Metolius wire in the large flared pocket right of the arete a few feet above the first ledge,
a blue Metolius TCU in a horizontal slit about 1 foot left of the arete, and a black "tri-sham" in the same slot.

Half way up the route is the second good ledge where one can get a two-hands-off rest by clever body positioning.

At this ledge I placed four bomber pieces -- a red trisham, two wires, and a green alien.

They had to be good because there was no way I was going to stop while climbing that last 15 overhanging feet of rock to fiddle with gear.

If I plopped off from the final move of the climb I would take a long fall, but not hit the ground.

I messed up the final crux section somewhat ,
by stepping too high and thus putting more force on my tired fingers, but it all ended well.

A ground-up, on-sight, clean ascent of this route would be a proud achievement.

You get a great buzz from accomplishing a climb like this even if it's not a birthday present to yourself.
It makes you think, what next … Flesh-eating Ants?, Scandinavian Airlines?, Monsterpiece Theatre???

Edit:

I took the breath and then some. . .

caughtinside wrote: Hey Michael, might want to take a breath. He didn't say anything denigrating this fine achievement, only the silly term 'green point' But since you asked, I'll do a little spraying for my friend and say yeah, he can climb .10c and harder on wires m.youtube.com/watch?v=k6GWr…

YES "GREENPOIN"T CAME FROM THE PERSON WHO POSTED THE COMPLIMENT.

I was not saying anything more than that Chuck has been placing his own gear, since that is the way he learned to accept the rock the way it is and climb in the best style

Paul Nelson crushes it , in that video.!!
I checked his stats a bit before I took up the Banner here,

His issue with the term seemed pedantic when all the other issues that loom ,
and not wrecking the holds, could have been discussed;

The Breaking of holds would imply the wrong quality of rock for the gear send. . . ymmv

Chuck Calef was the head Boy Scout at the Gunks during the Hayday ! a time when the party favors
that were handed out like candy, made you go' Color Blind' For real . . . ,(or Really 'see colors)'.

some of the things that got floated on a pin and 4 or 5 nuts still stand as the high watermark of "trad' climbing.

Chucks' video demonstrates

He was climbing it his way -

That means getting it down,

the moves wired like second nature,

then work the placements and reduced the use of pre-fixed gear,

until a clean, well envisioned and rehearsed, accent is made,

it could be called working a route, - projecting. . .,

Way back in the old old days In the Gunks this sort of pre-rehearsal, used to lead to "third classing" or soloing a route.
.

For those not familiar with the place, White Rock is a kind of a funny place with a funny history, and is not really just a sport crag. This series of small crags started as a collection of top rope/trad only areas, but became a "sport crag" with advent of sport climbing, having some of the earliest sport routes in the country. The explosion of bolts at White Rocks did not sit well with the locals, and I remember the threat of bolt wars well into the mid 90s, when an agreement was struck to leave certain crags and routes bolt free. As it is, I doubt that any of these routes saw first ascents on bolts, and were most likely first done either on top rope or in traditional style many years before bolts came to town.

Darien Raistrick wrote:Finally I've figured out how to put a video here! This might be of interest to those who know Monsterpiece Theater...

Thanks for posting the video, Darien. Chuck looked way strong through the shouldery crux (over that small wire!) Super cool to see that.

Schmuck and George, thanks for the background info. Very interesting. And way to go Chuck!

Im personally a bit baffled though about the motivation for "green pointing" - I'd never actually heard that term before. In this case, what Schmuck and George makes sense. But other cases - e.g. Cody Roth on Mainliner a few years back - I guess it's just a personal challenge?

Just to clarify….I was the one using the term "green point". I wasn't sure if this was a true climber's term or not, but decided to use it. Secondly, Chuck is in Hawaii and will be absolutely horrified that I posted anything about him. I just was so proud of him and heedlessly went ahead and posted. And, as Owen suggests, it was just a personal challenge, period. And that is typical of Chuck.

Nice job to Chuck! I met Darien and Chuck once; very friendly and very unassuming. I don't care who you are, I think most climbers can only hope to have the chance to be pursuing such personal bests at Chuck's age.

Also, that was a cool video, caughtinside! It is true that Pnelson's comment may have been sooomewhaaat on the pedantic side...but I believe he is usually a down to earth and thoughtful guy. He's a historian, he's chronicling his thoughts on climbing semantics. In his zeal, he might have conflated more behind the use this time than was intended. ;)

Darien, could you ask Chuck Calef if Swains guide has any validity on Back To The Land Movement?

Thanks,

DJP