Why throw ropes for rappel?
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I've always wondered why people insist on throwing their rope(s) down when they are about to rappel. It makes more sense to me to lower them. Tell me if I'm missing anything: |
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Another good time to lower the ropes: when your rappel route is the same as someone's climbing route. This comes into play a lot when I'm at Seneca Rocks. There are lots of ways up but only a few ways down and the rappel routes usually overlap popular climbs. |
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Lowering the ropes lets them snag on any projections on the way down (trees, rock outcroppings) if there are any. |
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There's no way that throwing your rope is more likely to tangle your rope. If you lower your rope, the rock can get stuck on a ledge and then you'll just keep lowering into a nasty pile that can get knotted up. Sure, if you blindly grab piles of your role and chuck em, maybe. But it is not more likely to tangle, all things being equal. |
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Ryan Williams wrote:I've always wondered why people insist on throwing their rope(s) down when they are about to rappel. It makes more sense to me to lower them. Tell me if I'm missing anything: - Lowering the ends helps you find the middle of the rope. - Lowering the ends ensures there aren't any tangles, twists or knots. - Lowering the ends keeps the wind from grabbing them and wrapping them around the side of the wall or tower. - Throwing the rope(s) may be a little quicker - Throwing the rope increases the change you will run into a knot or tangle on the way down - Throwing the rope allows the wind to catch and carry it, maybe getting it stuck In super windy conditions I know most people just rap with a coil but even then I've found lowering the ends to work quite well. So why is it that most people I see climbing just grab the stack of rope and toss it out into space? Just doesn't seem like the best idea.A very reasonable question / observation. There are lots of times when throwing the rap ropes is not the best option. Depending on the situation, I frequently saddle-bag them and bring them down with me or lower the first climber who therefore takes the ropes down with him/her. I also sometimes carefully throw them if the rap is straight, clean and with a reasonable line of sight. Very ocassionally I'll just lower them as suggested above, but I find that in really windy conditions, this just doesn't work unless it's on a very low angle slab. Even then, if it's really blowing, I prefer other methods. These are all just tools in the toolbox, to be applied in the right place and at the right time. Cheers, Derek |
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If there's any chance of snagging, I prefer to bag the rope. I stack the end(s) in a re-usable grocery bag(s) clipped to my harness (one on each side for two strands), the rope flakes out as I go. No hassle and no tangles. |
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Those "plates" at Red Rocks just live to eat ropes. I'm very careful there when rappelling. |
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Lots of trees, cracks, ledges for the rope to be gently lowered into, then stuck. |
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It looks and feels more Trad to throw the ropes. |
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I think both coiling then throwing and just lowering have their place, situation dictates. I do however throw more often than lower because one time at Seneca on the West Pole rapp I lowered my 8mm double and it went into a crack that was open (where my rope went in) then the crack closed but maintained its openness behind and finally the rope came out the bottom (think a straw) when the crack opened again. It was a cluster fuck of a situation and not easy or fun to correct. How often have Ihad issues lowering? This is the only time I can think of. Both techniques have a place in my "tool box". |
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Others have said the same thing, but lowering the ropes into a rope-eating crack is a mistake I don't want to make more than once (and I've already made it). If that's not an issue, lowering is fine and what I usually do. |
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I've taken some good technique advice from Semi-Rad: |
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Its completly situational. |
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What about neither? |
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I've never heard of lowering, always thrown. MTKirk wrote:If there's any chance of snagging, I prefer to bag the rope. I stack the end(s) in a re-usable grocery bag(s) clipped to my harness (one on each side for two strands), the rope flakes out as I go. No hassle and no tangles.I'll have to try this! Chris Rice wrote:Those "plates" at Red Rocks just live to eat ropes. I'm very careful there when rappelling.We threw our rope and one end ended up "flossing" a flake, that I didn't notice till I had rapped down beneath the flake. Pulling on it didn't work b/c the knot was on the other side, and whipping it didn't work either. I had to climb up to free the rope. mike seaman wrote:We lowered our rope off of Dream of Wild Turkeys in RR and the rope got so tangled in a crack/hueco system that it took hours to get it free.Crazy but true, rappeling can take as long as climbing! |
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Evan Sanders wrote:What about neither? I've never personally tried this, but I have heard of some people on windy days just flaking it on a ledge which lets the rope unravel as you rappel. I'd love to hear from anyone else who might have done this beforeIf you do this and it snags above you you will have to jug the line to get it untangled. I learned long ago to clean the rope as I move down the rap instead of waiting until the snag is above me and pulling on it. Around these parts that is a great way to pull rocks down upon yourself too. |
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Evan Sanders wrote:What about neither? I've never personally tried this, but I have heard of some people on windy days just flaking it on a ledge which lets the rope unravel as you rappel. I'd love to hear from anyone else who might have done this beforeI'm assuming you're talking about flaking the rope on the ledge from which you're rappelling. If so, it's not a good idea because if the rope gets snagged on anything above you, it can be a bitch to free the snag, especially if you're on an overhanging rappel. To the OP: The only time I've noticed it's beneficial to lower the rope as opposed to throwing it is on overhanging rock. Also, I've noticed most people lap coil the rope before throwing it which is more likely to get tangled on the way down. A mountaineers coil (circular) comes apart much cleaner. |
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Not sure how we got to the "falling" thing, but I have never said it. Seems kind of weird to me but to each their own. |
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Jeff J wrote:Its completly situational. In my area, the climb is steeper than the decent. the decent is useuly like a 5.5/6 and lowering a rope down such a ramp would create a tangled mess of spegetti. So throwing the rope out makes for a lot less mess on the decent. But if the rap is steep and there is little risk of snags than by all means lower the rope.easiest answer to read yet boil it down +1 |
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Locker wrote:"Not sure how we got to the "falling" thing". I went off on a tangent.it was the glue talking? |
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Ryan Williams wrote:I've always wondered why people insist on throwing their rope(s) down when they are about to rappel. It makes more sense to me to lower them. Ryan Williams wrote:I do actually throw the ropes when I am on anything low angled or if there is a chance that I could be lowering the ends into a rope eating crack.Great... thanks for answering your own question. Can we move on now? |