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Should Dogs be at the Crags?
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By Adam Stackhouse
Administrator
Mar 29, 2007
Courtright Reservoir, September 2013

Dogs at crags seem to be for people who haven't had kids, and have yet to truly understand the rewards of peace, quiet and the complete lack of responsibility enjoyed by just being by oneself or with climbing partner(s). Love'em but its nice leav'in them at home (both the dogs and the kids).



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By Count Chockula
From Littleton, CO
Mar 29, 2007
Count Chockula

ATS wrote:
Dogs at crags are for people who haven't had kids, and have yet to truly understand the rewards of peace, quiet and the complete lack of responsibility enjoyed by just being by oneself or climbing partner(s).


Probably more truth to this statement than many would care to admit.


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By Buff Johnson
Mar 29, 2007
smiley face

Who's the Top Dog? The G Shep, baby!


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By Tradsplatter
From Boulder, CO
Mar 29, 2007

Should 'hangdogs' be allowed at crags? Blaming dogs for acts of stupid or inconsiderate humans doesn't solve the problem or even identify the problem. Dog owners being considerate of fellow climbers is the only useful solution. As always, some people will fail to keep their dogs under control on occasion. If life were perfect we would all just climb and not have to have jobs! I love dogs but if one attacks me or my friends I will take necessary action against the dog and then its owner. Sometimes, just communicating with the owner (if they are around) can head off problems before they flare up..such as asking them to keep the dog away from your belaying zone or away from the trail. Sometimes owners are not as attentive as they should be and a calm reminder is all it takes.


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By Lee Smith
Mar 29, 2007
You can love your rope but you can't "LOVE" your rope! <br />(Back by Popular Demand.  There you are Mom) <br /> <br />

My kitty wants you to bring your dogs to the crag, oh yes indeedy, good doggie, yummy doggie....

My kitty LIKES dogs
My kitty LIKES dogs


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By Buff Johnson
Mar 30, 2007
smiley face

The trouble with these kitty cats is that it's hard to get them on the leash and get them on the walk. Personally, I like Clark Griswald's approach to keeping your cat running along at a good clip.

Lee, that's a cool shot - is that yours (up close and personal like)? If so, CRAP! If not, it's still a cool pic.


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By Lee Smith
Mar 30, 2007
You can love your rope but you can't "LOVE" your rope! <br />(Back by Popular Demand.  There you are Mom) <br /> <br />

It's the last photo I ever took in my life....

Nah, I googled "mountain lion pictures" and stole it.


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By Adam Stackhouse
Administrator
Mar 30, 2007
Courtright Reservoir, September 2013

And it looks like it was maybe shot in a zoo due to the out-of-focus fencing in the background.


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By Monomaniac
Administrator
From Morrison, CO
Apr 5, 2007
Insurrection, 5.14c.  Photo Adam Sanders.

This is an interesting story relating to this topic. I challenge dog owners to name one instance in which the presence of dogs has IMPROVED an access situation.

"

Closure Threat Becomes Reality at Torrent Falls, KY (12/15/2006)


By Bill Strachan, Executive Director Red River Gorge Climbers Coalition

In response to continued disrespectful behavior by some climbers, the owners of Torrent Falls, a popular Red River Gorge crag, have decided to close the area to unrestricted climbing.

When the closure was first threatened earlier this spring, the RRGCC convinced the owners to write a set of rules and give climbers a chance to show that they could follow them. Unfortunately not all climbers were following the rules.

Recent flagrant incidents cited by the owners in explaining their reasons for moving forward with the closure included someone who leashed their dog to a “No Dogs Allowed” sign.."

I guess this is really the fault of the land-owner for being a dog-hater.


My friend was bitten at Smith Rock two weeks ago. The owners were ultra-apologetic (aren't they always?) but does that really make it any better?

Other dog sins that don't bother dog owners:
-Walking on rope bags
-Lying on rope bags
-Digging pits at the base of the cliff (see Cactus Cliff at Shelf)
-Agrressive behavior towards children/babies
-Licking any human within reach

How would you dog-owners feel if I did any of these things to you/your rope bag/child at the crag?


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By Hansel
From Boulder, CO
Apr 5, 2007
My ride

As some people have stated, dogs shouldn't be blamed for the negligence of their owners. If a dog is barking/biting/pooping/otherwise being an annoyance at a crag, it's entirely the owner's fault.

That being said, there are lots of responsible dog owners out there whose dogs are not part of the problem. I know personally I hate leaving my dog inside for hours when he could feasibly be with me. But bringing your dog to the crags is a responsibility you should do only if:

1) You're willing to pick up your dog's poop, and either bury it away from the crag or pack it out with you. Better yet, have your dog pack it out himself by hanging a bag of it from his collar by a 'biner.
2) You're doing single-pitch routes, and not leaving your dog unattended for long periods of time. I've seen lots of people just chain their dog to a tree, and head up for hours. This stresses most dogs out, and is responsible for territorial behavior and barking.
3) You've already trained your dog not to be aggressive or bite strangers. If you've got a great watch dog that doesn't play well with others, leave it at home.
4) You don't let your dog roam freely. Even the best dog will pee on gear and lay down on rope bags. If you're belaying someone, put your dog on a retractable leash and make sure it can't reach other people's stuff (unless you're willing to replace it).

If we all abide by these rules, it'll all work out ok.


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By caughtinside
From Oakland CA
Apr 5, 2007

I love the dog owners that try to reason with their dogs. Is that for real? Explaining bad behavior to a dog? It would be funny if I didn't see it happening all the time.


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By 426
Apr 10, 2007

Monomaniac wrote:
"Closure Threat Becomes Reality at Torrent Falls, KY (12/15/2006) By Bill Strachan, Executive Director Red River Gorge Climbers Coalition In response to continued disrespectful behavior by some climbers, the owners of Torrent Falls, a popular Red River Gorge crag, have decided to close the area to unrestricted climbing.... included someone who leashed their dog to a “No Dogs Allowed” sign.."




Just a heads up, Torrent, an absolutely superb crag---is closed to all climbing now-unless you pony up a franklin to stay at the b+b.

Thanks...


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By Jim Matt
From Indianapolis, IN
Apr 10, 2007
Jim at the Boneyard TRing a route

426 wrote:
Just a heads up, Torrent, an absolutely superb crag---is closed to all climbing now-unless you pony up a franklin to stay at the b+b. Thanks...


Agreed that Torrent is awesome, but access may change as someone else is looking to buy Torrent...stay tuned...

TORRENT FALLS PURCHASED!
Pending final approval of the loan and closing, Torrent Falls has been purchased by Bob Matheny (Dr. Bob) with the assistance of Matt and Amy Tackett. Mark Meyers and his family will continue to live at Torrent. Out of friendship with, and respect for, Mark and his family access will remain as it is. Details regarding long term access for climbing are being worked out and will be announced when available.


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By 426
Apr 10, 2007

Jim Matt wrote:
...announced when available.


Soon, I hope..


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By Tony B
From Around Boulder, CO
Apr 10, 2007
Got Milk? How about forearm pump? Tony leads "Alan Nelson's Bulging Belly" (5.10, X) on the Lost and Found Flatiron. Belayer is Mark Ruocco. Photo by Bill Wright, 10/06.

caughtinside wrote:
I love the dog owners that try to reason with their dogs. Is that for real? Explaining bad behavior to a dog? It would be funny if I didn't see it happening all the time.


Given enough pot, some hippies will even talk to the wall...


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By caughtinside
From Oakland CA
Apr 10, 2007

Tony Bubb wrote:
Given enough pot, some hippies will even talk to the wall...

that's cool. I just swear at it.


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By Hank Caylor
Administrator
From Golden, CO
Apr 10, 2007
Lone goat..

Tony, what the hell are you talking about? Do you not like dogs, hippies or pot? Cuz if it's all 3, the stick up your ass is bigger than I ever imagined......

edit to add: I'm uber baked with long hair and a dog in my lap. I'm not gonna be such an easy take at the Rattlesnake Ramble this year, heh heh


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By Richard Radcliffe
From Louisville, CO
Apr 10, 2007

Hansel wrote:
As some people have stated, dogs shouldn't be blamed for the negligence of their owners... If we all abide by these rules, it'll all work out ok.


Well, it's clear that "we all" don't abide by these rules. So what's the solution? Close ALL the damn crags?


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By Buff Johnson
Apr 10, 2007
smiley face

Nah, I say we climb up and cut the owner's rope when the're safely at the anchor. Then take their rope and let the dog pee all over it.

Grab a couple lawn chairs, open up a 6 pack, and wait for the Sheriff to rescue the dumbass.

(dogs are cool, I'd even drop a bowl, and offer some pilsner while we're waiting)


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By Greg Hand
From Golden, CO
Apr 10, 2007
Papa Smurf

Hank,

What kind of dog is your big dog?
Greg


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By Hank Caylor
Administrator
From Golden, CO
Apr 10, 2007
Lone goat..

Bull Mastiff and a Pug, and yes I almost always leave them at home. They are great crag dogs, but they still usually stay at home.


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By Nathan Furman
From Salt Lake City, Utah
Apr 11, 2007
A lazy afternoon at Big Sandy.  Big Sandy is plenty big and multi-terraced; it makes a wonderful place to relax and watch the birds.

At the crag, I'll usually get irked at other climbers before I get irked by their dog.

I like dogs at the crag.


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By Mike Ben
From silverthorne/denver
Apr 11, 2007

no


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By Ladd Raine
Administrator
From Plymouth, NH
Apr 11, 2007
Waiting for lift-off, Thin Air(5.6) Cathedral Ledge, NH

Please no whining dogs and no dogs aloud to roam around. use your best judgement, just don't make me take care of your dog.


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By Dave Miller
From Boulder
Apr 11, 2007

I have two beautiful Maltese, unfortunately, they are raptor bait and do not go out climbing with me. Unless I'm cragging on a day that is quiet (without too many other climbers) they stay home. But for my little boy Nigels credit , and I'm sure I will catch a wrath of shit for this, he has soled the First Flatiron in my doggie backpack a few times, as well as a few choice Yosemite climbs,(Black is Brown, Harry Dally Crack and a few others)but I love to gush on his climbs!


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