Seneca 5.9's and 10a/b's

Inspired by the resurrection of this thread (about 5.7's at Seneca), I thought I'd ask a similar question: among the most popular and well-trafficked 5.9's, 10a's, and 10b's at Seneca, which ones are the easiest or safest, and which are the scariest or most sandbagged? To get started, here are some of my observations and questions. 

5.9: 

Frosted Flake is a lot easier and safer than Unrelenting Verticality. 

The first 20' of Marshall's Madness seems to be just as hard as the 10a part of Crack of Dawn. 

The delicate finish on Back to the Front is amazing. 

How sandbagged is High Test? 

How bad is the gear or runout on Bring on the Nubiles? 

Is Desperado harder than Unrelenting Verticality? 

... and probably should mention Triple S here ;-)  

5.10a: 

Pollux is easier to protect pulling off the ground than Castor, but the former is much shorter than the later. 

Do others agree that Madmen Only and Marshalls to CoD are good choices for breaking into the grade if you're comfortable with jamming (but both have stout starts)? 

At the Southern Pillar, how much harder are Judgement Seat and Daytripper compared to Electric Chair and Right Tope?

5.10b: 

What are good (relatively safe) routes to break into this grade? Which easier routes should one have climbed in good style before attempting 5.10b's? 

How strenuous is it to place pro on Orangeaid, Breakneck Direct, or Cottonmouth - Venom? 

How tight of a squeeze is the chimney part on Agony?

Thanks in advance for your thoughts! (Yes, YGD)    

First off, Frosted Flake is easier than Triple S (go figure). 

I would say that Castor and Pollux are many peoples first 10's at Seneca. Other than the start (which is also the crux), Castor protects very well. 

I did both of the above routes and a couple of other 10s before jumping on High Test. As I heard someone else describe High Test and is pretty spot on: the climbing isn't any harder than 5.9 but don't expect any climbing to be easier than 5.9 either. It's one of my favorite routes at Seneca, just long and sustained. Agreed that the gear is solid the whole way. 

I don't remember strenuous gear placements on Orangeaid, though it's been a long time since I've been on that route. 

Following with interest!

I’ve only toproped Breakneck Direct but thought it was very easy compared to some of the 9s I’ve been on that are full of burly, strenuous moves—delicate footwork and body position but adequate and mostly positive holds, secure the whole way. I’m dreaming about leading it later this year. The part that gives me pause is the run to the anchors - is the beta really place a nut before the crack runs out and just gun it? How long is that? How good is the last pro? Good exciting or bad exciting? Any advice welcome!

Entry-level 5.9s: Crusher Critter and Ladybug both go at that grade, but…idk, pretty sus. MM is a doable “real” 9 but geez the start is intimidating!

Yesterday I got on High Test and Bring on the Nubiles, and they both went well. Thanks to E.R. and J.B. for some spot on beta! Auden and Bryan, I agree with both of you that the gear on High Test was very good, but the start of the route had me a little gripped with thin moves over gear at my feet to reach the small sickle-shaped ledge. Above the ledge, I thought High Test had very fun and varied movement between great rests, and good gear. Overall the route felt like Seneca 5.9+ only for the first 25' to reach the small ledge, then normal Seneca 5.9 above the ledge. We approached P2 of BotN via West Pole P1 and Thais Escape. P2 of BotN had decent gear, and the fixed blue offset nut at the crux was helpful. Windy conditions yesterday added to the excitement on P2. Overall, my wife and I both liked High Test better than BotN.

Eunny, thanks for those recommendations. I haven't been on either Crusher Critter or Ladybug but will add them to my to-do list. Totally agree with you about the start of Marshall's being very intimidating. I find it helpful to place a yellow offset nut standing on the top of the starting ledge before pulling onto the wall, and then be ready to quickly plug in a couple off-finger-sized cams. MM-CoD, done in a single pitch, is my favorite route for hand jams at Seneca. Thanks for the feedback on Breakneck Direct. Good luck when you get on it next time! 

Fan Zhangwrote:

Yesterday I got on High Test and Bring on the Nubiles, and they both went well. 

How were the crags over that weekend? Crowded with the long holiday?

Connor Varneywrote:

How were the crags over that weekend? Crowded with the long holiday?

I was very surprised to see that it was not very crowded given the July 4th holiday and the unseasonably cool weather that weekend.  Based solely on the number of cars in the (south) parking lot, it seems like crowds were only 75% of the biggest crowds I've seen at Seneca.  There were the usual crowds on classics 5.7 and easier, but harder routes seemed mostly open and free of crowds. 

The start of Mad men has a no fall zone on 5.8? terrain.   Otherwise it has great pro. Cotton mouth also has hollow flake pro at the start that makes it a bit serious. Marshals is pumpy but very protectible at the start.  I never felt Break neck was particularly runout. There are great small nuts at the crux. I enjoyed thinking about these routes. I climbed most of them mentioned in the early 80s.

I think that of the 10bs you listed Orangeaid is probably the easiest to climb and to place gear on and if you can solidly climb Pollux you can probably climb Orangeaid no problem. I've only climbed Breakneck Direct once, but I thought (contrary to the other poster) that it was pretty solid at the grade. The top of the route (as I climbed it) was super run out and very sustained. The gear below is good and high enough to keep you off the ground, but I thought it was pretty scary. Maybe you could fiddle in some brass at the top, but I think it would be hard to place given the strenuous stances. Definitely a committing lead regardless of how difficult you find the climbing though.

A couple of 9's worth adding to the discussion are Bandito and Streptococcus. I think Streptococcus is super fun and was pretty well protected once you get to any difficult climbing but the pro is not very good up to it. Bandito is super well protected but I thought it was pretty hard back when I did it (felt much harder than Strepto).

Also worth mentioning the first pitch of Muscle Beach. It's in the 5.9+/10a range and is a pretty fun pitch with good pro. In some spots the rock quality is not amazing, but it is a nice one to do at the end of the day when you are walking back down to Roy Gap. 

Thanks for the feedback, Timothy and S! All very helpful. Hey S, good luck with your research! :-)