Weird loading position when using DMM Rhino autolocking biners with a Grigri

Just use a gridlock carabiner and put the grigri on the smaller(belayloop) side of the gridlock problem solved.

Hitch the end of your grigri tether in the corner of the basket (like this) so the grigri stays in the large basket and doesn’t cross load

DRusso wrote: Just use a gridlock carabiner and put the grigri on the smaller(belayloop) side of the gridlock problem solved.

I mentioned this possibility above, and my experience with this is that it's much worse than the problem it solves.

David K wrote: I'm not sure that I agree that this is a solution to the problem. If I'm understanding correctly OP was seeing the problem on rappel, not on lead belay (which is what I think you're talking about--I hope you aren't jumping onto rappel!). However, this brings up an interesting point--I also tend to keep a bit of tension on the rope passing through the belay device, which might account for why I'm not seeing the crossloading behavior, but the OP is.

This is really a different topic, but I'm very confused about why you think a screw lock can't be compromised by rope running across the gate in a recreational setting. I've seen my belay biner come unscrewed by rope running across the gate while recreationally climbing at a gym. This was the Petzl Attache, but I see no reason to believe the screwlock Rhino couldn't be similarly compromised.

1.  The OP stated “Here’s usually how it happens: my climber ask for take, I take up all the slack in the rope, and then jump up to take up any rope stretch and sit down on my Grigri.”

He didn’t mention rappelling. Like you said, there would be no reason to perform the jumping technique when setting up for rappel. 

2.  A rope definitely can open a screwlock in a recreational setting. But I can’t think of a time when this is incredibly likely. 

I don’t know much about arborists techniques but I’ve been told by the DMM designers that they have a specific need for the “Quicklock” and “Locksafe” versions. Probably more relevant... many commercial and industrial applications simply require something more than a simple screw-lock. According to DMM, this is why those options are on the market. 

Have you tried not jumping around when you take? If you can't take all the slack in just by pulling on the rope, hit the gym once in a while.

Andrei Steclaru wrote: Have you tried not jumping around when you take? If you can't take all the slack in just by pulling on the rope, hit the gym once in a while.

He’s talking about when a leader wants to boink up the rope a bit or when He needs to get the stretch out of the rope for a tired TR climber. Jumping is common practice. 

Cross-loading on the Grigri, which is just an annoyance, is because your anti-crossloading carabiners are pear shaped. Yes, asymmetric D-shaped biners will occasionally crossload with a Grigri. You can easily fix this by changing your habits.

https://www.petzl.com/US/en/Sport/Choice-of-carabiner-for-attaching-a-GRIGRI-to-the-harness "Beware of pear-shaped carabiners, which in this application have a tendency to rotate and often become poorly positioned."

I'm nobody's weight weeny, but carrying pear/HMS biners when you don't need to munter or don't need explicitly need their other features is kinda silly. They're heavier on the harness and heavier on the pocket book.

Ryan Williams wrote:

He’s talking about when a leader wants to boink up the rope a bit or when He needs to get the stretch out of the rope for a tired TR climber. Jumping is common practice. 

Yes, I'm aware it's quite common practice (only ever seen tiny women do it though). I've never had trouble taking the stretch out of top ropes through a combination of pulling the rope and/or taking a step or two back.

I'm willing to bet that his Rhino rotates when he jumps up, hence why I think he either needs to change how he belays or accept that his Rhino won't stay in place

Andrei Steclaru wrote:

Yes, I'm aware it's quite common practice (only ever seen tiny women do it though). I've never had trouble taking the stretch out of top ropes through a combination of pulling the rope and/or taking a step or two back.

I'm willing to bet that his Rhino rotates when he jumps up, hence why I think he either needs to change how he belays or accept that his Rhino won't stay in place

I agree. As I said, he’s not timing the jump correctly. If done right, this shouldn’t happen. 

I understand your comment about TRing and often all you have to do is walk back, but in order for a leader to boink from a free-hanging position, the belayer has to jump. That’s just sport climbing. If you don’t end up in that position at least a few times a day then there’s not much point in owning a GriGri. 

Anonymous wrote: Right.

I use the Am'D, per the Boonwaffles relentless bitching, and honestly, it's been an amazing carabiner. I hate to say it but, he was right about the Am'D.

I have the DMM Ceros as well (I had some return credit I needed to use up) and although it's a beautiful piece of gear, it's just too much of a hassle to deal with getting it on and off my harness.

I haven't experienced the Am'D crossloading and I rather have it on my harness for other uses that the Ceros wouldn't be ideal for, as it would just get in the way and annoy the crap out of me when I'm trying to focus on the job at hand.

I'll add the image from your link above:

I personally suck the teet of the Sm'D -- but this is just preference.

I do find it particularly telling that Petzl doesn't sell a single anti-crossload biner.

Anonymous wrote:

Not to go all political on you but, is it fair to assume you have smaller hands? 

Hah!

Long but not thicc. Are the Sm'Ds incompatible with the less lank of us?

NegativeK wrote: I do find it particularly telling that Petzl doesn't sell a single anti-crossload biner.

Yes, we all know that Pretzl are perfect and only design perfect products.

Personally I use the Edelrid Bulletproof HMS with the 'anti-crossload' spring gate thingy to belay with (I use it with the DMM Pivot for trad and the BD ATC Pilot for indoor/sport climbing). I'm not particularly worried about cross-loading, but it is nice to always belay through the rounded part of the HMS.