SAVE COLORADO! Really!!

Okay friends (in-state and out), it’s time to take a moment to stand up and be counted.
A very serious threat has presented itself to the public (outdoor rec. public and ALL others).

The Government (MILITARY) is attempting to overtake a MASSIVE portion of our public (and private) lands. . . you guessed it, under the condemnation process of eminent domain.
The ENTIRE SE portion of Colorado is at stake, and all for military training land!
Please take a few moments to log onto
pinoncanyon.com
for a briefing and in-depth information. . . don’t worry, you don’t have to read it if you’re busy, just click SIGN THE PETITION.

From the climber/outdoor-loving civilian perspective:
For those (and it’s probably about 95% if not higher) who haven’t spent time exploring and discovering SE Colorado, it is truly an extraordinary place with priceless open space, ancient artifacts and HISTORY (unique petroglyphs and pictographs in the thousands), beautiful waterways and pinyon/juniper forests, grasslands (Comanchee Nat.), the longest continuous T-Rex, Raptor and Brontosaurus tracks (and these things are awesome!) along the Purgatory River, WILDLIFE galore, and incredible canyons!

The solid, varnished, cracked and pocketed sandstone rims, buttes and boulders are incredible for CLIMBING (I’ve done countless climbs down there, and haven’t even touched the potential).
The only place where I’ve seen bolts (and just a handful of TR anchors) is at the Picture Canyon Parking/picnic grounds – please, DO NOT bolt anything, as it will certainly work against the climbing community (or climb on/near indigenous art)!
The bouldering in some areas can rival any of the best, and make many seem silly. Don’t get me wrong, this is no Indian Creek or J-Tree or Hueco (thank the gods!), but is its own worthy location, esp. for those who really want to get away and take it all in (and some of the bouldering could rival any of those areas).

From the public perspective:
This overtake will open the door (or continue to open the door would be more proper) to greater government power and arrogance, with an unprecedented public land-grab. If we allow this to happen in such a large and diverse natural area as SE CO (also home to LOTS of needed CO agriculture), then it will set a new precedent for future bullying and future land-grabs, as the government sees fit. They’ve been testing the waters, and now they want to jump in! Who is next? What is next?

Please pass this on to your friends and family, and let’s get petitioning! Let Ritter know what his public thinks! Let Bush and the DOD know what we think! We can stop this insanity if we act now!

Please take a moment to sign the petition (and be sure to verify your signature).

pinoncanyon.com

Best of Regards -

Hey Cameron
I signed it, but nothing short of an Executive Order/Act of Congress can stop this.

Stark reminder that we live in a Republic, not a Democracy.

The site now reports:

Governor is scheduled to sign HB 1069 withdrawing consent from the federal government to condemn land for the expansion of Pinon Canyon on Thursday, May 3 at 1:15 on the west side of the State Capitol. Festivities will begin at noon. Bring a brown bag lunch and celebrate with supporters of the Pinon Canyon Opposition.

Does this mean this area is now safe from the proposed takeover?

D, (my thoughts) unfortunately, no it doesn't, but it does bring us closer. If and when Ritter signs this on the 3rd it will certainly slow the process and force the feds to regroup and dig further into their books of lawyers for the best approach (of course, I'm quite sure they've already done this. . . .)
Now, we don't know what comm is going on behind closed doors (Ritter and Feds). I'm sure the feds are putting pressure on 'em. So we need to be putting pressure on 'em too! Make sure he follows thru and signs this; and help him power thru future bullying and propositions, etc.

Mike, I'm not too sure, but I hope you're wrong. Colorado legislature has passed it (opposing) thru to the Gov, whose position is to sign it on the 3rd. I believe that this will force the feds into regroup and rethink mode.

I'm going to look into this and get back with an answer. Thanks guys.

I'm still waiting for a return call from the Governor's office and a few others for specifics re: this issue. But, I took the following from a 9News report:

""These are things that make Colorado special and to just say it's a pile of dirt, surely there is a better place for the Army to expand," said Senate President Joan Fitz-Gerald, who despite the bill's passage isn't sure the state can stop the expansion.

The bill sent to Ritter cites a provision of Article 1 of the U.S. Constitution that requires states to give permission before land can be purchased to build forts, arsenals and dockyards. It seeks to apply that to Pinon Canyon's proposed 654-square-mile expansion - about two-thirds the size of Delaware.

The bill explicitly states that Colorado can't stop the federal government from using eminent domain to claim land from unwilling landowners. But it also says that "consent is not hereby given to the acquisition of, or exclusive jurisdiction over, land sought by the United States Department of Defense" to expand Pinon Canyon.

Larry Daves, a lawyer for the ranchers, argues the bill will bolster any state efforts in court to stop the use of eminent domain to expand the training ground. He said it also would give the state the authority to stop owners from willingly selling their land to the Army, but he doesn't think the state would try to do that.

"I think what this bill has done is foster so much help and awareness that our message is being carried out to the rest of the nation," said Robertson, who owns a ranch near Kim, a town of some 65 people 140 miles southeast of Colorado Springs.

Many area ranchers have been wary of their Army neighbor since the 1980s, when Fort Carson acquired 250,000 acres - about half by eminent domain - to create Pinon Canyon. They're still bitter about how property owners were treated then.

A military map showing a proposed 2.5 million-acre, multiyear expansion - covering much of the state's southeastern corner - was leaked last year, fueling more suspicions. Fort Carson said the proposal was an old one."

Another bit:

Salazar's opposition to the Army expansion plan - which is still being drafted - is significant because Congress has the final decision. But his opposition is not as important as the support of either Colorado senator, who have the power to block the expansion either together or individually. When the Army first obtained land for Pinon Canyon in the early 1980s, former Rep. Ray Kogovsek, who represented the 3rd District, was opposed to its creation. But the state's two senators - Republican Bill Armstrong and Democrat Gary Hart - both supported it and the training site was created.

At the town meeting in Pueblo, Army officials said they were preparing a final expansion plan and, when it was released, would begin a lengthy environmental impact study that would take up to two years to complete.

Point is, if we fight this, our chances are good - if we don't, as history has shown us, we will lose.

http://www.santafetrailscenicandhistoricbyway.org/pictcan.html

A link to one of the more well-known (though rarely visited) public sites in the area. Gives you some info and history. There is some good climbing here, and near here, as well (up to 60' on solid and varnished sandstone, and great high-ball bouldering nearby).
Of course the area is so vast, you could spend a day drving the backroads to some great, secret spots. Or hit the canyons for exploring and climbing (and cooling off in the water!)
A Gazatteer is basically mandatory, and some quads as well, if you plan on traveling around in this land.

Another link:
coloradodirectory.com/natio…

Cameron - thanks for all the heavy lifting on this one. I signed & verified, let's keep spreading the word. Great links, BTW!

Bill
CO expatriate

Thanks Bill.
It kills me to think of what this area could become - I've trained at Pinyon Cny, so I have a good idea. . . .
We're moving in the right direction, and every little bit helps!
After we win our battles in Colorado. . . it's on to the Hill! And again, if there is enough opposition, it could keep them from moving forward.
Spread the word - your sanctuaries could be next,(don't mean to sound like an alarmist, but it's true)!

My name is Mike Harris, and I'm the (former) reporter that initially broke the story and I guess started raising all the ruckus about the Pinon Canyon issue. I also built the PCEOC web site and manage it for them, which is how I found your forum.

Cameron, thanks for helping spread the word. It's very necessary to make people realize that this is not just a Colorado issue, but a national issue that affects us all.

In answer to the question about whether or not the Governor's signature will stop the process by the Army - probably not. If you're interested in more detail read on...

It's a complex issue and there are two different schools of thought on whether the state can tell the Army to buzz off, and it will most likely become a constitutional issue regarding eminent domain and states rights. Which is all the more reason that people need to take a stand on this issue. If it happens here, where else will it happen, and more importantly when?

One school of thought is that the state cannot tell the government no. The other is that through states rights, and the fact that the states are supposed to be a check and balance on the federal government, that yes they can say no.

These two competing schools of thought made the debate of the Colorado Legislature interesting, and even though the legislature passed the bill after changing it slightly many legislators still are not sure that the state can say no.

At this point, all passage and signing of the bill does is send a defiant message to Washington that the State of Colorado does not approve of the taking of the land using eminent domain.

According the United States Constitution (Article 1, section 8, clause 17 - towards the end) says that the U.S. Congress shall have power "To exercise exclusive Legislation in all Cases whatsoever, over such District (not exceeding ten Miles square) as may, by Cession of particular States, and the acceptance of Congress, become the Seat of the Government of the United States, and to exercise like Authority over all Places purchased by the Consent of the Legislature of the State in which the Same shall be, for the Erection of Forts, Magazines, Arsenals, dock-Yards, and other needful Buildings; ..."

So the logic of the HB 1069 bill is that if the state withdraws its permission (the bill only withdraws permission in the Pinon Canyon case, not otherwise), then the federal government can't exercise eminent domain or take the land.

Once Governor Ritter signs the bill on Thursday, it will be one battle won in the war over 2.5 million acres of Colorado land. But the ball will be in the Army's court on what happens next. This isn't over yet.

The endgame here is simple:

Even though the Administration is lame-duck, this project is stopped if they determine the costs associated with negative public opinion are too great.

Whom are they training to fight this time? Iran? China and/or India on Middle-eastern soil? Doesn't 4 years of real warfare count as training?

We are not going to win the War on Terror until we stop taking unilateral large-scale military actions and begin approaching the scourge of Islamism as more of a "police action", in cooperation with the rest of the world. This massive land-grab does not fit into that paradigm. It represents a policy based on the idea that we are going to be involved in some extremely serious conflagrations, soon. Perhaps Iran will drag us down into WWIII, but we don't need to make this a pre-determined fate.

Harris - thanks for your input here. . . much appreciated.
Also, thanks for all you're doing to respond to, and face this issue! Without you (and others), this fight would not have gone the distance it has, and will continue to go.

The most important point here is: It isn't over yet.
It is easy for the pessimist to slip in and say that we can't win this. . . but it is absolutely NOT true. We can! But if we don't stand up and communicate, then we cannot.

I encourage everyone to WRITE your Rep's (state and fed), and the Military, and your neighbor. Harris has done a great job of providing the nec. links on the
pinoncanyon.com
website.
Easy and painless and takes about 10 minutes to send a few e-mails.

Thanks to all who have signed thus far (the recognizable names are growing!!) It's just a simple, painless step, but it can help.

Lane, I forgot to thank you for your solid points and input (and support!)

Martinez - right on, and thanks for your help!

I hope everyone is taking the time to address their concerns with their Rep's (state and fed - pinoncanyon.com).
This is an extremely important issue (in about 7 different ways), and it's imperative that as many people as possible make their opposition known.

Regards -

Ive got an alternative place for them to train, how about missouri, there is no climbing the that we would care about losing. That will never work in their book, but is there anything we can do to stop this?

How about take eminent doamin from the constitution and throw it in the trash. I hate that amendment, I go back between whether it helps or not,some situations maybe but mostly i see it as a neggative effect particularly in this case. Can you specify where exactly they are planning to put these training grounds and what areas for climbers ond other sports will be affected?

Thanks,

Eric

Eric,

If you view the flash presentation on the Pinon Canyon site (where it says click here for more info under the bulldozer), it should give you a pretty good idea of the size of the Army training area (basically about one eigth of the state - the entire southeast corner - where all those canyons are).

You can also click on the maps link to go directly to the various maps that have been leaked or released.

Oh and this is for sure shaping up to be an eminent domain battle, that's why this is a national issue. Not to mention it's just not right to take all that land when they don't even use what they've already got down there. And the convenient fact that the Department of Defense already owns 25 million acres across the country.