2RM weighted pull-up, max red point data?

Pretty new to convential training for climbing but recently have started using the Crimpd app as a jumping off point. I did a 3 week cycle of strength training and finger boarding, a deload week, and now I'm doing the assessments. I haven't had a chance to do the finger strength or power endurance assessments yet but just finished the weighted pull-up assessment, kinda blew myself away maxing out at +70lb (~140% BW). Obviously the finger strength and power endurance assessments would be way more indicative of sending potential, but curious if anyone has any data or personal anecdotes on max weigthed pull-ups vs. max red point grade?

There's some Lattice and Power Company data out there.

Data like this are always biased by people who like to train. As counter anecdote, even when I was in shape enough to climb a couple of 13a's my 1RM pullup was only 110%.

I don’t know specifically the 2RM data, but the relationship between pull-ups and climbing has been rehashed many times, and there is very little correlation.

 and any correlation that IS there is more of a reversal of cause/effect, in a sense that yes, people who climb 5.14 can do more pull-ups than people who climb 5.8, can often do 1-armed pull-ups, so you can infer that they can do 2x body weight, at least, but pull-ups are more of the result of their higher climbing ability, rather than the cause, and training 5.8 climber to do more pull-ups would not turn them into 5.14 climber

People who can’t do any pull-ups probably aren’t good at bouldering and overhanging climbing. But anecdotally there are women who report s 12a, and unable to do a single body weight pull-up. 

There is a very small segment of the climbers whose climbing would benefit specially from weighted pull-ups, and they are, by strange coincidence, NOT the people who train weighted pull-ups.

The reverse is also true: vast majority of people who put a lot of effort into weighted pull-ups see no benefit to their climbing whatsoever.

Personal anecdote: I can do approximately same as you, 135-140% bodyweight 2RM. My best is V8/5.13a. 

Lena chitawrote:

The reverse is also true: vast majority of people who put a lot of effort into weighted pull-ups see no benefit to their climbing whatsoever. 

Interesting, worth keeping in mind. Definitely not planning on dumping a ton of effort into pushing the weighted pull ups, unfortunately there are little to no super steep juggy routes around me to warrant it.

I appreciate your personal anecdote too! I've always felt like I have the muscular strength to seriously break into 12s, but held back by finger strength and shoulder mobility. Trying to chip away at those two factors this year. 

I’ve been using the data published by Lattice and Power Co. to serve as a benchmark for my own strength training. As Austin already mentioned, you have to take these metrics with a grain of salt for all sorts of confounding reasons, but I feel like they can usefully serve as a rough guideline to identify areas of strength or weakness to guide your individual training plan. FWIW, my max redpoint grade lines up almost perfectly with the median values in the Lattice dataset. The Power Co. metrics seem higher across the board for finger strength, but as far as I can tell theirs is based on user-reported metrics with no standardized edge profile. I could be wrong, but I think the Lattice data is from their in-house testing on a standardized edge?

My goal over the next year or two is to put down some more 5.12a/b routes and to that end I’m aiming to increase my strength metrics so that they fall in the 80-90th percentile range for the grade. We’ll see if it works - I figure it certainly can’t hurt, and it gives me some solid numbers to aim for, which takes some of the guesswork out of my training.

you need 1 pullup by v6 (5.12) and a one arm pullup by v10 (5.14+). in your position i would simply stop training pullup and focus on finger strength entirely. finger strength is not only incredibly difficult to train, it takes a long time. tendons develop very slowly, so training it sooner is always better. 

this kind of checks out. at v5, you should roughly be hanging 50% of your body weight per hand on a 20mm. this means with both hands hanging body weight, a pull up kind of makes sense. similarly, at v10, you should be hanging 100% of your body weight on one hand, a one arm pullup makes sense again. 

unfortunately, there was a study done that said that everyone can reach v14 muscles in a few weeks. but where the tendon attaches to the bone directly affects torque and this is why some tendons break - they experience much more force due to lever arm. this in addition to the genes that are known to contribute to tendon scaffolding, which directly affect tendon recovery times. 

in summary, just try to enjoy climbing. focusing on pullups won't really affect your climbing and will likely hinder it - wasted time and effort instead of focusing on fingers, for example. but genes will largely determine final progress, so it will soon be. . . out of your hands. 

first lastwrote:

you need 1 pullup by v6 (5.12) and a one arm pullup by v10 (5.14+). in your position i would simply stop training pullup and focus on finger strength entirely. finger strength is not only incredibly difficult to train, it takes a long time. tendons develop very slowly, so training it sooner is always better. 

this kind of checks out. at v5, you should roughly be hanging 50% of your body weight per hand on a 20mm. this means with both hands hanging body weight, a pull up kind of makes sense. similarly, at v10, you should be hanging 100% of your body weight on one hand, a one arm pullup makes sense again.

Just did the max hang 2 arm 4 finger open crimp assessment on a 20mm and clocked in at 130% body weight. By those simple measures 12a shouldn't be that much of a stretch goal for me, but some fairly limited shoulder mobility will likely be my limiting factor. I've got a target route picked out, gonna get out near the end of the month to give it a go and see where my weak points really are hiding. 

I Fwrote:

Pretty new to conventional training for climbing 

Welcome to the rabbit hole! I love geeking out about training and data, especially with Lena, who is a legit postgraduate-degree-holding genius. I have little new to add to her response, merely reiteration.

Based on your recent ticks, weighted pullups should be far down the list of priorities. Get as much intentional volume as you can, focusing on good footwork and efficient movement. Train your antagonist muscles for injury prevention. Then gently ease into hangboarding.

Weighted pullups are a vanity exercise that will give you epicondylitis (yes, I do them weekly). You most likely will experience more gainz in your steep climbing by deadlifting to improve core tension (I do SBD once weekly each). 

Anecdata @152lbs:

2RM pullup: +90lb

Max hang (7on53off x 7): +55lb on 10mm

My highest redpoint: 5.12+ sport and trad, V6 on Moonboard 2024 and 2025

Track all your training to keep an eye on total load, train those antagonists, and have a great time!

I Fwrote:

This may not improve shoulder mobility directly, but will certainly help strength and stability: one-arm deadhangs on a pullup bar. They also help pre/rehab tendonitis.

F r i t zwrote:

This may not improve shoulder mobility directly, but will certainly help strength and stability: one-arm deadhangs on a pullup bar. They also help pre/rehab tendonitis.

Thanks Fritz, unfortunately my recent ticks are all pretty unhelpful because I haven't been out climbing without our toddler in almost 2 years, so really haven't pushed a red point since like 2023ish??

I Fwrote:

Thanks Fritz, unfortunately my recent ticks are all pretty unhelpful because I haven't been out climbing without our toddler in almost 2 years, so really haven't pushed a red point since like 2023ish??

I can relate to that! About to join the 2-under-2 club here. I would not have been able to maintain my pre-baby level of fitness without the Mini Moonboard in the basement. If I had to pick, I would skip all other training exercises and just board climb.