New and Experienced Climbers over 50 #39

Randy wrote:

We call it the ‘hate America’ rally that will happen Saturday. Let’s see who shows up for that,” Johnson said Wednesday at a news conference with other House GOP leaders. “I bet you you’ll see Hamas supporters, I bet you’ll see antifa types, I bet you’ll see the Marxists on full display, the people who don’t want to stand and defend the foundational truths of this republic."

It was very scary out there.

The inflatable dinosaur and frog suits were truly terrifying here in Raleigh though lots of people seemed to abandon all sense of self preservation and got close enough to get selfies. I was on the lookout for Hamas but didn't spot any. There were lots of cute dogs though. 

Mark E Dixon wrote:

Questions for Kilter climbers-

Are you allowed to match hands?

Can hand holds also be foot holds?

Yes and yes, but I see Waed had already answered.

We climbed Trashcan Rock today, I led an easy climb to setup a top rope, then met the person I climbed with at SenderOne Wednesday night. Cool coincidence that the instructor chose my intended downclimb  

We made future plans to get outside.

Ward Smith wrote:

Not with colored lights!

The lights definitely make it easier to turn the brain off completely and focus on the workout. The amount of problems already programmed is massive and the ability to save the good ones for quick access is another helpful way to get a quick workout. 

Thousands gathered yesterday in Ellsworth for some "terrorist" activities 

apogee wrote:

Very similar demographic present for the same event in my small town. Why is it that older populations often dominate these events?

Mostly because they’ve seen it all before. Every administration promises not to be so and so, and history has proven them to be wrong and bad... and nobody protested Biden like this.

I’m out for a morning hike and it’s a lovely day. I really miss climbing and I think I’ll be back soon.

I walked past one of my favorite memories.  This was a climb I wasn’t expecting, but really wanted— and one day Bob just up and suggested it. It was just a really happy day.  Bottle In Front Of Me.  

I was just stunned to be there.  

Sometimes I miss the ocean, but nothing like Joshua Tree’s blue sky for a hit of color therapy

Yesterday I took a stroll over to the one wall that feels most like home. The route I have climbed most often in.
Arturos Special.  If you can get the footwork right and not get too rattled by the vertical wall, it’s a lot of fun.

Bob probably took this picture. It was probably the hardest route I’ve ever climbed and every move took everything I had. What I remember most is watching Bob go up first and thinking how beautiful he made those moves. I was truly sweating it out. Bob was cruising, as usual.

here is a formation I really want to climb, right up that arete. It’s not looking good so far.  

What I have discovered is when I get drawn to some obscure route, sure as shooting the FA was Charles Cole.  

Lori. keep walking and climbing in the desert. Its food for the soul... 

Today was sneaky. It started out calm.. 

but by the time we got to the cliff it was getting sporty with the wind picking up and the chop rocking the canoe..

We did Soul Whisperer to the top and I replaced the quick links on all 3 belays with stainless. I had originally used climb tec plated screw links painted rock gray.  How Not to has affordable stainless links so I upgraded. Sam and Sam also braved the chop.

Sam getting to the Chains on top of P2

The other Sam following P2

you can see the white caps down there. 

Sam and Sam at the p2 belay while my Partner Eric raps P3. 

On the way down we angled over to Extra Treat and replaced two of those anchors as well. 

It was exceptionally exciting getting the canoe off the rocks, into the water , loaded with our gear secured and getting into the canoe and getting separated from the rocks all the while getting tossed around by pretty big waves for a canoe. The paddle back was exciting and quite the work out directly into the wind and  getting tossed around by waves while taking on water when the occasional wave broke over the bow.  Knowing how cold the lake is right now it was a bit disconcerting... 

I took a quick swim before heading home and she is rather brisk... 

Isa leading 20 below

Just back from a 1400km bike tour of the Neckar, Rhine and Moselle rivers in France, Germany and Luxenberg.  Sheree and I try to avoid cities but found Trier, Germany and Nancy, France were worth the tourist hassle.  Now at our place in Rossland, BC for some pre-winter house maintenance.  Arrived yesterday to find snow on our deck.  Hopefully portends a good ski season.

Ken, sorry to learn of your accident, sending good vibes to help you heal quickly.

Went to ORG two weekends ago with some of my younger friends. Went down the north approach- I honestly didn’t know if I could make it. I did ok and they carried all the gear. It’s very rewarding to me to share in their pure stoke. Their only previous sport climbing was on the super short Malibu creek stuff. I could feel the excitement building when they looked down into the ORG for the first time. 
Good times.
Yesterday I went to Ghost with Levy. His back is still jacked from getting rear ended at Stoney point. So we hiked to the top to see what we could see.
I was able to TR “Saugus Speedway” a 5.9. This one requires wide stemming- that’s something I haven’t been able to do for the last few years.
I owe all of my newly found mobility to “Relief Factor”. I don’t wish to make a commercial but I will say this: it has worked for me and I’m only 6 weeks in, taking it. The sharp pains are mostly gone! Can walk better and get to my PT with more enthusiasm.

That Ice Climbing looks cold, so does that lake.
Nick is there some sort of Coast Guard patrol out there? Looks like you’d be in deep do do if you got capsized.

Happy to see that everyone is getting out.

Keep climbing

Later 

Not the Sierra 

I think that's not exactly a recount of what's been going on in that thread, but as I mentioned there, any time the subject of 'ethics' comes up in climber forums, convos seem to rapidly go down the shitter-roo.

The only two parties out on the lake were us climbers. Pretty sure they have pulled the cop boat out of the water for the season. Self reliance is the only option for these kinds of adventures...  Seems like I am the only one who actually wears the life vest. The climbing packs are tied to the canoe so if we swamp it's going to be a tough job to swim the submerged canoe with water logged packs to shore so wearing the life jacket is really important but no one else ever does.... 

Nick Goldsmith wrote:

The only two parties out on the lake were us climbers. Pretty sure they have pulled the cop boat out of the water for the season. Self reliance is the only option for these kinds of adventures...  Seems like I am the only one who actually wears the life vest. The climbing packs are tied to the canoe so if we swamp it's going to be a tough job to swim the submerged canoe with water logged packs to shore so wearing the life jacket is really important but no one else ever does.... 

 I'd imagine the folks not wearing any pfds wouldn't do well in this weather. Hopefully the pfds were available! 

Daniel Shively wrote:

Okay, what exactly is going on in that thread? I’ll admit to a bit of shit talking, but I think it is a worthwhile topic for discussion. I’m curious if you think that there should be any ethical considerations applied to the guide/client relationship? Especially since much of this activity occurs on shared, public land. And do you have any opinion why these convos go down the “shitter-roo”? I suspect that the three post per day per thread limit contributes to the problem since it can be challenging to reply effectively to keep the conversation flowing smoothly. It’s kind of like everyone starts posting snippets of ideas and the heart of the matter gets lost. 

I actually enjoy forum conversations and view them as sort of a thought and writing exercise. I know I’ll probably get flamed as naive for saying this or called a troll, but I’m well past caring about being insulted on the internet. 

My opinion on guide/client relationships and ethical considerations, would be just (and ONLY) that. An opinion. Thus pretty much entirely irrelevant.

Now, can we be outraged at what others choose to do?

Sure!

That's why 15,000 is people chose to express their (largely irrelevant*) opinions by showing up at the Statehouse steps Saturday morning. 

@Lori, nobody here was told any of that advice, that I saw, but I don't follow much in the way of forums or whatever. Generally, Idaho was just "advised" to "not bring weapons of any kind".   My age and older are the ones who remember Vietnam, and decidedly difficult times. I graduated high school in 1975. Pretty significant year, and I plan on getting to the veterans day parade here for just that reason. 

Okay, so I can't get anything to post, but, I'm really surprised that no one has written on the dude who just polished off the 14ers. ALL of them, not just CO. And, AND!! got in between all of them on his own power. It's an astounding accomplishment, but whadda I know?

@Idaho Bob, there's a frost warning out for tonight, gor Boise, and the first real snows are expected this coming weekend! So you might have snow at home in McCall too! 

Helen

*in the sense of anything much changing anytime soon

I will confess here. Lately, I've been dragging, for no particular reason, and really with no real justification, either. I am quite fortunate, at this point in my life, to be in a position where my life is ....pretty much whatever I choose to make it. I can spend my time however I wish, and have enough to be fine. 

Okay, girl, what's your problem then?

Omg.

I think I'm having a very very late mid life crisis.

Or radically delayed puberty.

I finally reached a comfortable adulthood (ish)....

And I'm old.

How did this happen?????

That 19 year old wants her time!

 

Here is some AI generated music for you OLH   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5GKuoV8cvOo

Daniel Shively wrote:

Hi Helen, I appreciate your reply and I’ll ask you a question in response. Are ethics and social norms the result of discussions in which opinions are shared until hopefully a mutually beneficial conclusion is reached? I tend to support this idea but realize there are philosophical challenges and debates about this topic. I don’t think your or anyone’s opinion is irrelevant or I wouldn’t use my time and energy asking for it. 

You‘re referring to Kilian Jornet.  Some days he spent 14 hours on his bike while traveling between Co and Ca and Wa. He is a generational talent and this is quite the display of human endurance. 

P.S. Since I’m out of replies  here today, I’ll reply here to any further comments directed at me on this post.

Forums are rarely negotiations, they are places you can rant or otherwise express an opinion. If you disagree with someone, so be it.

I sometimes just see it as a waste of time as well. I’ll pop in and out as it suits me.

This thread is great because of Lori et al. It’s fun to rant, get engaged, participate, empathise and exit whenever you like.

Marc

MM two cushions and two life vests. My partner was young and strong so probly didn't think he needed one. Isa is stubborn and knows she doesn't need one 😞 seems like my entire position in life is to try and keep her alive 🙏 

Thing is that both of them are likely better swimmers without a pdf than I am with one but neither of them seem to recognize that they could be more effective in an emergency if they were actually wearing the fckn thing. 

Old lady H wrote:

I will confess here. Lately, I've been dragging, for no particular reason, and really with no real justification, either. I am quite fortunate, at this point in my life, to be in a position where my life is ....pretty much whatever I choose to make it. I can spend my time however I wish, and have enough to be fine. 

Okay, girl, what's your problem then?

Omg.

I think I'm having a very very late mid life crisis.

Or radically delayed puberty.

I finally reached a comfortable adulthood (ish)....

And I'm old.

How did this happen?????

That 19 year old wants her time!

 

A second adolescence is how I see it,    I have thought about returning to work just to stay current… but nooooo. I don’t want to! I keep thinking about bringing home a dog, or even a “starter dog” (cat) but it might demand something of me. I’m having a hard time just keeping my house plants alive. So right now it’s playtime, might as well go with it.

I’m sure you know, and we’ve talked about this, after many years of too much caretaking it does take longer than expected to recover and craft a new life.    You’re doing great!  Keep crafting!  

——

I’ve been doing a deep dive into my own health problems and it’s such a venture… the first doctor I saw said “cut that thing out”.  I just don’t think that way. I’m more patient and always eager to learn.  So… I have a great “team”, an Herbalist, Acupuncturist, Naturopath and Gynecologist.  There’s big progress and I feel like I will have learned so much. I think I’ll be climbing again soon, with a better understanding of self-care. 

I have hiked to some favorite spots here just to wander and sniff.  We have whole mountains of white sage. We have every kind of plant.  What I wouldn’t give to find a local herbalist who could teach me to identify the local remedies and tonics.  I’m sure he/she will show up.  

——

Daniel, I’m Not sure what the ethical question is about guiding.  Of course I have thoughts on this.  

Daniel Shively wrote:

Hi Helen, I appreciate your reply and I’ll ask you a question in response. Are ethics and social norms the result of discussions in which opinions are shared until hopefully a mutually beneficial conclusion is reached? I tend to support this idea but realize there are philosophical challenges and debates about this topic. I don’t think your or anyone’s opinion is irrelevant or I wouldn’t use my time and energy asking for it. 

P.S. Since I’m out of replies  here today, I’ll reply here to any further comments directed at me on this post.

Daniel, while it would probably be 'nice', if 'ethics' ( hard to define) and social norms resulted from the 'give and take' of rational discussion, I don't believe that historically that has been the case--usually, it seems they are 'imposed' ( either directly or indirectly)by various 'elites'. From what I have observed, this is as true for climbing as it is for other aspects of the human experience.

Edit to add: Daniel, while I was in the Valley in 1970, it was in the fall, so several months after Stoneman's. While I'm sure it was discussed, I have no specific memories of any such discussions and it definitely wasn't a major topic. We were all pretty much focused on climbing!!!! I do know that I had a fairly extended (c2 months) stay in Camp 4 that season, with no hassles from the Rangers, so it seemed pretty mellow on that regard.