New and Experienced Climbers over 50 #39

Ward Smithwrote:

Druid stones, similar to the bottom photo. 

Ah yes, nice. There are a lot of great huecos on top of the boulders up there. Much fun bouldering too.

Thunder boulder, some of the best rock and climbing at the Druids. 

phylp phylpwrote:

We’ve talked a lot about protein needs of older climbers. There’s a lot in the news the last couple of days about excess heavy metal contamination in products. NSF certification is one to look for to ensure safety, or the above non-profit has testing done too. 

Thanks, I just ran out of Orgain and looking at Optimum at Costco from now on on.

Starting campus board again. The “large rungs” as opposed to the jug. I was able to easily get 2-2-2-2 to the top but not down. Starting with 8 sets. Will migrate to the <1” medium rungs next month again. Able to do one pull-up on the 3/16” edge, but with finger drag.

   I've been a musician, it seems like my entire life: bands, recordings, performances. During this time, the technical aspects of music reproduction and dissemination have changed profoundly, as everyone can see. Music, even more than other art forms, seems to be highly adaptable and malleable to technological innovations-- at least so far. The advent of photography did not put an abrupt end to painting; it merely relegated it to a sort of permanent retirement in a gated community, so much so that most people cannot name a notable living painter alive in our time. I don't know if music will incur this same fate; sometimes it seems to me that it certainly could be headed in that direction. The very fact that music lovers are now finding it unavoidable to draw polemical distinctions between man-made and machine-made music probably does not portend well. Of course, the worst type of music listener might be the individual to whom no such distinctions matter whatsoever.

 But all art forms are located somewhere downstream from evolving technology and social change. Art itself is a form of technology. On the one hand, prehistoric humans developed early technology, such as spears and hunting strategies, to enhance their survival. On the other hand, they made drawings on rocks and in caves for the same purpose, or sang around campfires. It only looks to us like activities that are fundamentally different.

Nick Goldsmithwrote:

Hey Nick, back in the mid 90’s we used to drive up to Vermont from Pennsylvania to climb at the lake. We were young and poor so we would crawl through a window in the old abandoned  building there and bivy. It was drafty and dusty but it was shelter for us to cook and sleep and we were happy to be there. One time, passing through the last little town on the way, I think it was Lyndonville (sp?),  the bank clock temperature said -15f. Somehow we stayed psyched and didn’t get too cold at our bivy. Another time, a sheriff rolled on us, ask what we were doing, and warned us that the locals were weird and didn’t like strangers. We told him that we were weird too and strange enough to fit in. Lol.  I enjoy your photos and they remind me of a wild and adventurous time of my life. You live in a cool and beautiful part of the world.

P.S. It’s cool that one of the FA’ist of “Twenty below zero gully” Mr Al Rubin regularly posts in this thread. I remember the screaming barfies being so intense when I climbed that route  I was seriously thinking about pissing on my own hands. Lol

phylp phylpwrote:

We’ve talked a lot about protein needs of older climbers. There’s a lot in the news the last couple of days about excess heavy metal contamination in products. NSF certification is one to look for to ensure safety, or the above non-profit has testing done too. 

Another reason not to go hog-wild with daily protein goals, and eat actual food to obtain nutritional needs.

That site is interesting, but it would be nice if they would provide a list of all 165 tested products. I guess they listed the top 10% by purity, but one has no idea how "impure" the others are, and how the impurity amounts compare to safe limits set by the FDA, etc.

Even with the 5 least pure products, what is the clinical significance of all that extra cadmium, for example?

Daniel. Every ice climber I have met from PA was pretty bold. I think you guys must get on a lot of very thin ice.   I have always wondered what the back story was on that old log building? it looks like it might have been a lodge? about a decade ago someone moved it and started picking away at fixing it up. for the longest time they lived in one little room in the south corner but they keep making progress. A few years ago they had a well drilled and forced a parking spot into the hillside. Its changed a bunch there and a lot busier than it used to be... 

Nick Goldsmithwrote:

Daniel. Every ice climber I have met from PA was pretty bold. I think you guys must get of a lot of very thin ice.   I have always wondered what the back story was on that old log building? it looks like it might have been a lodge? about a decade ago someone moved it and started picking away at fixing it up. for the longest time they lived in one little room in the south corner but they keep making progress. A few years ago they had a well drilled and forced a parking spot into the hillside. Its changed a bunch there and a lot busier than it used to be... 

If you want to talk about thin people actually climb ice down here in NC. Granted we have the highest mountains in the Eastern US but we're pretty far south. I've done it a few times using borrowed gear (toprope only) but couldn't justify the cost of my own equipment given how short the season usually is.

Emil Briggswrote:

If you want to talk about thin people actually climb ice down here in NC. Granted we have the highest mountains in the Eastern US but we're pretty far south. I've done it a few times using borrowed gear (toprope only) but couldn't justify the cost of my own equipment given how short the season usually is.

Thin is in baby!

Pray for the artic blasts that hit the SE (hell we got two last yr!!!) or travel to the ice.  A rockin' military discount and a wife who like ice climbing more than rock climbing (but hates to be cold) is what keeps us in it

Jim Uwrote:

 a wife who like ice climbing more than rock climbing (but hates to be cold) is what keeps us in it

I sense an inherent contradiction here!!!! Please share with us where you two have found ice climbing that isn't cold--though if there is such a place that you share with us, I expect that it will soon become very popular!!!!

Alan Rubinwrote:

I sense an inherent contradiction here!!!! Please share with us where you two have found ice climbing that isn't cold--though if there is such a place that you share with us, I expect that it will soon become very popular!!!!

Oh dude it is absolutely a complete contradiction....lol!  She doesn't mind the cold weather but she doesn't like being cold in it.  So I am constantly telling her not to over dress (i.e. you don't go to snivel-gear level 11 on the approach)  that being said last trip to Ouray we were passing the belay jacket back and forth with a quickness. I got her the Hestra heated glove inserts because she had a previous cold-weather injury

North Carolina Hwy 215 roadcut

Working to this music...

Going to Joshua Tree Saturday to get on White Lightning and Sail Away and whatever else in those areas. Going with two newbies. Nothing difficult planned.

Permabeta wrote:

Another reason not to go hog-wild with daily protein goals, and eat actual food to obtain nutritional needs.

That site is interesting, but it would be nice if they would provide a list of all 165 tested products. I guess they listed the top 10% by purity, but one has no idea how "impure" the others are, and how the impurity amounts compare to safe limits set by the FDA, etc.

Even with the 5 least pure products, what is the clinical significance of all that extra cadmium, for example?

I believe the Consumer reports stated that lead was the primary issue with many named brands.

this place. If its full sun and no wind single digits are reasonable, teens are very pleasant, twentys are hot and upper 20s are terrifying if you actually understand what is going to happen soon..

I see way too many folks blissfully unaware of what can and will happen at the lake when its sunny and not cold enough... 

Permabetawrote:

Another reason not to go hog-wild with daily protein goals, and eat actual food to obtain nutritional needs.

That site is interesting, but it would be nice if they would provide a list of all 165 tested products. I guess they listed the top 10% by purity, but one has no idea how "impure" the others are, and how the impurity amounts compare to safe limits set by the FDA, etc.

Even with the 5 least pure products, what is the clinical significance of all that extra cadmium, for example?

Cadmium? Kidney damage, osteomalacia. "Chronic cadmium-induced kidney . . . changes are largely irreversible." Traub SJ, Hoffman RS. Chapter 88: Cadmium. Goldfrank's Toxicologic Emergencies, 11th ed. 2019. 

Nick Goldsmithwrote:

this place. If its full sun and no wind single digits are reasonable, teens are very pleasant, twentys are hot and upper 20s are terrifying if you actually understand what is going to happen soon..

I see way too many folks blissfully unaware of what can and will happen at the lake when its sunny and not cold enough... 

Yep, and if climbing a little too slowly (speaking from experience) it can turn arctic and the perfect plastic ice becomes a menagerie of dinnerplates when the sun passes over the horizon. 

Nick, I’ll share another of my goofy New England bivies. We used to frequently sleep in the tunnels running under the interstate below Cannon Cliff. It was usually a quiet and chill place, but one morning, a group of snow machine riders came blasting through nearly running us over. They looked at us all bundled up in our sleeping bags like we were some degenerate alien life form.  We also used to make the 12 plus hour drive from Pennsylvania with 4 dudes + gear in a single cab pick up. Two would ride up front and two would lay in the bed surrounded with gear, all bundled up and usually under the influence of illicit substances. I would usually listen to Joy Division on repeat through the headphones of my walk man to cultivate the required mindset for my intended routes. A few times we made this trip leaving Pa at 4 pm on Friday, arriving around sunrise Saturday, climbing Saturday, partying Saturday night, climbing Sunday  and then driving home Sunday night for work or class Monday morning. Man, if only I had some of that youthful energy stored in a bottle…

Keep posting photos and maybe include a few from Cathedral and Frankenstein so I can re live more New England adventures. 

Hailing from NOT the NE… but still JT is a pretty cool place.   I went hunting for frogs today… there weren’t any but they may have all left for Portland.

I wanted to check out Rat Rock and some of those routes like Bad Lizards .  On my way back I HAD to swing by An Eye For An Eye And A Route For a Route 5.10b. From a distance the whole wall just stands up and says hello.

I have now climbed this route twice.  One would think that little lip is no big deal.  Each time for me it was THE big deal—thatBut the whole route is so fun, so challenging. Being a Jan/Dave Houser (and Malloy… who is that?) route I really wanted to send it.  

I have been fascinated by what I think is 3 separate formations—Hunk Rock. I think I could climb a route on each rock and call it a “link up”.   The first would be Bobs route on the leading rock 

The third would be this crack climb on the farthest rock.

I have no idea how the face on the middle rock would go.

Finally… as cool rocks go… and I’ve never found it again.  

The lake gets pretty wild on a cold sunny day when water is running down the ice but then you suddenly go into the shade and stuff starts freezing again. The lake itself makes crazy booming noises as the lake ice contacts while  your ropes freeze into the ice and get stuck if you don't pull that rap line fast enough or the 2nd takes too long to clean the anchor..  With naked threads the new rage  we are seeing some stuck ropes ;) 

This shot is Isa on the Black Dike for our first climb of the season.

 We had a late start to winter but plently of water in the system. When it did get cold I made the call that the dike would go.  This is the mixed early season finish on the right #7 stopper and a yellow alien ... 

 I did not hydrate enough and right off the couch apparently it worked me pretty gud...

on the way home I got full body cramps. It was really scary as my abdomen and chest was cramping at the same time as my arms, hands , feet and legs.. stopped at a gas station and drank almost a gallon of water...  now I have instant IV for cramps. 

The problem with the first ice climb of the season is that its usually several weeks since you had a chance to rock climb so unless you make a conscious effort to keep your fitness up it can be a spanking. 

Alan Rubinwrote:

I sense an inherent contradiction here!!!! Please share with us where you two have found ice climbing that isn't cold--though if there is such a place that you share with us, I expect that it will soon become very popular!!!!

Seems relevant

WF WF51wrote:

Cadmium? Kidney damage, osteomalacia. "Chronic cadmium-induced kidney . . . changes are largely irreversible." Traub SJ, Hoffman RS. Chapter 88: Cadmium. Goldfrank's Toxicologic Emergencies, 11th ed. 2019. 

I'm aware cadmium has toxicity - that wasn't my question. 

I was wondering if the amount of cadmium, even in the dirtiest powders, was enough to pose health risks? The dose makes the poison, after all.

I see Li Hu mentions lead as the more important contaminant, and looking into it further, it appears some powders contain over 10X the recommended safe level per serving. Interestingly, plant-based protein powders may be the worst offenders, even though protein from plants is generally thought to be healthier. 

I reiterate what I said originally: yet another reason not to go hog wild with protein consumption. Long lived populations consume nowhere near what pop science nutrition is currently advocating. As with nearly every other nutrient, it's possible to consume too much protein.

Alex Smith wrote:

Interestingly, plant-based protein powders may be the worst offenders, even though protein from plants is generally thought to be healthier. 

Source?

https://www.consumerreports.org/lead/protein-powders-and-shakes-contain-high-levels-of-lead-a4206364640/

“Nearly all the plant-based products CR tested had elevated lead levels, but some were particularly concerning. Two had so much lead that CR’s experts caution against using them at all. A single serving of these protein powders contained between 1,200 and 1,600 percent of CR’s level of concern for lead, which is 0.5 micrograms per day. Two others had between 400 and 600 percent of that level per daily serving. CR experts recommend limiting these to once a week.”