Do you have a better single pitch anchor than this?

I just posted a detailed article about this topic on my website, with a breakdown of why it works, how much everything costs, and where to buy the components.

Here's the link.

If you follow my website, you probably know that all articles I've published after January 2024 have a short version on the public part and the complete version on my member portion.  For this article, I decided to publish the complete version on the public part of the website. 

• If you think you have a better single pitch anchor, post a photo of it here and share why you think it's superior.
• Are you concerned about how much it costs? Read the article for a special offer from me.
• If you read the article before posting here, it might address some of your questions.
• It’s asking a lot on this forum, but keeping comments polite and constructive is appreciated.

If you want two captive carabiners in that lower position, why drill the hole 10" above? 

Instead use a triangular quick link that will accommodate two carabiners and drill lower, eliminate the current link/chain/shackle.

Yes:

Why is this better (assuming we're talking about single pitch anchors)?

1) simpler. While your anchor proposal may be more secure in theory, in reality the increased complexity is more likely to lead to an accident than the (extremely low) chance that a pair of anchor hooks manage to get unclipped.

2) cheaper. This is a major concern when you are talking about tens of thousands of climbing anchors.

3) lower visual impact - in the US at least, high visual impact can close climbing areas. In really sensitive areas, even camouflaged anchor hooks are a bad idea, you want well camouflaged single ring hangers or similar.

I still think the perfect anchor is a 2 anchor hook set up, safety issues or no. Clean, intuitive, robust, cheap, super fast to clip in. You have to really really screw up to put yourself in danger. But that’s from a climbers perspective, not a developer or Boy Scout troop climbing guide.

 Also it looks like there’s a non 0% chance that the rope could back clip into one of those carabiners if toproping a traversing route that causes the rope to move right to left over the  anchor. 

Paired mussies ain't perfect. This happened last week.

Gunkiemikewrote:

Paired mussies ain't perfect. This happened last week.

Is that real or a set up? That looks so impossible. I mean, I get the geometry but it was stuck enough that you couldn’t dislodge it? To be fair I’ve had countless times pulling the rope and have it get snagged on a tiny twig or a tiny rock and it’s locked up tight so I’ll believe it if you say so. 

Gregger Manwrote:

If you want two captive carabiners in that lower position, why drill the hole 10" above? 

Instead use a triangular quick link that will accommodate two carabiners and drill lower, eliminate the current link/chain/shackle.

That is a fine suggestion, and it works if you are drilling an anchor from scratch.

This example is for two existing horizontal hangers.

In my article, I have another example for vertically offset bolts, which looks like this.

Gunkiemikewrote:

Paired mussies ain't perfect. This happened last week.

Yikes! 

That's kind of my point. Maybe a 1 in 1000 chance of something weird like that happening, but why not eliminate it completely?

Sort of like the unlikely event of backclipping one or both of your anchor hooks and suddenly finding yourself not attached to much of anything.

Alpine Savvywrote:

That is a fine suggestion, and it works if you are drilling an anchor from scratch.

This example is for two existing horizontal hangers.

In my article, I have another example for vertically offset bolts, which looks like this.

Lot of good content here: https://www.mountainproject.com/forum/topic/124636099/why-are-mussy-hooks-not-installed-oppositeopposed

And I much prefer a large / pear shaped quick link over a shackle. Shackles that rely on a single nut are prone to vibrational loosening and since they are not held down with gravity - will do so! There are some that solve this issue with cotter pins through the nut, but those rust quickly. I posted this in the thread above and think it’s an improvement because of the quick link: 

Maybe a 1 in 1000 chance of something weird like that happening, but why not eliminate it completely?

- Simplicity

- Cost

Who knows what kind of 1/1000 type of events will unsuspectingly pop up with this set up too. But whatever you do, just please find a way to get rid of that Frankenshackle. 

Nathan Pwrote:

Lot of good content here: https://www.mountainproject.com/forum/topic/124636099/why-are-mussy-hooks-not-installed-oppositeopposed

And I much prefer a large / pear shaped quick link over a shackle. Shackles that rely on a single nut are prone to vibrational loosening and since they are not held down with gravity - will do so! There are some that solve this issue with cotter pins through the nut, but those rust quickly. I posted this in the thread above and think it’s an improvement because of the quick link: 

Safety shackles are better than quicklinks;- stronger, cheaper, safer, harder to steal.

Alpine Savvywrote:

• Are you concerned about how much it costs? Read the article all the way for a special offer from me.

Man, I hate self-promotional spam here.

I think lower visual impact is a lost cause at any modern sport crag.   

A mussy hook or a chain or whatever is going to be insignificant in the sea of grid bolts and chalk.

Robert Swrote:

Man, I hate self-promotional spam here.

The dirtbag ethic in climbing of "cheaper is always better" is perhaps misguided when it comes to installing permanent anchors.  I'm putting up $175 of my own money to people who install anchors like this. That's the offer I'm talking about, in case you didn't bother to read the article.

Brandon Rwrote:

But whatever you do, just please find a way to get rid of that Frankenshackle. 

What's wrong with the shackle?

Greg Barneswrote:

- Simplicity

- Cost

Is a Lexus a better car than a Toyota? By most objective standards, answer is yes.

Lexus buyers think the boost in performance and safety features is worth the additional cost. 

Toyota buyers may want simplicity and low cost. More of a basic car, but it still gets you from point A to point B. 

A wider range of choices is good, making it easier per each person to determine what is "better" for them.

Gunkiemikewrote:

Paired mussies ain't perfect. This happened last week.

I've wondered if having two mussies actually increases the probably of a weird failure like this one. Which suggests that maybe we don't actually need two.

One mussy is certainly strong enough. I would categorize it as one of those components that is so beefy it doesn't need a backup, like the single steel ring on some anchors or a rigging plate used in rescue. It would wear more quickly, but all lowering anchors require the crag gets regular maintenance.

I think anchors with only one mussy would spook people and the idea would never catch on, but I wouldn't be surprised if it was actually safer than two.

Don't you want weight distributed equally on both bolts?

Jim Tittwrote:

Safety shackles are better than quicklinks;- stronger, cheaper, safer, harder to steal.

I appreciate your perspective, Jim! Certainly a matter of regional preference - shackles are not very common on this side of the pond. I agree that safety shackles are great, I have just encountered too many rusty cotter pins that are a pain and god forbid the non-safety version is installed that can rotate and open when being lowered in the wrong orientation. (See comments from ClimbBaja in link below)

Good discussion from some very experienced route equippers here: https://www.mountainproject.com/forum/topic/124544277/why-not-shackles

Keep it clean and simple. Your setup seems unnecessarily complicated. People will inevitably lower off just the hook or just the 2 steel snapgates. You'll inevitebly have problems with installers not loctiting or tightening the nut on the shackle enough. Shackle cotter pins can rust or wear out, we once had a hardware store mussy rocket down 80' from an anchor and hit nearby when the cotter pin securing it failed.  Some won't like that it's not "equalized" between the bolts, which no amount of education is going to solve.

Mussys work great on sport routes for the majority of routes and areas, whether on single quicklinks or on the end of chains. they're cost effective and hold up to tons of wear. Most climbers are familiar with them at this point. Developers using them should keep the anchor high and avoid using them on routes where folks are likely to top out above them. If the fixe draco switched to a wiregate it would be better in most ways sans cost compared to the sport bolting mussys, I'd suspect at somepoint someone will come out with a cost effective hook with a shape that is less prone to double clipping. 

For lower traffic routes, it's hard to beat chains with a captive pin steel carabiners on the end. They can be clipped opposite and opposed, share the wear, etc. It's such a good setup that people don't like using them on high traffic routes because it's already a perfect top rope anchor. In a perfect world every anchor would be this, people could TR off them, lower, etc, and everyone would just carry an allen key and a couple extra steelies with them and replace as needed. The overall cost to the average climber would be less than wearing out their own aluminum quickdraws. It's a setup that's simple, easy to use, and fairly cost effective.