Modern Arc’teryx Quality

what’s been everyone’s experience with Arc’teryx lately? I’m looking to replace my shell but finding mixed reviews about the current quality. 

Pretty poor. Had to warranty two Alpha SV jackets for delamination in the past three years. And I do wash them frequently, as recommended. Good news is the warranty still seems pretty bulletproof. 

Daniel Kaywrote:

Pretty poor. Had to warranty two Alpha SV jackets for delamination in the past three years. And I do wash them frequently, as recommended. Good news is the warranty still seems pretty bulletproof. 

Still? When was it 'bulletproof'?

Many have experienced the quality of the warranty to be similar to the quality of the garment: variable. The garment may be high quality or low quality; the warranty may be honored or dishonored.

From my own experience and having read the experience of others I conclude that there's no reliable, consistent, Arc'teryx corporate warranty policy. Rather, it's at the whim of the individual Arc'teryx agent. In real world practice that defaults in practice to 'unreliable warranty'. Arc'teryx's warranty service - stated plainly - is unpredictable. It's not like Patagonia: rock solid, predictable, reliable, you have a problem and it's their problem ... they're gonna make it right and you're gonna walk away happy.

Some will object, stating that they received exceptional warranty coverage from Arc'teryx; others will be state they received so-so warranty coverage (for ex. a discount towards the purchase of a [expensive] new item); other's will report being thoroughly screwed and told the defect/failure isn't covered by warranty ... any of these can be possible responses from Arc'teryx to the exact same customer garment complaint. Arc'teryx's warranty ... unless there's been a recent change in corporate policy very publically announced ... is a crap shoot.

The warranty is certainly variable, people seem to have better luck, in store or in Canada. Europeans seem to have much worse luck with warranty (me included). This suggests either no real policy, a vague policy, or even different policies in their European hub.

 Arc'teryx refused to warranty a know issue with a delaminating Alpha FL jacket, this was caused due to Gore removing a protective PU layer within the membrane and would cause the same premature failures that killed E-Vents brand value. Gore pulled through for me though, so I wouldn't hesitate to get goretex again provided I can afford it. 

My last interaction with their warranty department was pretty poor, and I think that’s become the norm. I’ve got a few things from them less than 5 years old that seem to have been holding up pretty well, but I wouldn’t pay their premium prices anymore knowing the warranty gamble. Especially when there are other brands making similar or better quality products and stand behind them. 

Fair, bulletproof is probably not the right word. I’ve had good experiences, but I am in the USA and always conduct my returns in person at the Boulder store. Online can be less reliable.

I wouldn’t invest real $$ to buy the brand at this point, especially not at full retail price.

If you need a serious shell for ice/alpine, go with Mountain Equipment. 

As someone who first starting buying arcteryx stuff in the 'made in canada' era of the company, and has owned ~10 of their jackets-- quality has gone down, compared to both the made-in-canada era as well as the made-in-asia era of 5 years ago (eg back when they were owned by Amer sports, not the current chinese owners) . I've stopped buying from them.

Also-- I think the fit has changed a bit? Used to fit the climber physique perfectly (broad shoulders, narrow waist, long arms) , seems more optimized for fat people now. 

it's sad, because arcteryx was one of the truly innovative clothing brands-- they invented the waterproof zipper, their harness and backpack designs were really novel, etc... 

Like most "core" outdoor brands (see marmot, tnf, etc...)  after decades of building brand legitimacy, the current owner is going through the brand extraction phase, where you market to a broader audience and make a lot of money as they destroy the brand. 

I use to live by Arc Teryrx, but for the past several years i have been all Steller Mountaim Equipment. As good or better price point, well made, long lasting and detailed for the alpine.

Made in Canada products are like gold

All others have been incredibly hit or miss

arcteryx refuses to repair a $900 nearly new alpha parka after the inner seam fell apart almost immediately because I put a piece of puffy tape on it to prevent all of the down from falling out of the vents. They acknowledged it was a manufacturing failure and happily agreed to repair it but sent it back untouched after I mailed it in with a piece of puff tape because that “voids all the warranties”. Haven’t ever been so disappointed in a brand before

Since we're talking about alternatives to Arcteryx, has anybody bought any technical apparel from Kailas? They seem to be somewhat copying their designs, I'm curious how the quality is.

i've got a jacket from them (kailas) and my wife has some pants.  i wouldn't consider either as technical apparel, but both are decent quality.  the thing to watch out for is sizing/fit...

imho arc'teryx quality and warranty sucks.  i had a duffel/pack from them that was in perfect condition on the outside but started peeling (everywhere) on the inside.  sent it back to canada, was told the best they could do was to sell me a different product (smaller, flimsy daypack) at cost.  that was about 15-20 years ago and i haven't considered an arc'teryx product since then.

in terms of warranty, patagonia has always been best on the clothing side of things and osprey for packs.  unfortunately, quality and choice of technical outerwear has really gone down for patagonia.  osprey still rocks, although i do wish they made a decent sized crag pack...

old5tenwrote:

i've got a jacket from them (kailas) and my wife has some pants.  i wouldn't consider either as technical apparel, but both are decent quality.  the thing to watch out for is sizing/fit...

imho arc'teryx quality and warranty sucks.  i had a duffel/pack from them that was in perfect condition on the outside but started peeling (everywhere) on the inside.  sent it back to canada, was told the best they could do was to sell me a different product (smaller, flimsy daypack) at cost.  that was about 15-20 years ago and i haven't considered an arc'teryx product since then.

in terms of warranty, patagonia has always been best on the clothing side of things and osprey for packs.  unfortunately, quality and choice of technical outerwear has really gone down for patagonia.  osprey still rocks, although i do wish they made a decent sized crag pack...

Good to know for the future. Would you say Kailas' sizing is generally smaller than what we're used to in North America?

Nick Niebuhrwrote:

Good to know for the future. Would you say Kailas' sizing is generally smaller than what we're used to in North America?

Yes, it's they run very small. I wear a S shirt in NA sizing and for Kailas stuff I wear an L or sometimes M.

Tanner Jameswrote:

arcteryx refuses to repair a $900 nearly new alpha parka after the inner seam fell apart almost immediately because I put a piece of puffy tape on it to prevent all of the down from falling out of the vents. They acknowledged it was a manufacturing failure and happily agreed to repair it but sent it back untouched after I mailed it in with a piece of puff tape because that “voids all the warranties”. Haven’t ever been so disappointed in a brand before

I’ve gotten myself properly worked up about this again now so here’s the jacket. I guess the inner bladder ruptured full of down and it was blowing out of every single vent in the jacket. I put puff tape just over this mesh to keep it in which apparently turned a $1000 jacket into an irreparable scrap. I’ll never buy from them again the logic just seems so insane. To be fair they did offer to “buy it back” for 20% of the total value which might be the most insulting part 

Tanner Jameswrote:

I’ve gotten myself properly worked up about this again now so here’s the jacket. I guess the inner bladder ruptured full of down and it was blowing out of every single vent in the jacket. I put puff tape just over this mesh to keep it in which apparently turned a $1000 jacket into an irreparable scrap. I’ll never buy from them again the logic just seems so insane. To be fair they did offer to “buy it back” for 20% of the total value which might be the most insulting part 

I take it there's not supposed to be down right behind the mesh?  Is there any insulation at that point? Kinda wird to me to have breathable, uninsulated panels in a puffy. 

I'm pretty handy with a sewing machine and have a fair bit of experience with down garments. Want me to repair it for you?

Gunkiemikewrote:

I take it there's not supposed to be down right behind the mesh?  Is there any insulation at that point? Kinda wird to me to have breathable, uninsulated panels in a puffy. 

I'm pretty handy with a sewing machine and have a fair bit of experience with down garments. Want me to repair it for you?

He's talking about the internal scrim not a mesh panel. That jacket would require some extreme surgery to fix it. 

The Arc'teryx corporate warranty can be similar to the USA Health Care industry ('delay, deny, depose'): do not be surprised when Arc'teryx simply denies your reasonable, factual, routine, and wholly legitimate warranty claim by using whatever excuse, justification, or rationale suits them. Do not be surprised when they simply deny responsibility for their product's defects and refuse to repair their failed product ('surgery') or refuse to provide a similarly valued replacement. End of story. Alternately, after refusing to honor their warranty and leaving you with a very expensive piece of unusable gear, they may elect to do you a 'courtesy' by instead issuing you a consulation credit ('discount') to purchase another expensive full priced item from them

Caveat emptor.

I'm a lifelong ARC'TERYX fan but had a similar warranty experience recently with one of their ever-popular Atom Hoodies. This was actually with the Atom LT Hoody (previous generation) which I bought new but had kept unworn until recently. The issue was the hem rolled up in the back and nothing I could do would get it to lay correctly. The inside of the jacket was exposed outwards and it just looked terrible. I've had several of these jackets and have never had this issue so I contacted ARC'TERYX. 

Initially they denied it was a warranty issue saying it was wear and tear. They offered me $50 for the (now $300) jacket - which I'm sure they would turn around and try to sell on their regear site for $$$. I came back and told them that was unacceptable and it was not wear and tear since the problem existed from the moment I first put the jacket on. I wanted the jacket repaired or if it couldn't be repaired, replaced. They then offered me $100 but continued to deny it was a warranty issue. This was all done through email via their online warranty/repair form, and I believe the customer service was farmed out overseas (like most of their manufacturing). I found this bargaining process insulting so I finally called and spoke with a much more accommodating representative (whom I believe was Canadian), and after reviewing the case he had me to send the jacket to a repair service in Denver. A few weeks later customer service contacted me again and informed me the jacket couldn't be repaired and would be replaced with a new jacket. 

Ultimately I feel they did what was right but this left a bad taste in my mouth. Furthermore, when you submit a warranty/repair claim, you are required to accept a Terms of Service agreement that basically signs away all your rights. It's super lame that they don't stand behind their products any more and I think someone less persistent/patient might not have had the same outcome I had.

It hasn't been my experience that their quality has decreased tremendously - most of what I've seen still seems well made - but they have definitely lost the plot in terms of catering their gear to their core audience (climbers). Their harnesses and packs have become a joke, and even the venerable Atom jacket now has a less functional "street wear" cut. And obviously, their customer service and product support has for sure taken a turn for the worse. It's sad to see such an awesome brand lose their way and I'm glad climbers are looking elsewhere.

Nick Niebuhrwrote:

Good to know for the future. Would you say Kailas' sizing is generally smaller than what we're used to in North America?

yep, what chris said.  they run small.  i usually fit somewhere between small and medium and am wearing kailas large.  if you go to the Verti Call website (two thumbs up for these guys in !!canada!!), they have fit suggestions for kailas apparel that i've found to be pretty accurate.