Quad Anchor with Two Dyneema Slings

Good lord

It’s the same as making it out of one long sling. No difference at all. It does give you the advantage of now having two slings if things go south and you need two, good thinking in that regard.

I’m a full on minimalist guy and typically use only two biners and the rope for an anchor but I’ve been climbing with someone recently who simply feels more comfortable when I use a quad. We are also climbing in an area where we are frequently rapping the route. There is simply no discussion that it is a fast and safe method and it’s no skin off my nose to use it. 

Hal Tucker wrote:

This. This. This. Why are people obsessed with carrying more stuff that also slows you down?

I’ve gone round and round with that question.

On the Hulk a few years ago, Jordan Cannon and I were at a belay 30 feet down and left of another party on another route. The leader was at the anchor and still had a dozen cams on his harness aside from a down jacket in a stuffsack that was the size of a football (it wasn’t a cold day). He also had a quart water bottle, an ATC, an auto block and gloves. He was belaying with a grigri on a quad anchor. I was rather amazed at all the gear he had placed on the pitch. He was happy and psyched.

I’ve come to realize that it’s simply a level of sophistication, a level of understanding of the real live risk and our acceptance of them that we take while climbing.

Why oh why oh why does anyone need four opposed locking biners at a two bolt top rope anchor? Because they truly do not understand the mechanics of it. They are safe beyond words, driving their car to the cliff is far less safe than their anchor.

Let them be, they’re having fun, they’re safe, they’re not your problem.  

Mark Hudon wrote:

I’m a full on minimalist guy and typically use only two biners and the rope for an anchor but I’ve been climbing with someone recently who simply feels more comfortable when I use a quad. We are also climbing in an area where we are frequently rapping the route. There is simply no discussion that it is a fast and safe method and it’s no skin off my nose to use it. 

Only way I'm doing that is if I am climbing with a romanic interest.

Is that the case for you Mark, or is this one of the people from your mentorship program? If it's the latter, you need to mentor better ;)

Naw, I have my limits but you don’t seem to really understand partnership. 

J C wrote:

Only way I'm doing that is if I am climbing with a romanic interest.

Is this your romanic interest?

It has been stated many times so far in the thread that an actual quad from 2x120 is pretty much the same as from a 240.

I like to carry a cordelette if I'm building belays, as it's easy to adapt to trad anchors. Many popular areas in my country are pure trad and anchors are built either with pro or around a fat tree.
For bolted top ropes I usually just use quickdraws. Some friends prefer one of them to be a locker and that's fine.

I'm just a gumby though, so I carry lots of stuff when climbing anyways.

RawrkCrimer wrote:

Getting back into climbing, and was doing some more research on building anchors for Top-Roping/Multipitch, and cam across this article: Quad Anchor with two 120 cm slings. They describe the process of tying two dyneema, or nylon slings together to form a quad like so:

I'd never seen this technique and am interested in it, as I'd rather just carry two slings instead of a cordelette. 

Anyone have any experience using this setup? As far as I can tell, it seems super good enough.

Looks fine. Safe and versatile.

Mark Hudon wrote:

Naw, I have my limits but you don’t seem to really understand partnership. 

Well, I only climb by myself so you're probably right. The last few times I climbed with a partner, I got annoyed at how much time belaying took when I could've been climbing, so I don't do that any more.

J C wrote:

Well, I only climb by myself so you're probably right. The last few times I climbed with a partner, I got annoyed at how much time belaying took when I could've been climbing, so I don't do that any more.

Free soloing is the way to go.

There’s no right answer. Try a few options and use what makes sense to you. What’s efficient, safe, and simple. That may be different for you vs someone else. As mentioned hopefully you can think through the physics and see the pros and cons.

About the only place I like a quad is a TR anchor that serves multiple climbs. Because it slides it may do some load sharing or at least keep one side from going slack and crossloading the biners.

For straight up sport climbs two QDs.

For multi pitch the rope or girth hitch if leading in blocks. 

Ricky Harline wrote:

Relevant bits from the AMGA SPI manual:

A single sling is fine and redundant according to the AMGA, and I find them to generally be pretty conservative in their recommendations: 

You have many options here which are fine. I think it's more to due with preference than safety with all of these. For top roping applications these are all super good enough. 

Ahhh! Yes! This is exactly what I need! Thank you!

Tom Sherman wrote:

1. Ugh, the quad. It’s stupid.

2. Jay, that doesn’t apply to this application.

3. Don’t do this with ONE 120cm dyneema sling, that’s not an anchor. Saw that on my last red rocks trip and everyone else at the belay was in love with the cute half-quad.

EDIT 4. Mark H/ Taylor, you’re not adding the second for strength, you’re adding for redundancy. 3 strands v 1. Sounds like you’ve not thought about this or don’t understand the quad.

The 120cm quad is the shiz at red rock 

Glowering wrote:

"......For straight up sport climbs two QDs...."

Owen, nice thread revival. 

I agree that using two quickdraws can be a solid anchor in many situations. That said, it’s important to exercise caution—especially with newer climbers or younger folks learning to clean a sport route. I’ve seen it happen twice at the crag over the years: a climber began dismantling the anchor, unaware that those draws—just like the ones they had been cleaning lower on the route—were their only lifeline.

I absolutely agree. I have done that too many times. Well noted! Thanks.

Mark Hudon wrote:

Let them be, they’re having fun, they’re safe, they’re not your problem.  

They are our problem when you are trying to bag that old classic one more time and the gumbies are quading and cordeletting left and right like Stanley Tucci tossing spaghetti noobing it up taking hours to build an anchor.

It's enough to give an old man grey hairs lol.

How about teaching efficiency and a real understanding? But the AMGA seems to have a pact with the gear makers to sell 10 lockers to every noob walking into REI just so they can pass their "SPI" w/e the fuck good that will do them.

A real Guide should teach efficiency. Not compliance with some insurance company approved protocol which is all about denying responsibility.

I see 4 lockers on a quad and I want to quit this sport and what the AMGA is turning it into.

hillbilly hijinks wrote:

They are our problem when you are trying to bag that old classic one more time and the gumbies are quading and cordeletting left and right like Stanley Tucci tossing spaghetti noobing it up taking hours to build an anchor.

It's enough to give an old man grey hairs lol.

How about teaching efficiency and a real understanding? But the AMGA seems to have a pact with the gear makers to sell 10 lockers to every noob walking into REI just so they can pass their "SPI" w/e the fuck good that will do them.

A real Guide should teach efficiency. Not compliance with some insurance company approved protocol which is all about denying responsibility.

I see 4 lockers on a quad and I want to quit this sport and what the AMGA is turning it into.

I wish you all the best of luck in your next hobby if you walk away from climbing over extra lockers in a situation where it really has zero impact on anyone's success.

Jason4Too wrote:

I wish you all the best of luck in your next hobby if you walk away from climbing over extra lockers in a situation where it really has zero impact on anyone's success.

Every party with extra lockers is SLOW AF and that impacts everyone in the vicinity when they get stuck behind them or have to pull their nuts out of a sling when they get benighted/afternoon storm/run out of water etc etc.

The goal of instruction should be a standard of safety that ensures efficiency. Not increasing locking carabiner sales to noobs that in a crowded climbing world claim they impacting no one else with their slowness.

RawrkCrimer wrote:

Getting back into climbing, and was doing some more research on building anchors for Top-Roping/Multipitch, and cam across this article: Quad Anchor with two 120 cm slings. They describe the process of tying two dyneema, or nylon slings together to form a quad like so:

I'd never seen this technique and am interested in it, as I'd rather just carry two slings instead of a cordelette. 

Anyone have any experience using this setup? As far as I can tell, it seems super good enough.

This abortion is not a substitution for knowing what you are doing. If you knew what you were doing you would substitute that entire rig for the rope and 2 standard carabiners with your belay device hung on its one locker between them. 

Instead you are carrying 2 extra lockers and 2 extra slings for no good reason other than your lack of understanding.

Jesus weeps every time he sees a quad on 2 bomber bolts, the easiest possible anchor to rig with the rope.

hillbilly hijinks wrote:

They are our problem when you are trying to bag that old classic one more time and the gumbies are quading and cordeletting left and right like Stanley Tucci tossing spaghetti noobing it up taking hours to build an anchor.

It's enough to give an old man grey hairs lol.

How about teaching efficiency and a real understanding? But the AMGA seems to have a pact with the gear makers to sell 10 lockers to every noob walking into REI just so they can pass their "SPI" w/e the fuck good that will do them.

A real Guide should teach efficiency. Not compliance with some insurance company approved protocol which is all about denying responsibility.

I see 4 lockers on a quad and I want to quit this sport and what the AMGA is turning it into.

Hillbilly – I’m with you on the value of versatility. The ability to adapt your systems and move efficiently is one of the most rewarding parts of developing your rockcraft.

That said, I’m not sure how the AMGA fits into this particular gripe. The American Mountain Guides Association focuses on training and certifying professional guides (and instructors)—not recreational education. Their programs are built around professional standards and risk management, not mandates for weekend warriors.

In fact, in my experience participating in AMGA courses (which is nearly all of them), I've seen very few quad anchors—easily less than 1% of setups. 

I get the frustration with overly complex anchors and carrying unecessary gear, especially when they clog up classic routes. But let’s keep the critique pointed in the right direction. Efficiency, clarity, and contextual judgment are all part of solid guiding—and good climbing tactics in general.