Bad Bolts in Las Vegas

b kwrote:

Thanks for the report. Please tell everyone you know not to top rope directly through the anchors. These are for lowering the last climber in the party.

Yikes! Those are much worse than what I normally see running around. I guess the volume the corridor gets plus all the sand in the ropes will do this fairly quickly, but that's still much worse than average.

Natalie Blackburnwrote:

Yikes! Those are much worse than what I normally see running around. I guess the volume the corridor gets plus all the sand in the ropes will do this fairly quickly, but that's still much worse than average.

These have not been up long enough for wear to be that extreme, if they were used properly (lowering the last climber in a party), rather than top roping on them. They would still be worn, but wouldn't require replacement. Obviously Black Corridor is very heavily trafficked, and the entire base is a beach, but best practices need to be reinforced otherwise an accident will happen as thousands of folks have used these unsuspectingly. They are not free to replace, nor is our time to go out there and babysit folks by making sure they don't climb on bad hardware, infinite. Please spread the word, donate to the American Safe Climbing Association, and the Southern Nevada Climbers Coalition.  

b kwrote:

These have not been up long enough for wear to be that extreme, if they were used properly (lowering the last climber in a party), rather than top roping on them. They would still be worn, but wouldn't require replacement. Obviously Black Corridor is very heavily trafficked, and the entire base is a beach, but best practices need to be reinforced otherwise an accident will happen as thousands of folks have used these unsuspectingly. They are not free to replace, nor is our time to go out there and babysit folks by making sure they don't climb on bad hardware, infinite. Please spread the word, donate to the American Safe Climbing Association, and the Southern Nevada Climbers Coalition.  

Agreed, for sure. Even if I'm just leading up before a single partner, I'll lower off my own draws, and only they will use the fixed gear. I've had this conversation at so many crags with so many groups over the years.

How long have those been up on that route? Any sharp edges on them?

These look similar to what I've pulled off routes in New Mexico when someone reports worn anchor hardware.

Seems like for some super-busy routes that less expensive plain steel lower-out hardware should be used vs SS.  They will wear out and be replaced long before rust is an issue.  Such nice 316 SS going to waste...

The left bolt here continuously spins and does not tighten.

Third anchor off the deck of Solar Slab Gulley. 

KrisGwrote:

Cameron, did you try tightening it? Or can you confirm if the nut is still tight but the bolt is wallowing in the hole? Either way I'll replace with glue-ins. Was just looking for helpful info regarding the situation.

First pitch anchors on Sendimental have been replaced.

First bolt on Pain in the Neck at Sweet Pain wall is spinning and very suspect looking.

1) the black thorn, clear light cave

2) 2nd and 3rd bolt

3) wedge bolts, the threaded portion of the bolts are wobbling inside the hole.

Also the project draws on the route say 2014 on the tag and should probably be taken down or replaced. 

b kwrote:

Thanks for the report. Please tell everyone you know not to top rope directly through the anchors. These are for lowering the last climber in the party.

Those look like the biners that are on that 10 at the gallery. I think it's gelatin pooch. Been like that for years and I keep forgetting to post about them. Please tell me those were replaced or are on the radar 

I submitted 2 reports via the SNCC website contact form in the past year about the anchors on Prime Ticket 5.11b at Universal City crag (approached from 1st pullout or Red Springs parking lot), and never received any response or updates. 

Hey Gilbert and the community at large! This is Thomas, the rebolting director for the Southern Nevada Climbers Coalition. My apologies for not seeing any of the submissions. I am working on revamping our rebolting program and one of the things on the to-do list is to update our reporting tools. I will try to get someone out to see what's going on with that anchor. Pictures go a long way to helping us see what is going on with the anchor so we can have the right tools and equipment with us when we go out to do the work. 

I would like to use this platform to announce a few events we have coming up for those who are interested in getting involved in hardware maintenance in Southern Nevada.

First up we have a SNCC public meeting on November 13th at 5-7pm. I believe it will be at the library on grand canyon and sahara but I will need to follow up with the exact location. We will announce on all social platforms and email lists so keep an eye out. The topic of this meeting will be rebolting and route development in Southern Nevada. I will be introducing myself to the community and talking about my vision for rebolting in Southern Nevada and fielding any questions the community has. We will also have a guest speaker.

That same weekend, November 15/16, we will be hosting our second ever public rebolting event following the success of the Cannibal crag rebolting event that happened this past spring. One of my goals as rebolting directior is to have a semi annual rebolting weekend every spring and fall for those who want to learn more about rebolting and volunteering their time to get involved. 

Anyone who is interested in getting involved with hardware maintenance in Southern Nevada please send me an email at thomas@southernnevadaclimbers.org and I will get you on our rebolting specific email list so you can stay informed on how to get involved. 

Thanks everyone!

Southern Nevada Climbers Coalitionwrote:

First up we have a SNCC public meeting on November 13th at 5-7pm. I believe it will be at the library on grand canyon and sahara but I will need to follow up with the exact location. We will announce on all social platforms and email lists so keep an eye out. The topic of this meeting will be rebolting and route development in Southern Nevada. I will be introducing myself to the community and talking about my vision for rebolting in Southern Nevada and fielding any questions the community has. We will also have a guest speaker.

That same weekend, November 15/16, we will be hosting our second ever public rebolting event following the success of the Cannibal crag rebolting event that happened this past spring. One of my goals as rebolting directior is to have a semi annual rebolting weekend every spring and fall for those who want to learn more about rebolting and volunteering their time to get involved. 

Hi Thomas. Thanks for planning this meeting as I think it is very much needed. Please also address bolting ethics, aesthetics, and safety. I and several other locals are concerned about an increase in questionable bolting practices including big globs of glue being dropped and left to dry on rock and bolts being added to long-existing climbs that are classified as “trad” in the guide.

To top it off, this past Sunday I witnessed something that I can only describe as atrocious. Someone was rap bolting (we heard drilling and hammering) on the Black Wall and then trundled some large rocks. I had a hard time believing what I was hearing and seeing but 3 large rocks were sent down until climbers to the left on the black wall yelled at him to stop. That is a VERY popular area used by hikers and just people wandering in general. People often end up at the base of that wall while heading up to Guardian Angel Pass or just sit up there smoking pot. I was climbing with someone on his 2nd day outside and even he knew how dangerous that was but someone experience enough to be bolting did not? The more experienced members of our party agreed that rock should not be trundled in that area on a weekend day. And on any day only with a spotter above and below the base to make sure no one is in the vicinity of the base.

It seems that so much of this would just be common sense for a climber who has advanced to the role of developer, but I guess not. Beyond the meeting, would love to see some guidance publicly coming from the SNCC on what acceptable practices are and what are not. The ethics of adding bolts to existing climbs can be argued but I believe that practices like sloppy glue jobs and trundling big rocks down onto an area that has a high potential of a family passing by threaten access and introduce a risk of having all bolting banned at Red Rock.

Adding this picture which has an arrow pointing to the person who trundled rocks about 1 hour before this picture was taken. Rapping off of anchor that was placed that morning (from what we heard and could see at a long distance) 

Thomas (the SNCC rebolting director) here. I am posting from my personal account just to show that these are my personal thoughts and not an official statement from the SNCC. 

Valerie, thank you for your detailed response. Some of your concerns are exactly what I plan to address at the upcoming public meeting. I highly encourage anyone who resonates with what Valerie is saying to come out and add your thoughts and concerns to the discussion. 

Regarding the behavior on the Black Wall: You are not the first person to tell me this story. I share your sentiment that this is totally unacceptable. No route is worth putting others in danger and it is definitely extremely poor form to be sending rocks down in that area on a busy weekend. I hope that whoever the offending developer is, is reading this and can realize that they are in the wrong and should do better next time. For you Valerie, I am glad to hear that you and the other climbers were able to get that person to stop what they were doing immediately. I hate to be writing this out but honestly, if that person was putting the life of others in danger, law enforcement should be contacted if you could not get them to stop. 

With the above being said, there is a big point that I would like to draw about my role as rebolting director and the SNCC's role in the local community. We (The SNCC/rebolting director) are not and will never be the "bolt police" or ethics enforcer. We have no authority to tell climbers what they can and cannot do. Our job is to be the voice of the local community as well as do our best to educate the climbing community on what the best modern practices are to reduce our impact on the land, other climbers and user groups, as well as to maintain positive relations with land managers to keep access open for climbing. As you pointed out, this is exactly the type of thing that can ruin our reputation with the BLM and potentially cause adverse actions to be taken. We together as a community need to actively call out the bad behavior we see and do the right thing at all times whether someone is watching or not. 

To conclude, I don’t have all the answers and I am trying my best in the position I have. I do believe that there are discussions the community needs to have and I am actively working to make that happen. Spread the word about the public meeting on November 13 and let’s continue to make climbing in Southern Nevada better. If anyone wants to contact me directly about anything new development, rebolting, or hardware in general, please email thomas@southernnevadaclimbers.org

Well said Valerie. Thank you. 

1) The Felon, Cannabis Crag

2) First bolt

3) The first bolt is protruding about a quarter inch out from the wall. See photo

Thanks!

1) Perfect Poser, The Cube (Kraft Mountain)

2) The rap bolt with a quick link directly above the route. It is painted a tan color

3) The hanger spins quite a lot, the hanger has spun so much the rock around it has worn down.

I am very interested in learning how to bolt or rebolt so I would be more than willing to help fix it, thank you!

Declan Westwrote:

1) Perfect Poser, The Cube (Kraft Mountain)

2) The rap bolt with a quick link directly above the route. It is painted a tan color

3) The hanger spins quite a lot, the hanger has spun so much the rock around it has worn down.

I am very interested in learning how to bolt or rebolt so I would be more than willing to help fix it, thank you!

Do you happen to have a picture of the bolt? If it just needs to be torqued down I can run up there and take care of it super easy.

As William mentioned, pictures are worth 1000 words. Please take pictures (and videos) of what you find out there with a detailed description of what you perceive to be the problem and steps that you took to try to fix it. When taking photos, a close up of the bolt in question is useful but also a zoomed out version showing 3-5 feet of the rock around the bolt (especially an anchor) will help make sure our rebolting team has the correct equipment on them to properly upgrade the bolt in question.

Couple updates:

-Prime ticket anchors were tightened and mussy hooks installed

-Last anchor of Crimson was inspected. The bolt in question is indeed a spinner that will not tighten but there are 2 other good bolts that can be used in that anchor so this issue is moving down the list of priority

-Harristone ford has been upgraded to glue ins 

The sixth bolt on the route Sandblaster at the Sandbox has a spinning hanger. Due to that being the crux of the climb and also a traverse across the bolt, it has worn away the rock around it. Seems like it would be a prime candidate for a glue in bolt due to the traversing nature of the climbing. The bolt did not appear to move, just the hanger sliding around.