What makes screws dull, other than bottoming them out?

or trying to force it into bullet proof NEIce. I tried tapping a express screw with a hammer lightly to start it on bullet proof ice and it bent the tooth with one light tap. This year with multiple nights at -20 and colder F many nights in the -teens the ice is so hard and dry in some placed. Smuggs specifically that instead of gripping the ice and starting the screw just powders the ice without starting. 

Nick Goldsmithwrote:

or trying to force it into bullet proof NEIce. I tried tapping a express screw with a hammer lightly to start it on bullet proof ice and it bent the tooth with one light tap. This year with multiple nights at -20 and colder F many nights in the -teens the ice is so hard and dry in some placed. Smuggs specifically that instead of gripping the ice and starting the screw just powders the ice without starting. 

Even down here in the lowly Catskills the ice is crazy hard.

There's a bit of a thread on at least one tooth that serves as a wedge to bend the tooth inward. Moral of the story - don't hammer screws.

I only tried it because thats how we did it in the 80s and it worked. Tried it once with a modern screw and was schooled quickly. 

The longer teeth of modern screws has made bending of the teeth easier. A 3 tooth design should be less prone to bending.

Nick, ares your screws really sharp? You shouldn't need to pound them even into bulletproof ice. 

Check where the thread starts on the tooth. It should be about 1/4" from the tip. The entire tooth is 3/8" deep. 

After sharpening a damaged screw the thread needs to be filed back as well to keep the proper depth.

This thread title had so much potential for great replies.

 that tooth bending event was years ago and my screws are sharp except for my 10cm at the moment but the dry ice we have this season is a real thing.  The guides at Ice bash this year trying to teach people how to place screws and the screws were just powdering the ice and spinning without grabbing at all for the first  4 centimeters. it was -17f at my house that morning. 

Nick Goldsmithwrote:

Probably hasent happened to you because you are in California. 

ouch, but we actually don't do too badly out here ;-)

lee vining - heel and toe

in a really nice season i can get my first scratches in november and my last at the beginning of april.  we don't have a lot of ice, but we do have something that doesn't exist on the eastcoast - elevation ;-)

And you have Widows tears if you have a fast car, an open schedule, solid partner on 24/7 alert and the up to date beta :)

Nick Goldsmithwrote:

And you have Widows tears if you have a fast car, an open schedule, solid partner on 24/7 alert and the up to date beta :)

Did it come in this year?

Contrary to popular belief, the primary reason screws get dull is because of microfractures due to cold temperatures. Ditch the ice clippers and carry your screws under your jacket next to your skin. Tuck your jacket inside your harness and you won’t lose them. 

Greg Rwrote:

Contrary to popular belief, the primary reason screws get dull is because of microfractures due to cold temperatures. Ditch the ice clippers and carry your screws under your jacket next to your skin. Tuck your jacket inside your harness and you won’t lose them. 

Where’s the science that demonstrates this. Also I don’t a single ice climber who is going to keep ice screws in their jacket while leasing all for the sale of not getting microfractures in the metal from cold temps. 

Ray. Humor check ✔️ 

Nick Goldsmithwrote:

Ray. Humor check ✔️ 

Damn, Greg R got me on that one! XD