New and Experienced Climbers over 50 #32

John Gill wrote:

http://publications.americanalpineclub.org/articles/13201215999

Around a campfire in the needles Mark once told us about his career as an actor. Well, he was an extra in several western movies. A very handsome guy he found himself in at least one film starring James Stewart. He recalled how Stewart would forget or muff his lines, over and over, while everyone would wait patiently for the next take.

Cool!

Kevinmurray wrote:

When I shattered my leg and it was healed I asked my ortho doctor how bad it was rated on a scale of 1-10 and what was the worst he had seen. He said it was about a 6 and that the worst was when an agricultural student at the univ. of Az, right then I knew a large amount of alchol was involved as my father-in-law was a grad of that dept. and heard lots of history. Anyway the doc says that a bunch of guys were roping mailboxes from the bed of a moving pickup and one got his leg caught up in the rope. They had to take off his foot. That was a 10.

I always though UCSB was the party school, but  wow…

In the circle of pad people that my young climbing partner hangs aparently they have all suffered a lower leg, knee or back injury. Thats Fucking stupid INMOP especially to chase a number.  well over 40 years of climbing and the only lower leg injurie I have suffered was an agrivated sprained ankle that I sprained kick boxing and then really agravated climbing Reppys a few days later. A few tweaked knees while hiking but not climbing. 

Nick Goldsmith wrote:

In the circle of pad people that my young climbing partner hangs aparently they have all suffered a lower leg, knee or back injury. Thats Fucking stupid INMOP especially to chase a number.  well over 40 years of climbing and the only lower leg injurie I have suffered was an agrivated sprained ankle that I sprained kick boxing and then really agravated climbing Reppys a few days later. A few tweaked knees while hiking but not climbing. 

Or terrible spotting capabilities!

My thoughts are to pad outdoor climbs as if one is in the gym. That would help, since many of us are used to falling from several feet being in the gym and all.

It would seem simply logical that an activity that involves constant, regular falling onto a surface (padded or not) would have a high likelihood of resulting in various skeletal injuries, even with good spotting.
 I have always liked bouldering, and still do it on a limited basis. But the prospect of falling means something very different these days.

I've been thinking about 2025.  Does anyone have plans/fitness goals?  

I haven't died yet.  Most of us here on this thread can say the same, so this is a start.  (Although I have far outlived the average life expectancy for a Type 1 Diabetic).

But as though scales from my eyes, I see things differently.  I guess the student (me) is ready... I've known that the fitness requirements for a 40 year old are not the same as for a 60 or 70 year old.  So, what are we looking at?  (I'm sure rgold knows.) 

I wish Kris Solem's wife was here, because she could advise a sane jumpstart into lifting.  I've been reading and following Dr. Stacy Sims' groundbreaking work on fitness and aging for several years.  She is an advocate for "Lift heavy shit." -- the older you are, the more important.  I was hoping climbing was enough.  Or maybe infrequent light workouts at the gym.  Or Pilates.  She's not talking about a little body sculpting, or easy exercise.  She's talking about building some substantial muscle in every major muscle group.  

This is the paragraph that came as a shock: "So if you've always lifted in the 10-12 or 15-20 repetition range, it's time to change that up. Drop those reps into 3-6 range and lift heavier weights to improve your muscle integrity, build strength, and be healthier through menopause and beyond."  

What was mentioned before (by Erika?) is that muscle is actually an integral part of our endocrine system.  Heavy lifting isn't to enhance climbing, but to increase metabolism, and MOOD.  Libido.. Immunity.  

When my gym was a block away and I knew the equipment, AND I had a failsafe routine, I could get this done 3x week.  I think I'm going to need a trainer for a little while--hopefully NOT a 28 year old hunka hunk of burnin' love.     I can't jump into deadlifts (nor does Simms recommend that).  How to start slow, progress, and build some muscle.  

I'm really looking at this for its HGH, mood and motivation.  I know a hardbody frame cranks out endocrine hormones right and left.  

This is my new 2025 goal.  Get this weight lifting thing wired.    

---

At the same time, I've been wondering about cardio... what are the Zones... where should I be?  I tuned into a podcast by Steve House and Scott Johnston this week (The Aging Athlete), and this caught my attention: to set your personal cardio, do some field measurements.  Go for a 30 minute hike, as hard as you can, as long as you can, and take your peak heart rate. The top number is your Zone 3.  ALSO, time the amount of time it takes to drop that heartrate 30 points.  That is your recovery number.

So, I did that this morning.  131 was my peak HR after 30 minutes of vigorous hiking.  It took 90 seconds to drop back to 80.  So, 131 is my Zone 3 max.(?)  I believe there are suggestions about how long to stay in each zone, weekly.  I'm about to find out... 

I actually had no idea.  

----

This may sound delusional, but I don't think I've hit my peak in climbing yet.  I think I can still get stronger and better.  And... way into fantasy land, maybe one day I can climb a 5.11.  I keep looking at Black Jack, Cleopatra, and a new route on King Dome that is at least 5.11.  Count Dracula?  Maybe not this year.  But maybe some day. 

---

A big motivator is not only the upcoming New Year, but hanging around nursing homes and hospitals for months this year... I am seeing the consequence of NOT.  I know shit happens, accidents happen, disease happens.  But, aside from that, I'd rather lift weights than wind up in a  hospital bed.  

I got a text from Tony this morning: "I have pt 9:15-10:15, 11:15-12:00, 2:00-3:00.  Busy day."  Yesterday he had clothes on!  He had color in his cheeks.  He's talking like he's motivated and plans on living.  The new rehab is a huge sparkly acute hospital... all kinds of therapists, doctors, nurses.  I'm SO happy for him.  

  

Guy Keesee wrote:

Bulwinkle’s blood….

Back then nobody was getting laid. One way to demonstrate your Manliness was to show how brave you were. People never wanted to have others point out the fact that you were “light” for drilling close to the deck.

This is something you might have mentioned 10,000 POSTS AGO!     This whole thing is about sex?  

I went back and looked harder.  I found your route... and wondered about your sanity.  I saw the first bolt, and wondered, what's even the point?  A fall before that first bolt could hurt bad. (seriously bad)

Also found the purported tree stump.

Did not see a single petroglyph.  

Glad to hear Tony is in a better place, keep fighting the good fight Lori. 

Seasons greetings to all,

Tad

I try to do all of my bouldering on a rope. I call it 'Oldering'.

Lori Milas wrote:

This is my new 2025 goal.  Get this weight lifting thing wired.    

---

At the same time, I've been wondering about cardio... what are the Zones... where should I be?  A big motivator is not only the upcoming New Year, but hanging around nursing homes and hospitals for months this year... I am seeing the consequence of NOT.  I know shit happens, accidents happen, disease happens. 

My goal is to not get injured whilst upping my climbing grades.  

But, aside from that, I'd rather lift weights than wind up in a  hospital bed.  

One 80 year old golfer I used to know shot 35 over par for the first time since he was a kid. He was a bit upset, but resigned himself that it’s better than the alternative. (We had only just been to one of his mates in a hospital with tubes up and in every single orfice.)

I got a text from Tony this morning: "I have pt 9:15-10:15, 11:15-12:00, 2:00-3:00.  Busy day."  Yesterday he had clothes on!  He had color in his cheeks.  He's talking like he's motivated and plans on living.  The new rehab is a huge sparkly acute hospital... all kinds of therapists, doctors, nurses.  I'm SO happy for him.  

Good to hear this!

Lori Milas wrote:

I've been thinking about 2025.  Does anyone have plans/fitness goals?  

I wish Kris Solem's wife was here, because she could advise a sane jumpstart into lifting.  I've been reading and following Dr. Stacy Sims' groundbreaking work on fitness and aging for several years.  She is an advocate for "Lift heavy shit." -- the older you are, the more important.  I was hoping climbing was enough.  Or maybe infrequent light workouts at the gym.  Or Pilates.  She's not talking about a little body sculpting, or easy exercise.  She's talking about building some substantial muscle in every major muscle group.  

Barbara heartily recommends: "The Barbell Prescription, Strength Training for Life After 40." By Jonathon Sullivan MD and Andy Baker.

Nick Goldsmith wrote:

In the circle of pad people that my young climbing partner hangs aparently they have all suffered a lower leg, knee or back injury. Thats Fucking stupid INMOP especially to chase a number.  well over 40 years of climbing and the only lower leg injurie I have suffered was an agrivated sprained ankle that I sprained kick boxing and then really agravated climbing Reppys a few days later. A few tweaked knees while hiking but not climbing. 

All of my bouldering in the 1950s and 1960s was modest compared to modern standards. But in those times one didn't necessarily conform to Royal's advice to Fail Falling. Unless a top rope was occasionally used. I certainly jumped off at times, but rarely fell off out of control. Nevertheless my back is a mess. If I were to advise young boulderers nowadays it would be to imagine themselves free soloing, and test their prowess by seeing what they can do under control. (I know, a laughable suggestion!)

John Gill wrote:

All of my bouldering in the 1950s and 1960s was modest compared to modern standards. But in those times one didn't necessarily conform to Royal's advice to Fail Falling. Unless a top rope was occasionally used. I certainly jumped off at times, but rarely fell off out of control. Nevertheless my back is a mess. If I were to advise young boulderers nowadays it would be to imagine themselves free soloing, and test their prowess by seeing what they can do under control. (I know, a laughable suggestion!)

"Climbing under control" is what I was taught and has stuck with me since I started. Obviously there are times one can and should let go of that mantra and go for it , for me it's usually on a steep sport climb or a well padded and spotted boulder problem. I love bouldering (hear that Todd!)and would probably do lots of it if the landings were all predictable.  Good setters in gyms definitely take good landings seriously,  bad setters have you twisting through the air unpredictably towards certain injury. 

I popped a finger tendon on Better Eat Your Wheaties (V9) in Hueco Tanks back in the 90’s but that was being young and dumb and continuing to climb despite finger pain.  I have never been injured by falling while bouldering.  Your mileage may vary, but I really think that a regular diet of falling makes your bones and overall body more resilient. I boulder in the gym a couple of  times a week and fall from pretty high all the time, and in all kinds of positions, at age 64 with no issues.  Obviously, if you haven’t been doing this for years it is a potential recipe for disaster .

Ward Smith wrote:

I’ve popped a finger tendon on Better Eat Your Wheaties (V9) in Hueco Tanks back in the 90’s but that was being young and dumb and continuing to climb despite finger pain.  I have never been injured by falling while bouldering.  Your mileage may vary, but I really think that a regular diet of falling makes your bones and overall body more resilient. I boulder in the gym a couple of  times a week and fall from pretty high all the time, and in all kinds of positions, at age 64 with no issues.  Obviously, if you haven’t been doing this for years it is a potential recipe for disaster .

Ward, admit it---you are made of rubber!!!!

I once snapped a finger tendon after not warming up at all in the ORG , it was complete stupidity that led up to that injury as well. 

John. I tried teaching him how to climb in control last summer.  then he went to college and got corrupted by the kids who climb 5.13 . Hard to listen to the old guy who barely gets up 5.10... 

Ward. You are blessed with good genetics to go with your hard work.  Many folks work just as hard as the blessed and are rewarded with endless training injuries and  joint and ligament degradation. I really saw this a lot in my decades as a martial arts instructor... 

 Worked all day and finally was able to leave the house at 2:30pm on the shortest day of the year.  got to the parking lot @3:30pm. skied up the mountain as fast as I could.  It was 7f in the parking lot that's -13.8c for Carl but it was blowing and snowing. Full conditions. Just got kitted up and touched the ice at dusk

 as always climbing a 200ft tall frozen waterfall in the dark is a surreal experience but when you add full conditions it gets even more surreal.

The exit from the steep part was much fatter and easier than last week . It's still 130ft off the deck and blowing snow in single digit temps at night... 

a nice stance after the crux

The last 70ft of snow covered slab was kind of annoying, can't feel your fingers and have to be extra cautious even though its easy climbing. Two short bulges just before the top give you two more opportunities to Fck up and die if you are not paying attention to your footwork. 

Normally I would have butt slid the walk off but alone in the dark in these temps I carefully downclimbed back to my skis and did Not put my skis on untill I was out of the woods and on the big trail. 

I am Really happy with my new rechargeable headlamps. Two pack for 20bucks on amazon.  I have a BD and a Petzl but my go to for big adventures the last few decades have been the Eveready rigs from Home despot. they are brighter and more rugged than the fancy name brand rigs.  Now I have the ultimate no name rigs. Just says LED Headlight on it..  rechargeable and silly bright. 1200 lumens. Lighter than the battery operated rigs and has an LED display that lets you know how your charge is doing.  Only had them about 10 days but so far really impressed. 

I never had the back, ankles or knees to come off boulder problems from very far up, yet I bouldered twice a week at Stoney for almost 50 years.  My answer was to get really good at going sideways.  I still have traverse problems at Stoney that are unrepeated.  Not that anyone else wants to climb sideways all the time.

I've always found that if you want to lift for fitness and not ultimate strength, do a weight where you can do about 20 reps on the first set and a couple less on each successive set.  Very little chance of hurting yourself and seems to build fitness better than doing 8 reps.  I always found failure at 8 reps was what I wanted if I was trying to maximize strength gain and at 73 that seems a stupid way to hurt myself.

Nick - is this what you are talking about?

 

My wife ordered a 2-pack and I have to say they are pretty amazing, especially considering how cheap they are. They say running time is 2 1/2 - 8 hours depending on which brightness setting you're using.

On the subject of bouldering… I only do it indoors these days but I usually do make it to a bouldering gym at least once a week. I think it really helps one improve. I try to down climb as much as possible and if I difficult move is high up, I often won’t do it. At age 66, I’m not willing to risk a twisted ankle for the sake of dominating a few temporary plastic holds. My only climbing injury that resulted in a hospital visit happened when I was in my 20s, bouldering outside (no pads back then)… I came off, landed and fell backward, dislocating an elbow. Pretty painful.

Brandt. Mine just came in a plain white box. They run more than 2hrs at full strength in single digit temps. Still showing 75percent charge after last night's adventure.