Yosemite Recommendations for Moderately Experienced Climbers (New to Trad)

Hey y'all I'm headed down to Yosemite towards the end of October (23rd thru 27th) with two other climbers. I'm looking for recommendations given our itinerary and skill levels. We are all around 5.10d/5.11a TR climbers, 5.9/5.10a sport lead, and new to trad (only lead 5.6 & 5.7 but have practiced TONS of placements on the ground and am a more capable climber than 5.6). I have a single rack of 0-5 DDM Dragons, Metolius TCU ultralight 00-4, one 4-13 nut set, and the DMM offset nut set. Collectively, we only have a 60m & 40m rope.

We will only have a few days in the park, one whole day to commit to climbing a multi pitch and another morning to do some single pitch climbing. Other than that, hike recommendations would be much appreciated! We are staying at Curry Village (very excited!) so for single pitch climbs it would be nice if they were closer to Curry Village. I'm looking for something with nice views, easy placements and preferably less runout haha. Some places I've been looking at on MP have been: Southeast Buttress, First Tier (Munginella was the rec), Swan Slab, Monday Morning Slab and The Grack Area. Thanks in advance y'all!

I assume you mean Southeast Buttress of Cathedral Peak? In October the weather will likely be very questionable and becomes much more of an alpine objective than something for beginners to mess around on. People have died there in late season due to "surprise" storms and moving slow.

The other recommendations on your list are pretty much the standard good starting points! I would recommend starting with a bunch of single pitches (including just top ropes) to get a feel for the rock. Swan slab is great for short single pitches, nearby is Jamcrack (first pitch can be easily TRed, 5.7ish, plus some harder things to try on TR from the same anchor 5.10+). Churchbowl area is another great place, although gets a bit harder (5.8+).  Five and Dime cliff you can set up TRs on some of the harder things. 

Multipitches as group of three as newbies is pretty much the definition of trouble and not recommended. I did it a few times when I just started out and am surprised none of us died... If you must, the standard easy routes of Swan Slab Gully, Munginella, Grack, After-6, etc. are fairly standard places to hang out all day having a mini-epic :P 

I appreciate the concern for Buttress, I will consider it off the list for now. As for multi pitch experience, 2 out of the three 3 group members have multi pitch climbed before, the only new part would be placing trad pro as we've only sport multi pitch climbed. Additionally, by the time we go, I will have another month and a half of trad experience on single pitches at the local crag (climbing about 2 or 3 times per week).

Unless you find a route completely to yourself, with no one planning to start up behind you within an hour (Which is relatively unlikely in the grade range you’re looking at…) i would also highly advise against multipitch’n in a group of 3.

with the experience level described, there’s about a 99% chance that anyone else who was hoping to do that route is going to be pissed off at your group, and it’s not fun having people be pissed off at you in an already semi stressful situation.

If you do end up making it happen, make sure everyone in your party is extra hyper vigilant about not raining down choss missiles on parties below you. Of the routes you mentioned, outside of swan slab, it’s a not uncommon occurrence for standard two person parties with minimal trad experience to create a dangerous situation for the people below; and a third person compounds the likelihood 

Go have your mini-epic in the manure pile or five open books, keep a good spirit, bring plenty of water, and have fun! If you take all day to climb 5 pitches then you’ll learn a lot! Props to you for showing up to the valley and figuring it out… that’s the best way. Nobody owns these routes so don’t be shy about being a beginner on a beginner route! We all learned at some point :) 

Do be considerate of rock fall especially topping out in the open books area, and let much faster parties pass if they know how to stay out of your way while doing so. Have fun!

Eric Craig wrote:

100% agree.

Hell, we went around The Valley for a week as a group of six. Usually with two leaders, but sometimes just one. We had a grand time. Some adventure,  but no epics.

This was likely a lot more viable as an option in 1989.

mine and others suggestions aren’t meant to gatekeep; it’s an attempt to steer OP in the direction which will likely yield the most fun, for their group and other parties in the area.

and to be clear, I’m absolutely not suggesting that hanging and climbing with a group is anything but epic. But having a crack at the most popular easy trade routes with a group of three, with the collective experience described here; is probably a tall order. 

Navigating the ever changing maze of “one way, wait two way, wait why am i on the left side of the road now, wait is yosemite village past curry village” roadways just to find parking is a somewhat tall order for those new to the area on a short crowded weekend

Edit: Logan; I’ll be in the valley during those dates too, feel free to hit me up if ya wanna climb and maybe we could even out those multipitch team numbers :)

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Eric Craig wrote:

Oh you are right, it's different out there now. And 21st century climbers are more territorial than we were, by a considerable amount, based on my observations from just a couple days out. Could be an anomaly. I ain't gonna worry about it. 

I am unsure of what you mean by gate keeping, basic English usage has also evolved (?), so I am not going to make any assumptions. If you have something to say,  just say it. 

Hm, i was defending myself against the loosely implied accusation of gatekeeping in prior comments.

Gatekeeping- trying to control access to a resource based on a sort of hierarchy of status? Something along those lines.

Meant no aggression towards you. Hope you also have an epic time back in the valley. 

Some great tips from everyone! Just a couple things worth noting that weren't mentioned:

Glacier Point Apron (where Grack is), as far as I know, is still a questionable place to climb with rockfall in recent years. If anyone who's in the valley more often can chime in, I'm curious if it's calmed down now that we haven't had storms in a while.

I did CS Concerto last fall, and while it is a great climb, the first pitch has some spice/runout (maybe 20-25ft of easy-ish slab without pro?) compared to the other options. Not as slippery as the After 6 start, but not as protectable either. Just be heads up and know what you're getting yourself into. If you do go for it, you can follow the ledge after the first pitch to get on the rest of After 6 instead, which at your indicated level of climbing I'd probably recommend.

I do recommend a trip up to Tuolumne if the weather is good and you're up for it (1hr drive from the valley). Tenaya Peak may be a better bet than Cathedral if you end up there - shorter, steeper approach, but the climbing is easier and it's a little less crowded, and shouldn't take as long (though the walkoff is annoying). It's still a capital M "Mountain" though, and a keen look at the weather / watching for any signs of clouds is advised. That said, Cathedral has one of the best 360d views of any 5.6 in the world. But it should not be taken lightly. Bull Dozier / Holdless Horror are also straightforward 3-4 multipitch options, and there are a few spots for single pitch (like the Guide Cracks) there too.

For hikes, there's only a few main recommendations (much like the number of high quality 5.6/5.7 routes you're looking at), but likewise they're all exceptional. Yosemite Falls Trail, Mist Trail (potentially all the way up to Clouds Rest), 4mi Trail up to Glacier Point (longer than 4mi). They're all steep and beautiful and give different perspectives of the valley. There are obviously more, but those are the big ones. Have a blast!

Knob hill has a couple of 2 pitch 5.7s. Rap required not walk off.
someone above mentioned church bowl tree, but that iirc that is 10a. I think they meant church bowl lieback 5.7/5.8.

Leave the 40m rope at home. Get another 60m rope for the trip. The older/classic routes in the valley were established with 150', or 165' (50m) ropes. Many routes require rappelling with two ropes. Having mismatched rope lengths is inviting trouble, especially for the less-experienced and a 3-person team. Others may offer differing opinions. My position is that any rope shorter than 50m has no place in Yosemite, with the obvious exception of bouldering.

Scenario: Climber A leads a 46m pitch to the standard belay anchor. Climber B follows and gets 36m up the pitch, trailing the 40m rope.. Climber C, below, begins yelling against the wind that "You are out of rope!"  Communication is difficult. What to do?

Scenario: Your team reaches the top. A 48m rappel is required to reach the next anchor at a small ledge. That ledge and rope ends may not be visible from the top. It's still another 48m to the ground. Climber A rappels to the end of the 40m rope. He was smart enough to tie a stopper knot in the end of each rope, so fortunately didn't rappel off the end of the rope. However, he now finds himself dangling in space, below a roof and several meters above the ledge. What to do? 

Agreed that Manure Pile Buttress (aka Ranger Rock) is a good place to start. Perhaps aspire to doing the classic "Nutcracker" 5.8 route by the end of your week. 

Enjoy your trip to Yosemite.

Ditto on the longer second rope…

ClimbBajawrote:

Leave the 40m rope at home. Get another 60m rope for the trip. The older/classic routes in the valley were established with 150', or 165' (50m) ropes. Many routes require rappelling with two ropes. Having mismatched rope lengths is inviting trouble, especially for the less-experienced and a 3-person team. Others may offer differing opinions. My position is that any rope shorter than 50m has no place in Yosemite, with the obvious exception of bouldering.

Scenario: Climber A leads a 46m pitch to the standard belay anchor. Climber B follows and gets 36m up the pitch, trailing the 40m rope.. Climber C, below, begins yelling against the wind that "You are out of rope!"  Communication is difficult. What to do?

Scenario: Your team reaches the top. A 48m rappel is required to reach the next anchor at a small ledge. That ledge and rope ends may not be visible from the top. It's still another 48m to the ground. Climber A rappels to the end of the 40m rope. He was smart enough to tie a stopper knot in the end of each rope, so fortunately didn't rappel off the end of the rope. However, he now finds himself dangling in space, below a roof and several meters above the ledge. What to do? 

Agreed that Manure Pile Buttress (aka Ranger Rock) is a good place to start. Perhaps aspire to doing the classic "Nutcracker" 5.8 route by the end of your week. 

Enjoy your trip to Yosemite.

Not to completely disregard your concern (we're very strongly considering/trying hard to get another rope) but we will all have rockie talkies and are competent in rope ascension using two prusiks, a garda hitch, and a sling. 

As a general reply to all: I definitely see the concern for respecting other climbers. We planned this trip later in the season to avoid peak busyness and as a group we will work on our efficiency and plan of action for climbing without putting others at risk. On the flip side, there's always going to be newer, slower climbers on routes. As a member of other outdoor communities for significantly longer (10+ years of skiing, mtn biking, whitewater kayaking) I understand both the frustration of newer users interfering with the flow and safety of other, more experienced, users. That being said, I find joy in seeing the outdoor communities that I'm a part of grow, even if that means more, slower people (for example) biking on the trails that I once ripped down. Coming around to my reason for posting here, I know that I have the potential to be annoying to other users so I wanted to hear both critical and positive feedback on how to minimize that impact. Thanks all for the responses and especially thanks for the positivity, I know online forums sometimes trend towards being toxic. My group and I will take into consideration all of the feedback (especially trying to add a 4th climber!) to climb as safely and respectfully as possible, feel free to add more if there's anything that's been missed or overlooked. 

Jason Pirolowrote:

Unless you find a route completely to yourself, with no one planning to start up behind you within an hour (Which is relatively unlikely in the grade range you’re looking at…) i would also highly advise against multipitch’n in a group of 3.

with the experience level described, there’s about a 99% chance that anyone else who was hoping to do that route is going to be pissed off at your group, and it’s not fun having people be pissed off at you in an already semi stressful situation.

If you do end up making it happen, make sure everyone in your party is extra hyper vigilant about not raining down choss missiles on parties below you. Of the routes you mentioned, outside of swan slab, it’s a not uncommon occurrence for standard two person parties with minimal trad experience to create a dangerous situation for the people below; and a third person compounds the likelihood 

Absolutely, we will be prepared as much as possible and really try to add that 4th climber to have two leaders going at once. That being said, climbing in Yosemite is potentially a once in a lifetime (or at least in a very long time) opportunity and it would suck to see the climbing community mad about other climbers taking the opportunity to experience it (provided safety isn't compromised, which we're working very hard to ensure). 

Logan Wendelwrote:

We planned this trip later in the season to avoid peak busyness and as a group we will work on our efficiency and plan of action for climbing without putting others at risk. 

FYI, late October is pretty much peak climber season in the Valley.

You could consider the Cookie Sheet https://www.mountainproject.com/area/106671314/the-cookie-sheet

It has moderate, reasonably well-protected routes up to 4 pitches and is a lot less popular than Munginella or the Manure Pile. Decent views of the Merced Canyon. You need 2 60m ropes to get down, though.

Logan Wendel wrote:

Not to completely disregard your concern (we're very strongly considering/trying hard to get another rope) but we will all have rockie talkies and are competent in rope ascension using two prusiks, a garda hitch, and a sling.

Also, let's game this out a little. I honestly don't mean this to be condescending; think of it as an opportunity to pre-solve some problems you might run into. We all figure this stuff out somehow when we're starting.

Scenario 1: You used your rockie talkie and successfully communicated that the leader is running out of rope. Yay! what's next? your rope is still to short to reach the next anchor. What are your options?

Scenario 2: You successfully re-ascend back to the anchor, after communicating with your rockie talkie. Yay! What's next? your rope is still too short to reach the ground. What are your options?

This is fun. For scenario one the leader simply goes to the top, continuing to set up the 40m. Follower number one clips into the 60m on an alpine butterfly and climbs the 10m to the end of the 40m. They clip into the 40m, and unclip from the 60m. The leader, then belays follower one to the top, at which point the third clips into (or is, even better, already clipped in with a clean anchor because we tied a hands free knot on the ATC) the 60m tail (with 4 meters to spare/able to ask for more to be lowered) and is belayed by the second. Alternatively, the leader could belay both of them at the same time once the first follower is on the 40m and off the 60m.

Scenario two doesn’t make a ton of sense to me because if we know we need a rappel longer than 40m we can simply find the midpoint of our ~99m rope and set up a carabiner block on the same end as the fisherman’s bend. That way, once at the knot, the belayer can use two prusiks to transfer all their weight to one strand (the side without the fisherman’s), pass their belay device below the knot, re-engage their belay system, test their belay system, and remove the prusiks.

Knots were “generalized” in this, wether the climber uses a figure 8, fig 8 on a bight, butterfly, etc isn’t necessarily consequential, unless you want to have that 3rd follower be “on belay” as a backup while they’re cleaning (of course they’ve already clove hitched themselves to a draw as well so they’re not weighting the rope accidentally)

Nkane 1wrote:

FYI, late October is pretty much peak climber season in the Valley.

Welp, I was under the impression that spring and early October were the main seasons, with late October being a step quieter. Absolutely right tho that it’s not considered “off season” 

Logan Wendelwrote:

Three paragraphs of faff…

Wut in tarnation??? Bruh, please heed the friendly advice and avoid the impending fustercluck that is the above post 

Given you are in Boise between now and then make a couple of trip to the City of Rocks, there are many one pitch trad routes at the lower grades that you can begin to figure out what trad leading is all about. And this time of year lots of people around. Also the rock is granite. That way when you get to the valley you will not be a complete knob and perhaps have a more enjoyable time.

A side comment. Your thread title of being moderately experienced has a typo, it should have been inexperienced.

Christian Heschwrote:

Wut in tarnation??? Bruh, please heed the friendly advice and avoid the impending fustercluck that is the above post 

Lol, yes but all this talk about ropes is besides the point. After the anchor that he builds after “ lots of practice on the ground” fails while he’s belaying his clueless partners, they won’t have to worry about the rope length.
Sorry I shouldn’t be so cynical…

Allen Sandersonwrote:

… moderately experienced has a typo, it should have been inexperienced.

Interesting definition of inexperienced, Oxford dictionary disagrees with you :)