Carrying a rack

I started racking on a shoulder sling in 77 and never found a reason to change. I sew my own now with a fat pad and 9/16" tubular webbing. Those Metolius ones are flimsy. For sport I do rack draws on my harness. I am always amused when I see gripped climbers frantically doing a reach around to find the cam they can't see on the opposite hip. On a shoulder sling you can pull the cams into view, or stage the next needed cams right under your chin. 

My main partners also do shoulder sling racking. They rack onto their sling while cleaning my pitch. When they arrive at my anchor, they grab whatever cams I didn't place from my rack and swing on through to the next pitch. If they don't want to lead that pitch, I grab their organized rack and head up. 

Others have mentioned the chimney thing, super easy to switch shoulders. I'm well aware that all the young strong climbers rack on the hip, but to each his own. At the end of the day, it's nice to throw the rack on the ground or in the pack, instead of picking it piecemeal off your harness.

Tony Danzawrote:

Have fun catching big whips with a hip belay. Sure it’ll probably work but it ain’t gonna feel great. And lowering on a hip belay, yea that’s super comfortable. When’s the last time you saw a pro climber hip belaying someone on anything harder than 5.6? Or hell when’s the last time you saw anyone at a sport crag hip belaying at all? 

It’s goofball because it puts the ATC or Gri Gri in an awkward position, for belaying, and especially for rappelling. Why do you think they invented the belay loop? So Big Harness could sell you more shit?? 

Enough with this old guy trad dad shit. They invented belay devices because they’re BETTER. They invented belay loops and leg loops because they’re BETTER. You can choose not to use it, but it’s like saying a horse and buggy is just as effective as a car, or a tin can and string is just as effective as a cell phone.

I have caught some long falls with a hip belay and lowered people as well, no lasting burn scars. I also don't see the need for an expensive belay device that is bulky when an atc or even an old sticht plate with a spring will work just fine. Also see no need for a pas or cordelette when shoulder slings and basic rope management skills are all you need. Do you buy the newest cell phone when it  comes out just to be the cool kid on the block. I don't like anything that gets in my way or is bulky.

Caleb BRwrote:

I almost always carry my rack on my harness, but I will clean gear to a single length sling wrapped around my chest pretty often. I find I can clip nuts to it especially and yank on them without having to worry about them popping out of my hands when they come loose. 

Let's see if I picture this correctly. A piece of gear is still in the rock and you connect it to your over-the-shoulder sling? 

So if you were to slip off the rock ... you would either strangle yourself or at least break a couple of ribs?

Patrikwrote:

Let's see if I picture this correctly. A piece of gear is still in the rock and you connect it to your over-the-shoulder sling? 

So if you were to slip off the rock ... you would either strangle yourself or at least break a couple of ribs?

or the sling just slips harmlessly off, but yeah pretty much. If it was safe, it would be golf. 

I respect what anybody else wants to do because it doesn't impact me but man, I'd rather not even climb if I had to rack gear on a sling instead of my harness. It's the most frustrating experience having all your stuff slide down into a cluster fuck at the bottom of a sling. And yes, I have a metolius gear sling with organizer loops I've tried too, it sucks. The weight of the stuff will pull it down/rotate the sling to your hip and even if it doesn't, having gear free hanging from the sling in front of you just makes no sense to me for climbing hard.  

6 gear loops, keep it all organized at all times even when cleaning, and I'll die on this hill. But again, idgaf what anybody else does so long as it works for them and they're happy with it. 

Caleb BRwrote:

or the sling just slips harmlessly off, but yeah pretty much. If it was safe, it would be golf. 

Well, ... here's how to "golf":

1) Follower arrives at a gear placement.

2) Follower takes gear out of the rock (without unclipping it from the rope). If he drops it, it will still dangle on the rope. 

3) Clip the gear end of the draw to chest sling.

4) Unclip rope end of draw from rope. 

5) Optionally, if the draw was an extended alpine, triple it up.  

   ... safer than swinging a #2 iron and risking a shoulder dislocation.

Gear sling sightings out climbing today = 0

Stay tuned. Will report back on all subsequent climbing outings. 

Cosmic Hotdogwrote:

I respect what anybody else wants to do because it doesn't impact me but man, I'd rather not even climb if I had to rack gear on a sling instead of my harness. It's the most frustrating experience having all your stuff slide down into a cluster fuck at the bottom of a sling. And yes, I have a metolius gear sling with organizer loops I've tried too, it sucks. The weight of the stuff will pull it down/rotate the sling to your hip and even if it doesn't, having gear free hanging from the sling in front of you just makes no sense to me for climbing hard.  

6 gear loops, keep it all organized at all times even when cleaning, and I'll die on this hill. But again, idgaf what anybody else does so long as it works for them and they're happy with it. 

Kinda depends on where and what you're climbing.

Here's Henry Barber and his rack in Australia, 2007:

Photo: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/25/Henry_Barber_-_Australia_2007.jpg

While this is just plain ridiculous:

Photo: https://climbinghouse.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/01/trad_rack_on_climber.webp

I don’t believe I have read what I feel is one big positive to racking on a gear sling - being able to quickly remove the weight after leading a pitch and relaxing a bit while belaying the 2nd without the weight, bulk of the gear hanging on you.

Cosmic Hotdogwrote:

I'd rather not even climb if I had to rack gear on a sling instead of my harness. It's the most frustrating experience having all your stuff slide down into a cluster fuck at the bottom of a sling. And yes, I have a metolius gear sling with organizer loops I've tried too, it sucks. The weight of the stuff will pull it down/rotate the sling to your hip and even if it doesn't, having gear free hanging from the sling in front of you just makes no sense to me for climbing hard.  

Steph Davis has this to say:

But of course she doesn't do any "hard" climbing.  Just things like first woman to free the Salathe 13 b/c, first female ascent Tricks are for Kids 13a/b.

I also don't care what other people's choices are for racking. Personally, I have restricted mobility in my neck and mid-back which makes using a gear sling less painful and easier to use than racking on my gear loops, when it comes to a full trad rack. Plus I'm very competent at it since gear loops on harnesses is a pretty new invention. This is what the first webbing harnesses looked like.  You don't try to clip gear into 2" webbing. This is me leading an 11a/b pitch with gear on a tied sling.  It's really not a problem and keeps the gear right where I want it so that it can be unracked with either hand as needed.  It's not unfrequent to be in a position where you can't let go with one hand or another. I can't even imagine having to torque around to get something off the far back of my left side with my right hand.

 I get that it makes no sense to YOU to rack on a sling, and I certainly understand that many of the hardest trad climbers of today rack on their gear loops, but gear slings sure work for plenty of people.

I like a mix between the harness and a gear sling.  If I'm climbing closer to my limit I'll often have a double set of cams which feels to much to have on the harness.  I'll generally have nuts and small cams upon to a .75 size on the gear sling and then a set of small to med (c3's to a 1 or 2) on one side and bigger cams on the other with draws on the back.  for easier stuff like a flatiron where I have a lighter rack I'll just rack on the harness.

Gear sling swings back and forth too much if I am leading on hard (for me) terrain. If leading while swinging leads I can throw all the extra gear on a sling and hang it from the anchor while belaying anyways, so it isn't like the handoff gets harder.

If we are leading in blocks I do sometimes use a sling to clean while following so I can pass it off easier. This is enough experience climbing with a gear sling is kinda annoying.

Big pro of a gear sling is that it simplifies gear organization. But if you can keep the gear needed down, then you don't need to introduce more gear to simplify your gear. Kinda like how you don't need a burly and heavy backpack while backpacking if you can keep your weight low in the first place.

The feeling of having to swing your heavy gear sling out in front of you, inevitably having it caught up on the rope and/or other gear, and then needing to dig through the mashed biners to reach a piece is incredibly frustrating. Rack on harness for me.

Victor Creazziwrote:

I'm a gear on a sling guy, but it doesn't save time when swinging leads because everyone else racks on their harness. I also carry 60cm slings over a shoulder and when I hand them off they get turned into alpine draws.

I know, I just roll my eyes and start passing every individual piece across wondering when one of them is going to get dropped.

Big Redwrote: The feeling of having to swing your heavy gear sling out in front of you, inevitably having it caught up on the rope and/or other gear, and then needing to dig through the mashed biners to reach a piece is incredibly frustrating. Rack on harness for me.

Yeah, went with ultralights to avoid the weight. Just swing the thing back over your shoulder.

Deja vu. Just a few threads down. Does this not apply?

https://www.mountainproject.com/forum/topic/126590526/alpine-draw-vs-runner-over-the-shoulder

phylp phylpwrote:

Steph Davis has this to say:

But of course she doesn't do any "hard" climbing.  Just things like first woman to free the Salathe 13 b/c, first female ascent Tricks are for Kids 13a/b.

I also don't care what other people's choices are for racking. Personally, I have restricted mobility in my neck and mid-back which makes using a gear sling less painful and easier to use than racking on my gear loops, when it comes to a full trad rack. Plus I'm very competent at it since gear loops on harnesses is a pretty new invention. This is what the first webbing harnesses looked like.  You don't try to clip gear into 2" webbing. This is me leading an 11a/b pitch with gear on a tied sling.  It's really not a problem and keeps the gear right where I want it so that it can be unracked with either hand as needed.  It's not unfrequent to be in a position where you can't let go with one hand or another. I can't even imagine having to torque around to get something off the far back of my left side with my right hand.

 I get that it makes no sense to YOU to rack on a sling, and I certainly understand that many of the hardest trad climbers of today rack on their gear loops, but gear slings sure work for plenty of people.

Selectively quoting parts of what I said most certainly helps you make your point, but takes away from 2 very purposeful and deliberate sentences I included in my post, which were:

"I respect what anybody else wants to do because it doesn't impact me"

and 

"idgaf what anybody else does so long as it works for them and they're happy with it."

While this is just plain ridiculous:

Photo: https://climbinghouse.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/01/trad_rack_on_climber.webp

Shrug   . Different strokes for different folks. Take away the fat cordelletes and oversized nuts in that pic, replace them with more cams, and my harness doesn't look far off when I'm projecting at my limit. It works for me and I like it.

If a sling works for somebody else - sweet! Not my jam, but if somebody climbs safely, efficiently, and has skill then I don't care how they handle racking their gear.

Patrikwrote:

Let's see if I picture this correctly. A piece of gear is still in the rock and you connect it to your over-the-shoulder sling? 

So if you were to slip off the rock ... you would either strangle yourself or at least break a couple of ribs?

<< In April Dune was established by Duane Raleigh solo on the southwest tower (III, 5.10, A-3+, 5 pitches). Raleigh’s night descent from the 500-foot tower turned into an epic when he became disconnected from the rope while on the second rappel. He free-fell about 160 feet. Miraculously his 9mm haul line, which was clipped to an equipment sling, jammed in a crack during the fall and brought him to a tenuous arrest. The impact bent a carabiner and badly damaged the rope. Steve Swanke, the park’s climbing ranger, assisted by lighting the way for the remaining descent. A jammed carabiner gate is the probable cause of Duane’s fall which, had it not checked itself, would have continued another 200 feet to the ground.>>

I'm not sure that he actually broke anything!

Remember the days when if people pondered about the different ways to rack and carry gear, they just, you know, tried the different ways, and then picked one?  This seems like a good way to avoid the petty pissing contests that happen here whenever someone asks a simple ass question they don't really need to ask.