New and Experienced Climbers Over 50 #28

Bob Gaineswrote:

Hi Carl, you might be interested in this book that I coauthored with Jason Martin:

Rock Climbing: The AMGA Single Pitch Manual

It's the textbook for the American Mountain Guides Association's Single Pitch Instructor Course, formerly known as "Toprope Site Manager."

Ha! I was just reading through this tonight. Thanks for your work with this, Bob.

Lori, garden is all planted.  I have 16 tomatoes, 3 poblano chilies, 1 habanero, 1 jalapeno, 1 cayenne and 1 habanada (habanero with no heat). I also have basil, thai basil, rosemary, thyme, oregano, chives and garlic all growing and doing well.  I have 4 stalks of giant sunflower growing that are all about 4 feet tall and just starting to form flowers.  These are volunteers planted by my squirrels.  I've never grown them before so I have no idea how long it takes before the flowers open. I also am trying to sprout a few hot chili plants of various sorts that someone gave me seeds for - these all have wierd names.

Hi everyone.

So, I got my ticket to join y'all this morning.  I'm glad to be here.

Bob Gaineswrote:

Hi Carl, you might be interested in this book that I coauthored with Jason Martin:

Rock Climbing: The AMGA Single Pitch Manual

It's the textbook for the American Mountain Guides Association's Single Pitch Instructor Course, formerly known as "Toprope Site Manager."

Thank Bob I’ll look it up. 

Dave Bakerwrote:

Hi everyone.

So, I got my ticket to join y'all this morning.  I'm glad to be here.

Happy birthday and welcome!

Dave- welcome. Tell the truth. A day of celebration or a day of mourning?

Driving fast…. I can sit tight while Jan drives like mad because I know he has spent time on the track, like Me, auto racing. So he knows what it feels like to spin, and most importantly what it feels like just before spinning. He won’t do something dumb and panic. This only applies to his WRX the Tacoma is another story and thank god he knows it’s a fat, ill handling beast, and when it’s spins it’s gone….. !!

Me, I don’t drive fast on the street anymore, it’s not worth it.

Carl- good on you for passing on the skills to someone new. It’s our duty and responsibility as climbers.

The farm…. I got in on a truck load of some of the finest dirt I have ever seen and spent the last two days shoveling dirt and changing out the old dirt in the container's. I have some sprouted Tomatoes, Peppers and Basil but they need a few more weeks in the window. It’s spring time.

Going to go climbing Sun/Monday somewhere warm.

Later all 

Dave Bakerwrote:

Hi everyone.

So, I got my ticket to join y'all this morning.  I'm glad to be here.

Happy Birthday!

I met Wendy Weiss in person today at the Jim Garber memorial. Nice to meet you Wendy. I figured it was only a matter of time before we crossed paths.

Welcome Dave and happy birthday! Someone will card you at the window, you can’t just sneak in Willy nilly.  

Jan and Guy, you just embolden Tony. There were terrific winds and dust storm on the 10 coming home with hardly any visibility and Tony gets in the fast lane and guns it. I asked him what the hell he’s doing, and he said “we have to cut through the wind.“ is he mad at me about something?   Nowhere to run in the car with him… Nowhere to hide.

Jan, HECK. Your Garden sounds great and I’m getting ready to kick mine to the curb. I don’t know if I’m ready to watch my meager plantings night and day and ward off horrible creatures, and hang rubber snakes just to get a few tomatoes. The wind has already trashed my rannunculas and I just shrug my shoulders and say to hell with it.  I don’t think I saw poblano peppers on your list. Those are my favorite and I think our Mexican housekeeper would be happy to show me how to roast and peel them and make chili rellano.  

I have a great idea for all of us. What if we formed a little commune on a vineyard?  is anyone into growing grapes?  Dark black loam and summers drinking wine and recalling the best of Climbing days.  In another reality, I’m already there.

—-

I haven’t dug into Eric Horst’s book yet but I am grateful for mention above of “power endurance”.  As for endurance, I can walk hard forever. As for strength, I can do limited weights, etc. But as for jumping on the Decompensator or any other sustained hard route, I have to take long rests to keep going. Halfway there the muscles in my legs, arms and fingers are fatigued to failure, and then it’s a slug fest the rest of the way.  so I have to find a way to train so that I can go longer without totally crapping out.  Anxious to get started on a program.

Victor Creazziwrote:

I met Wendy Weiss in person today at the Jim Garber memorial. Nice to meet you Wendy. I figured it was only a matter of time before we crossed paths.

Nice to meet you too Victor. The climbing community in Boulder is a small world, as the memorial today demonstrated. It was very well done and the reminiscences and tributes were touching.

Lori, As with most of those who write or lecture on training, when discussing endurance training Horst focuses on upper body/ whole body training---which is valuable for all types of climbing, of course. But slabs do put particular strain on the legs---the calves in particular, and also , feet, ankles, and toes, and I don't recall any specific instructions or exercises to develop endurance in those muscles. My thought is that you should find some slabby boulders---either straight up or traverses, that rely primarily on the lower extremities and work on laps on them, I think that no hands problems---even one handed ones, would be particularly helpful. I think that it is primarily as matter of 'repetition' over  time to build up the strength, then endurance of those muscles. I know that when I haven't climbed slab in a while, I find that my calves are 'screaming' even during a pitch of relatively moderate difficulty once I start climbing them again. However, usually after a few pitches---with rest and recovery periods in-between, I get back into the groove and my toes and calves start to behave.

Street racing is stupid. to many uncontrollable objective hazards..  think Isle of Man but with no stewards keeping the trac clean and log trucks going the wrong way...  I believe that if there was a legit track near us that we could have raced on and learned the difference between track and street that maybe my best friend Jack would have made it to 21... 

The calm before the storm. I chopped a hole in the ice last night

we did 4 plunges and 3 saunas.  woke up to a blizzard

couldn't talk Isa or myself into ice climbing tomorrow  so going skiing again in the morning. .. 

Alan Rubinwrote:

Lori, As with most of those who write or lecture on training, when discussing endurance training Horst focuses on upper body/ whole body training---which is valuable for all types of climbing, of course. But slabs do put particular strain on the legs---the calves in particular, and also , feet, ankles, and toes, and I don't recall any specific instructions or exercises to develop endurance in those muscles. My thought is that you should find some slabby boulders---either straight up or traverses, that rely primarily on the lower extremities and work on laps on them, I think that no hands problems---even one handed ones, would be particularly helpful. I think that it is primarily as matter of 'repetition' over  time to build up the strength, then endurance of those muscles. I know that when I haven't climbed slab in a while, I find that my calves are 'screaming' even during a pitch of relatively moderate difficulty once I start climbing them again. However, usually after a few pitches---with rest and recovery periods in-between, I get back into the groove and my toes and calves start to behave.

BITD when climbs were less than vertical, legs used to matter.  Now they are used as afterthoughts for things like flagging, backstepping, and knee-barring, and are often just nuisances to get the rope behind and flip you upside down.  Oh, they are also useful for toe-hooking volumes and so hanging upside down.  But unless there has been some San Andreas Fault action I haven't heard about, JT has still got a lot of that old-timey slab and you ain't gonna mono-doit your way up that shit.

An obvious training suggestion would be calf raises, but I never found them to be all that helpful.  Surprisingly better, although approaching the outer limits of tedium, is an exercise in which you raise up on the toes of one foot and just hold that position for 1 or 2 minutes, and then do the other foot and alternate for a few sets of an exquisite combination of searing pain and mind-numbing ennui. If it helps, you can pretend you are drilling bolts on the lead on the Bachar-Yerian. Having abandoned my ballet career long before I ever started it, there is no way I can balance unaided en pointe for two minutes, so I've always used something to hang onto for that exercise.

Climbing at the Adelaide Bouldering Club. 

I’m weak and everything’s hard but I got an Orange. 

This place never changes, it’s like it’s locked in time. It always feels like home.

https://youtube.com/shorts/0hjj14zXDLQ?si=t3lTuFyOZvj_rqyn

rgoldwrote:

BITD when climbs were less than vertical, legs used to matter.  Now they are used as afterthoughts for things like flagging, backstepping, and knee-barring, and are often just nuisances to get the rope behind and flip you upside down.  Oh, they are also useful for toe-hooking volumes and so hanging upside down.  But unless there has been some San Andreas Fault action I haven't heard about, JT has still got a lot of that old-timey slab and you ain't gonna mono-doit your way up that shit.

This is *priceless*.

Anyone have night cramps in the calves after a multi pitch slab day? I sometimes do. They tend to go away if I can maintain some consistency with longer slab days—say, a couple days a week.
As an aside, I also get a cramp in my chest right under the end of a right side rib whenever I have to really bend over to put my shoes on. (There’s a MP thread somewhere about this.) This chest cramp is always in the same exact spot about the size of a quarter—really annoying.
Any good cramp solutions out there? Bananas?

rgoldwrote:

BITD when climbs were less than vertical, legs used to matter.  Now they are used as afterthoughts for things like flagging, backstepping, and knee-barring, and are often just nuisances to get the rope behind and flip you upside down.  Oh, they are also useful for toe-hooking volumes and so hanging upside down.  But unless there has been some San Andreas Fault action I haven't heard about, JT has still got a lot of that old-timey slab and you ain't gonna mono-doit your way up that shit.

An obvious training suggestion would be calf raises, but I never found them to be all that helpful.  Surprisingly better, although approaching the outer limits of tedium, is an exercise in which you raise up on the toes of one foot and just hold that position for 1 or 2 minutes, and then do the other foot and alternate for a few sets of an exquisite combination of searing pain and mind-numbing ennui. If it helps, you can pretend you are drilling bolts on the lead on the Bachar-Yerian. Having abandoned my ballet career long before I ever started it, there is no way I can balance unaided en pointe for two minutes, so I've always used something to hang onto for that exercise.

When rgold speaks: praise god!    

I woke up thinking about the places on rock where my body goes into utter rebellion.  It’s the highstep. It’s hoisting up on a dime thin edge and ordering myself to “stand up straight”… something I hear often.  I really think it’s quads. But I don’t know. Could it be core strength? Some part of my body just freezes and then we argue. 

It may also be that I’m not yet good at economy. Getting positioned right for the next move. I have been told “you’re making it harder.“

Here’s a picture from a recent route where I had that challenge but thank God I also had a crack to work with. (if I can possibly take a shorter step, I do.)  Kris could do it.  A lot of people have. 

Another high step with no hand holds ahead… what’s it take to stand up on that left  leg?

Sometimes there’s no crack, and no hold. That’s when the advice gets a little flimsy. Bob says “I just don’t doubt.” Or I’ve been told “pretend it’s sidewalk“.

My calves feel pretty bulletproof in comparison to trying to stand tall onto a raised leg.

I ran into this picture yesterday of Alex Honnold on free rider and I might go back and rewatch Free Solo to try to learn more from his technique. Every hard slab feels like this to me.  

Thanking about this, maybe more leg presses and pull-ups would help in the gym, but the incredible thing about outdoor climbing is how real it is… all the micro adjustments, no two moves are ever the same, and even the surprises you find on each rock like a key chip has broken off or that tiny toeholdis filled with gravel. I don’t think any indoor Climbing can really prepare you for this. 

——

I just want to take a moment for gratitude here on Palm Sunday, which is a special day for me. I know parts of the world are in flames. I know we have a big election coming up. And here at home there is so much work I could be doing, but what an amazing time to be able to focus on climbing with all my heart, to tell my office, kids, tax person “I’d love to help you out, but I have to climb today.“  

I asked my artist friend, Doyle Moyer, to capture one of these beautiful flowers for me. I didn’t think he would actually do it but here is his work in progress.

I think I know where a few might be blooming right now, so I’m going to focus my morning hike on finding them.

Happy Palm Sunday!

EDIT: I don’t want to make Kris itch. But this desert is just beautiful today.

Dave Bakerwrote:

Hi everyone.

So, I got my ticket to join y'all this morning.  I'm glad to be here.

Happy birthday Dave!!!! I was going through old pictures and thinking about you the other day. Welcome to the geriatric club!

Daniel Joderwrote:

Anyone have night cramps in the calves after a multi pitch slab day? I sometimes do. They tend to go away if I can maintain some consistency with longer slab days—say, a couple days a week.
As an aside, I also get a cramp in my chest right under the end of a right side rib whenever I have to really bend over to put my shoes on. (There’s a MP thread somewhere about this.) This chest cramp is always in the same exact spot about the size of a quarter—really annoying.
Any good cramp solutions out there? Bananas?

Magnesium. Either Magnesium Glycinate or Citrate. In general you also need some drink containing electrolytes during , before, after climbing.

Most likely you are deficient in mag, most people are.

check with your doc first.