Redacted Squad - offensive route names on MP

My beef, well, two beeves, is first, the redacted routes don't come up in a search of the original name. You have to know exactly where they are, to even take a guess at which redacted it is. See the Decadent wall, for examples like Dykes on Harleys. Second, there are stories attached to these names, and that often explains the humor behind them. I'd not want those stories forgotten, that's part of the history.

Is it a big huge deal?

No, not really. The names change over time, often enough, anyway. Most of what is deemed offensive, was named long ago. At some point, no one will care much about what happened many decades ago, and old names will stand.....or fall by the wayside.

Geographic place names are a great example. Most notable features have been named and renamed multiple times, by multiple peoples.

H.

Old lady Hwrote:

My beef, well, two beeves, is first, the redacted routes don't come up in a search of the original name. You have to know exactly where they are, to even take a guess at which redacted it is. See the Decadent wall, for examples like Dykes on Harleys. Second, there are stories attached to these names, and that often explains the humor behind them. I'd not want those stories forgotten, that's part of the history.

Is it a big huge deal?

No, not really. The names change over time, often enough, anyway. Most of what is deemed offensive, was named long ago. At some point, no one will care much about what happened many decades ago, and old names will stand.....or fall by the wayside.

Geographic place names are a great example. Most notable features have been named and renamed multiple times, by multiple peoples.

H.

Many of them still pop up under their original name in the form of photos of the route. One of the numerous flaws with redacting route names was that captions of photos of the route were left unchanged. Therefore, you could still see the original route name. 

Someone told me "Daily Dick Dose" was in reference to a guy named Dick who hung out in Hueco a lot and you would see him every day. Can anyone confirm this? I thought it was awesome.

caesar.saladwrote:

Someone told me "Daily Dick Dose" was in reference to a guy named Dick who hung out in Hueco a lot and you would see him every day. Can anyone confirm this? I thought it was awesome.

Yes 

Go figure this, people will fight for free speech even if it might occasionally offend them. 

Example - music lyrics containing racial slurs and talk of killing people with guns of all kinds. Do we ban it because some people are offended? Do we stick to freedom of speech? Do we rewrite the US constitution? 

NPR tiny desk concerts embraces racial slurs and talk of killing. Comments?

And truth be told, I don't like lyrics with racial slurs and talk of killing people that much. Censorship is even worse though, let people express their feelings, its all part of freedom.

M Mwrote:

And truth be told, I don't like lyrics with racial slurs and talk of killing people that much. Censorship is even worse though, let people express their feelings, its all part of freedom.

Hard no, here.

Now the jerks have redacted Messner's guiness world record because some  tech weinies decided that he missed one of the summits by 5 meters. 

cieneguita wrote:

Who is offended by this route name?

https://www.mountainproject.com/route/106895602/redacted

Guys who like rubber masks ?

(The two first ascentionists suffered from foot injuries)

Maybe some sort of extra text box explaining the history of the climb would preserve names like this and others shown here that are easily misunderstood without context. 

I think the question that this fledgling route developer has, is how can I name my routes in such a way that they are unredactable, now and forevermore in the future?

I think this author is on the right track.

how can I name my routes in such a way that they are unredactable, now and forevermore in the future?

Don't publish them here, is your answer.

grug gwrote:

Are negative, race based names okay or not? Its all or nothing. 

Have you tried stamping your feet and pouting?  Maybe that will make this actually true in the real world instead of just something you want. 

Todd Berlier wrote:

gates REDACTED mother fuckers!!!!

A good name pinned on a route can be lagniappe, and it can add value- but that depends on whether the climber is clever with words. That's a separate skill from climbing.

Free speech: let the FA call the route whatever using their own personal megaphone, but that doesn't mean anyone else is forced to use that name if it's a poor choice. The convention of 'naming rights' is a courtesy, but it isn't absolute. 

Gregger Manwrote:

A good name pinned on a route can be lagniappe, and it can add value- but that depends on whether the climber is clever with words. That's a separate skill from climbing.

Free speech: let the FA call the route whatever using their own personal megaphone, but that doesn't mean anyone else is forced to use that name if it's a poor choice. The convention of 'naming rights' is a courtesy, but it isn't absolute. 

Correct. The 1st Amendment applies only to government regulation of speech. Unless there are specific legal obligations (e.g. employment contracts, copyright law etc) companies and private individuals are free to use or not use whatever speech they like.

The only honorable course of action here is to delete the routes that hurt your feelings. Just delete the redacted routes, its that simple. What you people have no right to do is rename someone else’s submission. It’s not yours to rename. It is MP’s domain however, to choose not to publish routes with so-called offensive names, like Shockleys (omg, it burns, IT BURNSES MY EARS).

You can block offensive users here, why not have an option to block offensive names?

grug gwrote:

Years ago a committee was created to correct offensive route names on MP. We still have many route names listed as Redacted. When will this project be completed? What are the next steps?

11/10. Just different enough to make it sound like a new topic, but you managed to get 5 pages (and counting) of rehashing the same old shit from 2 years ago

M Mwrote:

You can block offensive users here, why not have an option to block offensive names?

How exactly would that work? Blocking a user is pretty cut and dry. Determining what route names are offensive or not is not…unless you mean you can block the name after already viewing it. In which case, that could work. 

M Mwrote:

You can block offensive users here, why not have an option to block offensive names?

Sure, blocking people or routes on a public forum would allow one to live in their Pleasantville-style safe-space bubble, but it's pretty weak to just pretend that things that bother you don't exist. I guess if that's how they want to live their life though, it beats mass censorship. An opt-in/opt-out option could solve that.

I personally don't care that much that the names show up as "redacted" though, so long as I can easily click on a button to get the real name if I choose to (currently exists), and the route name is searchable (doesn't currently). But re-writing history for the pearl-clutchers is lame.