Dog rant

Jordan Wilsonwrote:

...

Edit: Cute dog pics are just reinforcing ignorance. 

Yeah how dare they...they're clearly reinforcing ignorance of...something...having to do with dogs...

Did I mention how much I love dog threads? At some point it is like turning the crank on a Model T and the engine splutters to life and starts to spew forth thick clouds of shit posts.

This goes out to all the dog haters on this thread--God, there a lot of you.  How repugnant!

I think about people who don't love and embrace dogs the same way I think about people who don't love and embrace children--they're entitlted to their opinions, of course, but they will forever remain in my mind as somewhat selfish, fearful, closed-minded, anal-retentive, limited, lonely, and with a fundamental lack of empathy, kindness, generosity, and tolerance.  

I bring my dog to the crag.  Sometimes she's on a leash, and sometimes not.  She's absolutely sweet and loveable--would not bite or hurt a fly (cats, that's another story). You can put food between her paws and she'll wait for you to give her the sign before she eats it, she would never steal food or pee on ropes...but she is a gaurd dog, and protective of her pack.  When people arrive, especially men wearing hats or helmets, she will bark loudly, and look quite aggresive, before going up to them to lick their hands and beg for kisses and lie on her back in submission for belly rubs.   That can scare people initially, but, because I know she is so good-hearted, I feel like it's as much about the other people as the dog--it's like people being scared of a human with tattoos and a studded leather jacket--I can't control their reaction.  And I can't control her instinct to bark and defend (before asking for affection) on leash or off.  I feel like it's up top others to just deal, the way that I deal with other's people's shit, loud music, loud talk, cigarette smoke, litter, beer bottles, gun shots, political views, macho posturing, sexism, shouted beta, whatever.  Part of life.  Want to climb outside in public places?  Cool.  Learn to adapt and be tolerant.  That's what growing up in NYC taught me.

How about accepting dogs are part of human life?  We've been evolving with them for thousands of years, and they'll never go away.  Get to know dogs, learn to read them, learn to interact with them, which ones to pet and which ones to stay away from, and so on.  Who knows, perhaps you'll find dog love at the crag. It could happen.  

Picture of my pooch at a crag to troll the dog haters:

Will C wrote:

I took your advice and read some more of your posts and came to the conclusion that this song was inspired by you

Harsh! Brandon’s actually a really good guy. I haven’t met his dog yet though, so that may change everything when I scream assault and crumple into an inchoate mass after it sniffs my butthole.

edit: the song is hella funny, however

edit #2: yeah, Brandon, we gotta make it happen, it’s been too long.

Will C wrote:

I took your advice and read some more of your posts and came to the conclusion that this song was inspired by you

I see. So my caricature actually fits you perfectly then. 

Edit: Thanks Z. Hope to see out at the crag and sick my killer beast on you soon! 

Jordan Wilsonwrote:

Edit: Cute dog pics are just reinforcing ignorance. 

Not about the crag dog thing, but why do people let dogs lick them/their faces/etc? You have definitely seen them lick their/other dog’s a**holes. Am I overly hygienic/germaphobic or do other people think this is disgusting?

I don't mind that butt licking dog also licking your face, John, doesn't bother me one bit. Unless you're going to kiss me too, in which case please use a sanitary wipe first!

Cherokee Nuneswrote:

I don't mind that butt licking dog also licking your face, John, doesn't bother me one bit. Unless you're going to kiss me too, in which case please use a sanitary wipe first!

So, what’s your opinion on masks?

John Clarkwrote:

So, what’s your opinion on masks?

Social or N95s?

On that corny note, I’m checking out. I hope to revisit this thread on page 10. Don’t disappoint me, people!

Colonel Mustardwrote:

Social or N95s?

Anything that would be sufficient to put a city dwelling Californian at ease between March ‘20 and say October ‘21.

JK, kink masks only

Lee Chandlerwrote:

Oh man, all the whiny bleating about how terrible dogs are was worth it just to get to this picture! What a cutie! 

Brandon Rwrote:

If a dog is rifling through and stealing your food from your tightly kept pack/rope non-flea market gear stash...

The flea market gear stash is THE WORST.  Not to stray far from topic, dogs cleaning up food left in four piles within a 10’ radius are not stealing. That is a crag service donated by dog owners at great personal cost.  

Pack in, pack out and keep the gear you aren’t using in your pack.  Yes this includes the rope bag at the bottom of a multi pitch. 

Brandon R wrote:

Looks like the unreasonable airplane-mask-tantrum-throwers are coming out of the woodwork on this thread, so I'll change my tune to that type. Maybe some of you aren't cut out for outdoor climbing, with all the elements and animals and prickly plants and such. Maybe the climbing gym offers free mental health services and support groups where you can discuss the trauma that that tail-wagging beast unleashed on you when it sniffed you. In 20 years of frequent climbing, I've only witnessed 2 negative dog interactions worth mentioning, and probably thousands of neutral or positive interactions. A much higher rate of negative and dangerous people interactions. Either I've been incredibly lucky, or some of you are just phone-recording whining karens...

If a dog is rifling through and stealing your food from your tightly kept pack/rope non-flea market gear stash, then yeah, you've got a legitimate complaint. If a dog is actually aggressive towards you, you've got a legitimate complaint. If a dog is tearing up a sensitive desert landscape, that's a legitimate complaint. Dogs in places they're not legally allowed, call the rangers on them. But please, don't act like this is happening more than it actually is. 

Happy to hear where you go doesn't have dog issues that is awesome maybe one day I'll climb there.  Your first paragraph seems to be full of projection.  Most of what I've read are pretty well laid out arguments with stated facts and examples of dog issues.  Your response is full of emotion name calling and self observed examples.  Basically projecting what you're calling someone who wants more dog restrictions. 

In the last 12 months of climbing I've seen issues with dogs at the following places that all fall in your second paragraph's criteria: Maple canyon, Joes Valley, Moes Valley, Sun Set Alley(several other Mojave limestone spots), City of Rocks, every time I climb in Echo canyon(its shit hole so I expect it here), and the Uintas.  A few of those areas have had land management discuss closures due to not following dog requirements.

I really don't care if your coping mechanism is painting in your mind that I'm your slur of gen z bad guy terms.  Most of the issues in those places I just smile and let it slide and really don't do anything at all. A few I had to say something because the dog was aggressive or getting in my shit.  

Again happy where you climb this isn't an issue, however every so often SUCC, SLCC, SICC, ETC. have to issues statements of dog owners not controlling their pets are threating access to climbing areas.  Makes it worth it to me to engage in an online argument. If I meet you in person I'll be nice to you and your dog, but I might be sad and/or annoyed when you look the other way because your dog is making others time less enjoyable. 

Dogs are a real problem in a lot of areas, most posters here probably are okay but I like my climbing areas more then I want you to bring your dogs there. 

Bruno Schullwrote:

This goes out to all the dog haters on this thread--God, there a lot of you.  How repugnant!

I think about people who don't love and embrace dogs the same way I think about people who don't love and embrace children--they're entitlted to their opinions, of course, but they will forever remain in my mind as somewhat selfish, fearful, closed-minded, anal-retentive, limited, lonely, and with a fundamental lack of empathy, kindness, generosity, and tolerance.  

I bring my dog to the crag.  Sometimes she's on a leash, and sometimes not.  She's absolutely sweet and loveable--would not bite or hurt a fly (cats, that's another story). You can put food between her paws and she'll wait for you to give her the sign before she eats it, she would never steal food or pee on ropes...but she is a gaurd dog, and protective of her pack.  When people arrive, especially men wearing hats or helmets, she will bark loudly, and look quite aggresive, before going up to them to lick their hands and beg for kisses and lie on her back in submission for belly rubs.   That can scare people initially, but, because I know she is so good-hearted, I feel like it's as much about the other people as the dog--it's like people being scared of a human with tattoos and a studded leather jacket--I can't control their reaction.  And I can't control her instinct to bark and defend (before asking for affection) on leash or off.  I feel like it's up top others to just deal, the way that I deal with other's people's shit, loud music, loud talk, cigarette smoke, litter, beer bottles, gun shots, political views, macho posturing, sexism, shouted beta, whatever.  Part of life.  Want to climb outside in public places?  Cool.  Learn to adapt and be tolerant.  That's what growing up in NYC taught me.

How about accepting dogs are part of human life?  We've been evolving with them for thousands of years, and they'll never go away.  Get to know dogs, learn to read them, learn to interact with them, which ones to pet and which ones to stay away from, and so on.  Who knows, perhaps you'll find dog love at the crag. It could happen.  

Picture of my pooch at a crag to troll the dog haters:

So people have to be tolerant to your choice of bringing a dog to the crag. But you also assume people who don't like dogs at the crag as close minded and lack tolerance. Not hypocritical at all.

Locker wrote:

All my friends very much appreciate when I bring my dog...

So weird that he took a chunk of your leg and with it a chunk of your femoral artery.  He never does that!  Silly pooch!  So cute!

Normal Customerwrote:

So people have to be tolerant to your choice of bringing a dog to the crag. But you also assume people who don't like dogs at the crag as close minded and lack tolerance. Not hypocritical at all.

Having political views is not closed minded. But political views are like holes no one wants to smell. spraying politics and littering cigarettes are both nuances. So yes, ‘not hypocritical at all.’

The resounding sentiment is that people like dogs and are fine with crag dogs when they are controlled by responsible owners. Why is this controversial? Because most dog owners are not responsible and our ego gets defensive when faced with uncomfortable realities.

To the adamant defenders of crag dogs: Thou dost protest too much, methinks.

You know you're part of a problem, you just don't want to acknowledge the problem. Ego is a funny thing.

I don't bring my GSD to the crag for good reasons. No, I won't post a picture, everyone knows what dogs look like.  

Some people in this thread suck balls at reading comprehension.  Brandon R and Bruno specifically.

Most people don't have a problem with "dogs at the crag".  Most people, the vast majority I'd say, don't have a problem with friendly dogs sniffing them, or even laying on their rope, or just curious ones that let their instincts and sniffers and food motivation run a little wild.  I count myself as a member of that group. Again, I'm a dog lover, and I have a dog that I'm probably nicer to than my own kids.  Sucks for them.

So for you comprehension-challenged trogs that ignore 90% of what's being said here so that you can self-righteously put people down based on 10% or less of what was *actually* stated:

• Dog owners that aren't concerned about their dogs attacking other people are the problem.
• Dog owners that aren't concerned with the access issues that dogs might be causing from the perspectives of land managers are the problem.
  
• Dog owners that aren't conscious of, or do not care about the other people that are around them and sharing the resource and being responsible are the problem

That's what almost everyone in this thread is saying.  For you to come back in the face of what everyone is obviously, if not explicitly saying and assert things like this:

"This goes out to all the dog haters on this thread--God, there a lot of you.  How repugnant!"

Where did anyone write that they hate dogs?  What was said that led you to that conclusion?  Please quote it specifically.  Are you just willfully obtuse, or involuntarily?  Do you know that you're obtuse?  Are you aware of your penchant to ignore what people are saying just so you can grind an axe with someone?  

What you're saying, sir, is the equivalent of someone saying "Man, I wish the city would do their job and fix these roads and all the damned potholes" and you're all:

"WHY DO YOU HATE DRIVING?!?!  REPUGNANT111!!!"  Do you have any inkling how idiotic that is?

What is wrong with being afraid of or not wanting to be attacked by a dog when you go climbing?  It's a perfectly normal, predictable human fear response.  What is wrong at being annoyed when an animal snakes the food you brought for yourself?  I think those are very normal reactions, you know, because they fucking ARE.  I'll eat my words HAPPILY if someone can show me definitive statements in this thread that would lead someone to believe that anyone here that has commented "hates dogs".  That's hyperbolic and it's stupid.

Why are you so hellbent on asserting that everyone is attacking you and your dog?  Here's a hint for you:  If your dog is well behaved, THIS FUCKING THREAD ISN'T ABOUT YOU.  If your dog isn't walking up to people ready to take a chunk out of them while snarling and foaming out the mouth like Locker's picture, THIS FUCKING THREAD ISN'T ABOUT YOU.  What is so difficult about this?