Yosemite Helo Rescue 7/10 - Half Dome ?

Climbing is still in its infancy as a sport and we can’t let our ethics slip away so fast.

Climbing is not in it's infancy. It has been practiced for +100 years, unlike Pickleball for example. There is a rich, bold history and tradition and some of us are going to protect that heritage and the ethics that help preserve it. It doesn't matter if some kids come along whining about how they can't measure up to the standards of old. We couldn't either, by and large. Its not supposed to be easy and safety is almost always in the hands of the climber, not the gear.

I just want to point out that adding a bolt in the runout parts of Snake Dike would have had no impact on Anna's accident. From the account we have, she was off-route and skipped an anchor on Pitch 2. This pitch has a bolt relatively close to the hard climbing and she successfully climbed it! Had she clipped the anchor, we wouldn't be having this conversation. It's awful that didn't happen. But those advocating more bolts, in my view, aren't engaging with the route and the facts of the accident.

The long runouts on Snake Dike are on Pitches 3, 4, and 5 - completely different pitches. And the super runout pitches are much, much easier than the cruxy 5.7 spots. Each of the 5.7 sections is reasonably safe. Adding bolts to the 5.4 pitches would have done absolutely nothing to prevent this accident. Adding a bolt to Pitch 2 would not have kept her from climbing onto a different route, nor would it have helped her clip the anchor. No matter how many bolts are added, nothing will stop people from getting off route, missing bolts, or climbing in poor conditions. Indeed, adding more bolts might conceivably increase the number of accidents by encouraging people to get on the route before they're ready. Not just ready for the climbing, but ready for a long day of hiking in the sun, managing the forecast, managing water and food, routefinding on blank sections of granite, and keeping it together on low angle rock where a fall will present a risk of injury no matter how many bolts are added. These issues are not mitigated by bolts, but by experience and preparation. I, for one, waited several years before I felt ready to do it.

I'm not categorically against adding bolts to address truly hazardous situations, for example where rockfall has altered a route. But Snake Dike is not only historic, it's a masterpiece - a completely improbable line splitting one of the most iconic formations in the world at a moderate grade. And this is not a situation where the hazards should be in any way surprising. It's a top-20 route on MP and gets full stars in every guidebook, yet every guide describes it as risky, describes the long approach, and the runouts. Moreover, as has been noted by others, it has already been retrobolted by Roper and others.

I can't speculate on what went wrong to lead her off route and to miss the anchor. I'm not going to criticize the choices that her and her partner made. I know I've been off route and runout many times in the past and it can be horrifying. Ask me some time about the "variation" to the face pitch on the Steck Salathe (identified by the NO and arrow on the topo on this page, which I didn't have at the time). Or about what happens if you follow the arrow labeled NO on the corner pitch of East Buttress of El Cap. I was fortunate in those instances to keep it together and get to safety. Did I misread the topo? Was the sun in my eyes? Was I rushing? Yes.

What happened to Anna is awful and I wish her the best in her recovery. I made a small donation. But adding bolts to Snake Dike isn't going to prevent this injury in the future and I fear it may make the situation worse.

Nkane 1wrote:

I just want to point out that adding a bolt in the runout parts of Snake Dike would have had no impact on Anna's accident. From the account we have, she was off-route and skipped an anchor on Pitch 2. This pitch has a bolt relatively close to the hard climbing and she successfully climbed it! Had she clipped the anchor, we wouldn't be having this conversation. It's awful that didn't happen. But those advocating more bolts, in my view, aren't engaging with the route and the facts of the accident.

 According to the article, she was 6 feet above the anchor, and was 35- 40 feet above the last bolt. If she fell just before making it to the anchor it still would've been a 29-34 foot run out. I would say that is at least a little runout, although maybe not bad in comparison to the 100+ foot runouts later in the route.

Patrick Voosenwrote:

 According to the article, she was 6 feet above the anchor, and was 35- 40 feet above the last bolt. If she fell just before making it to the anchor it still would've been a 29-34 foot run out. I would say that is at least a little runout, although maybe not bad in comparison to the 100+ foot runouts later in the route.

it's a good point, but the runout terrain is quite easy, at least up to the anchor. This picture shows it: https://www.mountainproject.com/photo/109995558

i don't know what the terrain was like up and right of the anchor, where she fell.

Marc801 Cwrote:

Interesting counter point if you had bolded a different passage:  Beck himself argues that more protection bolts should be added, but Snake Dike remains a Tuolumne-like challenge for runout-ready climbers on fair-weather days.

Yes, indeed it does remain a challenge for "runout-ready climbers."

As someone who onsight soloed the route back in 2008, I like to think Snake Dike will remain an adventure route that deserves full respect: an entry-level adventure route that allows 5.7 climbers to experience the commitment and route-finding challenges that are encountered less often at the easier grades. Snake Dike can give people a taste for this type of self-reliance and is approachable enough that most climbers handle it safely without incident. The required commitment absolutely is part of what makes it special.

If more bolts are added, I like to think that the route is long enough—thousands of feet—that the route would not become a clip-up with bolts every ten feet. I could envision maybe a few more strategically placed bolts that could help with route finding or protect a slippery move with devastating fall potential, etc. That would honor the wishes of the first ascent party while still maintaining the traditional experience. If people are lobbying to sport-bolt Snake Dike so that 5.7 gym climbers can stick clip their way up any section, I would point them over to the Cables Route, because that's what Snake Dike would become, in essence.

I feel it's important to remind people about the original wish of the first ascent party because people seem likely to assume that adding bolts would desecrate the spirit in which the route was established, when in actuality it is the opposite. If we put so much stock in honoring the style and wishes of the first ascent party, it should go both ways, adding bolts or not.

I highlighted those lines from the article in my first post because it's been my experience that people on the Internet rarely bother to read past the first five words of a sentence. Bless the readers who still approach discussions with open minds!

https://www.mountainproject.com/forum/topic/122661881/in-defense-of-fa-ethics 

I’ll link this as it seems related to several points made above. You must rise to the occasion, not bring the rock down to your level with more bolts. 

Byron Kremplwrote:

Would it be appropriate for the MP info or the guidebooks to have slightly stronger verbage about the runouts and consequences?

From what I've read, the accidents on Snake Dike were people who were predominantly in over their heads. They saw the 5.7 grade, and did not understand the consequences of the R. I've climbed SD twice now, and think that more beta won't make the route any safer. It might even make it less safe. Take the Grack on the Glacier Point Apron. There's SO much beta there. Where to build the anchors, what pieces you need, everything. It's set up so that any gumby can throw themselves at it and see what happens. Snake Dike is not the same. The grade doesn't reflect the full scope of risk and injury that can occur. Gumbies should NOT consider it to be an accessible, safe, or low-consequence route. 

More beta on the route won't help. More bolts might (I won't weigh in on that), but they'll definitely get chopped. Is there a way to try to increase awareness of what the route actually entails in a more "in your face" kind of way? Anyone who researches the route will find it out, but I don't think we can rely on gumbies to research the route as much as they should.

Absolutely, this is what should be getting discussed. The real problem is the lack of understanding most new climbers have about the serious danger they are approaching when racking up for old school trad. I'm completely guilty of it. Did snake dike with a pal as a couple of newbies, got proper scared and squeeked it out by the skin of my teeth. Saw 5.7R and thought nothing of it. All the beta I got from guidebooks, MP, ST, I felt like I had practically climbed it already. Had I read any accident reports or talked to any old geezers in camp 4 and I would have been first in line at the cables. That's how it used to be, but now all these climbers are reading 50 comments like "one of the best routes of it's grade in the known universe, not scary at all" from some dude/duddette they don't know whose probably experienced on 5.10 granite slab runnouts and couldnt have given 2 fucks about 5.7R, and suddenly they're driving from touchstone with a one way 4 star ticket to the top of half dome.

Pete Swrote:

@kevin, that’s a rather short sited view.  Run out bolting ethic extends well past a few national parks.   Many routes would benefit from adding select bolts or even proper anchors.  

True, except this thread is talking about Snake Dike in Yosemite and your thus one should expect that statements regarding why routes in this context were handbolted versus power drilled will be viewed through that lens.

P Bwrote:

If you share an opinion, remember to share some support for Anna as well. She is $1mil in the hole already.

Yeah - my 2c - skipping over a bunch of bs about negotiated insurance contract rates vs gauging, overcharging and destroying the lives of those without in our greed filled system -  I would 100% bail on bills from the US.  Seek legal advice, but they are likely uncollectible in NZ.  Use the money for rehab.  Those doctors and hospitals are well supported by the US insurance industry and the affordable healthcare act.  If you’re outside that system, you’re basically get ripped off.

As an old, crusty guy, I’ve spent the majority of my unremarkable climbing career as a staunch advocate for old-school ethics. I certainly have made many of the same arguments woven throughout this thread in favor of keeping the sport “pure.” I even had a ridiculous period where I refused to climb anything bolted because, “sport climbing is neither, dammit!” (Shakes fist in the air).

Personally, I’ve gotten to a place where it seems we all truly are, “Conquistadors of the useless.” We’re grown people climbing rocks. It’s fun, but it’s also fundamentally ridiculous, selfish, and pointless. Like all tribes, we have our rules and traditions, but those evolve and change over time.

Clearly, the world has changed. There are too many damn people (shakes fist in the air, again). When I was that unfortunate young lady’s age, climbing was quiet, uncrowded, and unencumbered by warping influences like social media.

Those days are gone. Gyms are on every corner and they’re packed. We’re all overrun by hashtag van life and a sterilization of what adventure once was. The culture has changed. Climbing has changed.

I certainly wouldn’t advocate for sewing up an adventure route. But I also wouldn’t have heart burn if a destination, sought after trade route had another couple bolts to limit injury to one or two broken bones (if that would help in this case).

Was it irresponsible to jump on that route after one silly warmup at Swan Slab? Yeah, but the 21 year old that doesn’t do stupid shit occasionally is a rare breed. Lord knows, I barely survived my early 20s.

I don’t know if adding a couple bolts is the “right” ethic or not. I do know that a 21 year old young lady barely escaped from a trade route with her life, and certainly will pay for that the rest of her life. That makes me incredibly sad, and definitely makes me question our values as a community.

Austin Donisanwrote:

Also not mentioned is that there is an obvious off-route bolt about 10' above the anchor along the dike. 

Curious about something, since we're talking about bolting ethics. How come nobody goes out and chops "off-route" stuff like this, that leads to trouble? I'm assuming it's just a misplaced bolt from a dead-end effort, not a different route. 

Add a sign at the base, a la Tenaya canyon. 

"Warning - Snake dike has mandatory 100+ foot runouts. A fall could result in serious injury or death. Climb at your own risk." 

S Saunderswrote:

As an old, crusty guy, I’ve spent the majority of my unremarkable climbing career as a staunch advocate for old-school ethics. I certainly have made many of the same arguments woven throughout this thread in favor of keeping the sport “pure.” I even had a ridiculous period where I refused to climb anything bolted because, “sport climbing is neither, dammit!” (Shakes fist in the air).

Personally, I’ve gotten to a place where it seems we all truly are, “Conquistadors of the useless.” We’re grown people climbing rocks. It’s fun, but it’s also fundamentally ridiculous, selfish, and pointless. Like all tribes, we have our rules and traditions, but those evolve and change over time.

Clearly, the world has changed. There are too many damn people (shakes fist in the air, again). When I was that unfortunate young lady’s age, climbing was quiet, uncrowded, and unencumbered by warping influences like social media.

Those days are gone. Gyms are on every corner and they’re packed. We’re all overrun by hashtag van life and a sterilization of what adventure once was. The culture has changed. Climbing has changed.

I certainly wouldn’t advocate for sewing up an adventure route. But I also wouldn’t have heart burn if a destination, sought after trade route had another couple bolts to limit injury to one or two broken bones (if that would help in this case).

Was it irresponsible to jump on that route after one silly warmup at Swan Slab? Yeah, but the 21 year old that doesn’t do stupid shit occasionally is a rare breed. Lord knows, I barely survived my early 20s.

I don’t know if adding a couple bolts is the “right” ethic or not. I do know that a 21 year old young lady barely escaped from a trade route with her life, and certainly will pay for that the rest of her life. That makes me incredibly sad, and definitely makes me question our values as a community.

Thank you for your perspective.  What you are articulating (better than me) is exactly my point.  We should, as a community, question our values.

I also loved the phrase "conquistadors of the useless".  I'd change my name to "Conquistador: The Useless" if I didn't have to be the King of the Gumbys.  Mentoring and advocating for my gumbies is hard work.

Best wishes and speedy recovery for anyone who got hurt.

Retro bolts are rare and need to be taken on a case by case basis, to debate if they even make sense, then the community needs to be consulted. For Snake Dike I'd be against adding any more bolts. First of all it was already retrobolted. After the FA the second team asked the FA team if they could add bolts and were given their blessing. It was an attempt to preserve the committing and challenging nature of the route without it being an X rated route. I think they did a good balance. Secondly it sounds like retro bolting wouldn't have made a difference in the accident described above. She missed the anchor climbed up a ways and then fell when downclimbing. You can't foresee every possible issue that could arise and add bolts for those eventualities. 

Andrew Ricewrote:

Curious about something, since we're talking about bolting ethics. How come nobody goes out and chops "off-route" stuff like this, that leads to trouble? I'm assuming it's just a misplaced bolt from a dead-end effort, not a different route. 

While originally a dead end for Snake Dike, it's now the first bolt of "Snake Dance" (and a shiny new ASCA one at that, which is why it's so inviting).

There's something to be said for preserving some historical stuff, and they're often good landmarks on topos. But for the majority of stuff it's just a lot of work to remove for not a lot of benefit.

Gloweringwrote:

 Secondly it sounds like retro bolting wouldn't have made a difference in the accident described above. She missed the anchor climbed up a ways and then fell when downclimbing. 

According to the article, she only got 6 feet above the anchor.  Adding a bolt halfway between the last bolt and the anchor would've turned her 70-80+  foot fall into a 30-40 feet. Not that I am in favor of adding more bolts, but it certainly would have made the fall less sever.

Patrick Voosenwrote:

According to the article, she only got 6 feet above the anchor.  Adding a bolt halfway between the last bolt and the anchor would've turned her 70-80+  foot fall into a 30-40 feet. Not that I am in favor of adding more bolts, but it certainly would have made the fall less sever.

Seems logical, but factually, we'll never know. 90% of her injuries could have occurred in that first 40'. Recall (see page 1 of the thread) that there was another fall supposedly of 200' resulting in....bruises, scrapes, and "...a broken ankle maybe more...".

Snake Dike already has huge lineups and crowding. What do you think is gonna happen if we make it even more approachable? 

We’ve got some weird norms in our… sport? activity? lifestyle? Perhaps ethics vary based upon level of commitment… anyhow 

What if, hypothetically, there was more rock available nearby at the same grade to the same top out and someone did a first ascent of it, putting in bolts every body length. I imagine outrage and chopping and related drama would ensue.

What if they put in only three bolts per pitch similar to the nearby classic? As long as it wasn’t a squeeze job and was done by a respected “community” member, I imagine it would be accepted. 

What if they installed six per pitch? 

You are not entitled to any climb. I may never climb The Edge or The Bachar Yerian on lead, and that is OK with me.

If you want to climb Snake Dyke safely find a competant partner that can lead you up it or call Yosemite Mountain School.
The ego is in saying you are owed this climb.

Mountaineering is inherently dangerous, and to many of us the risks and adventure are why we do it. I hope she makes as good a recovery as she can, absolutely tragic about the foot. Who knows, she may even be of the opinion that the climb is fine the way it is.

If we are to believe the detective work and assume she fell at or above the traverse on the 3rd pitch, that's a very reasonable place to fall and there is ample information online and elsewhere that warn of the route finding and hazards - when I climbed it in 2007 I wasn't a very good climber and took that pitch seriously but it didn't seem 'that bad,' however I could see if you made a mistake it could really be a problem - as with many adventurous climbs.