Multi-pitch follower can't make it up a pitch...now what?

My take is that an uninjured climber who can't get up a pitch under their own power with the assistance of continual rope tension from the belayer, maybe doing some improvised aid,  and ultimately prusiking up the rope, is not competent to be on a multipitch climb, at least not without a qualified guide who is being paid to haul them over the cruxy bits.

Dropped-loop assistance hauling if the second is close enough to the belay works, but so-called 3:1 hauls, which may not be possible at all depending on friction, and in any case will have mechanical advantages well under 3:1, are in general just ways of giving the second a tight rope, and this is especially true if the progress-capture device is a plaquette in guide mode, which adds a lot of friction all by itself before the rock and pro contribute their effects.

I think the main problem is leaders knowingly taking people on routes that are beyond the capabilities of the second, or perhaps not properly setting up an unexpected crux with enough helping aids. The second is "blamed" for the epic but it is really the leader who is at fault.

caesar.saladwrote:

ok smart boi 

is it like putting a bunch of tension on the rope?

all i do is boulder

Yes, it’s basically putting so much tension on the rope that you are assisting the person climbing. Any progress they make is captured, and they can pretty much thrash their way up anything.

I find it’s an extremely offensive term that comes from the age / perspective of “Men Climb, Women follow”. It’s a horseshit tier slight on women who climb.

Putting a bunch of tension on the rope is called a Guides belay.   If the majority of a climb is within the comfort level of a follower but the climb has a shut down crux or two simply bring an alpine aider to hang at the crux. That gives the follower an exciting day out on terrain they would not otherwise have been able to experience. Even the act of aiding the crux was a learning experience. 

Aaron Clifton wrote:

5:1? would that help? 

Sure. That's easy to set up.  

Tyler Stockdalewrote:

I find it’s an extremely offensive term that comes from the age / perspective of “Men Climb, Women follow”. It’s a horseshit tier slight on women who climb.

hence why its now referred to as the birthday belay...

I have never , ever referred to it as a GF belay and had never heard the term GF belay.  An assisted belay has always been a guides belay in my book.  even  just pulling sideways on the rope gives a mechanical advantage towards assisting the guest. 

Aaron Clifton wrote:

5:1? would that help? 

Not much, if at all. There's diminishing returns with adding "pulleys" because each addition adds friction, and eventually the added friction begins to outweigh the added mechanical advantage. This is especially true if the "pulleys" are not literal low-friction pulleys, but carabiners or belay devices, which have much more friction.

I don't think I would ever do more than a 3:1 without a system purpose-built to reduce friction, and I'm not bringing such a system unless I'm big walling.

Nick Goldsmithwrote:

I have never , ever referred to it as a GF belay and had never heard the term GF belay.  An assisted belay has always been a guides belay in my book.  even  just pulling sideways on the rope gives a mechanical advantage towards assisting the guest. 

Back in the “hip belay” era it was an easy thing to transition to “guide belay” …. Just flip the cord over your shoulder and use your legs- not your back- to give assistance.

Guy I was going to mention that technique but everyone  belays off the anchor these days ;) 

This is the first time I've heard Birthday or Girlfriend belay. Like Nick, I have heard Assisted belay, however.

Tyler Stockdalewrote:

Yes, it’s basically putting so much tension on the rope that you are assisting the person climbing. Any progress they make is captured, and they can pretty much thrash their way up anything.

I find it’s an extremely offensive term that comes from the age / perspective of “Men Climb, Women follow”. It’s a horseshit tier slight on women who climb.

i prefer to re-perspective the term by defining it as the extremely kind belay that a girlfriend might give a dude as she drags his ass through the crux.

David Kwrote:

I don't think I would ever do more than a 3:1 without a system purpose-built to reduce friction, and I'm not bringing such a system unless I'm big walling.

Jim Titt made me aware of an incredibly small and light cord pulley that you could easily take on every multi-pitch climb, if you wanted to.

Nathan Doylewrote:

This is the first time I've heard Birthday or Girlfriend belay. Like Nick, I have heard Assisted belay, however.

Sounds like aid to me.

Tradibanwrote:

Sounds like aid to me.

Aided Belay? Sounds about right.

quoting rgold: <My take is that an uninjured climber who can't get up a pitch under their own power with the assistance of continual rope tension from the belayer, maybe doing some improvised aid,  and ultimately prusiking up the rope, is not competent to be on a multipitch climb, at least not without a qualified guide who is being paid to haul them over the cruxy bits.>

rgold, I was once following one of the final pitches of the Grand Wall, and my awesome but inattentive husband failed to take up the slack. It was an upward traversing crack pitch and I was grunting up, only to pitch off and fall straight down onto a blank face. I was fully weighting the rope, and there wasn’t a hold in sight to take tension off. The rope was so taught I couldn’t put a prussic on, and I was twirling in space with no hands or feet, a good 6-8 feet below the crack. I’ve never been so pissed in my life, it was not a pretty scene. F-bombs we’re flying.

I eventually pumped my feet like I was on a swing, first pushing off the wall, and eventually generating some sideways momentum until I could hook a small flake with my nut key, pull in and get pulled up an inch at a time. At some point I got close enough to the crack to hook a toe, eventually a foot, and finally a sideways jam. It took forever, and I’ve done a lot of multi pitch so I was more than competent to be on the actual climb, just not on the areas below the climb! It took alot of energy not to panic, actually, I was literally a dead weight swinging in space.

Wendy Laakmannwrote:

The rope was so taught I couldn’t put a prussic on, and I was twirling in space with no hands or feet, a good 6-8 feet below the crack. I’ve never been so pissed in my life, it was not a pretty scene.

I don't get why you couldn't get a friction hitch on?  It sounds like you were in a textbook situation where ascending the rope with a couple of progress capture hitches is exactly what you want to do.  Having a taught rope to start with should help.

As others have said, know your partner, and plan ahead. Leave a long sling or chain of slings through the crux move so they can French Free. I once fell cleaning Bearded Cabbage in Joshua Tree. I was hanging in air, couldn't reach any holds because it's overhung. I was too tired to lower to the ground and retry it. I always carry two prusiks on my harness. One for rapping and the second one for ascending the rope to easier holds, which I did. 

 Prusiking and escaping the belay are great rainy day, rest day activities. It's even more fun to do them after dinner and a few beers. 

Drunken rescue practice is always a good time if someone has a book...who can remember that stuff?

Webfootwrote:

Jim Titt made me aware of an incredibly small and light cord pulley that you could easily take on every multi-pitch climb, if you wanted to.

Sure, that's a nice pulley that doesn't fit on a full-size rope, and therefore requires something like this system, which, as I said, I'm not carrying unless I'm doing a big wall. I'm honestly not sure why you're telling me this as a response to my post.

Eric Engbergwrote:

I don't get why you couldn't get a friction hitch on?  It sounds like you were in a textbook situation where ascending the rope with a couple of progress capture hitches is exactly what you want to do.  Having a taught rope to start with should help.

Honestly I’m not sure, seems like the obvious solution. I must not have had a prussic? I remember trying to get a sling wrapped to the rope but couldn’t get it clipped right, I’m guessing I had short slings and draws, but nothing long enough to be very useful. It was a while ago so I can’t remember the details, except that I was fuming mad at how much work that stupid pitch was!

David Kwrote:

Sure, that's a nice pulley that doesn't fit on a full-size rope, and therefore requires something like this system, which, as I said, I'm not carrying unless I'm doing a big wall. I'm honestly not sure why you're telling me this as a response to my post.

Just trying to help. With a 9 gram pulley it is practical to carry an emergency haul kit all the time. Pardon me if you were already aware of these; I wasn't.