How often do you enter the “No Fall Zone”

I think it’s a factor of one’s risk tolerance, comfortability in a given situation, and circumstance.

I’m curious how often others feel like they enter this zone when climbing.

I typed up a long response, but then didn't post it because it didn't feel right to share in a public forum. "The first rule of solo club" seems to apply to runouts as well.

Definitely a conversation I would love to have in person -- I love the head game and the deep intrinsic reward of climbing mandatory-onsight terrain on big routes. I look forward to reading other's perspectives here; I just personally can't engage without coming off as a spraylord.

I took my first whipper on Nutcracker in Yosemite yesterday.   I guess it was a 25ft fall, but maybe more and I was lucky to miss the tree trunk that is about halfway up the pitch.  That section was too hard to stop to place pro for me.  I have only been climbing casually cracks for about a year, so I still feel inexperienced with crack.  

That pitch has an infamous bulge on pitch 5, that has shattered ankles since it's a vertical fall onto a very low angle slab without good protection. The bulge move is much easier than the finger layback that is semi-polished and semi-overhang on pitch 1. 

Joseph Brodywrote:

The bulge move is much easier than the finger layback that is semi-polished and semi-overhang on pitch 1. 

I have a nice memory of landing upside down (and unhurt) next to a terrified guided party on the route next door after whipping from the top of that layback and pulling my top piece.

To answer OP's question, I enter no fall zone fairly often when I'm not single pitch cragging for difficulty. I think most routes I've been on have a fair amount of no fall zone - of course it's usually at the easier difficulties so you almost don't notice. 

An interesting question is how often do you choose to make what you're climbing into a no fall zone by choosing not to place gear when you could. I've definitely found myself running things out on purpose on easy terrain because I find some excuse not to place (rope drag, time, etc) when the truth is it's more exciting to run it out - not a habit I'm proud of.

(almost) every time i get on rock. some of the nastiest injuries i have seen occur only a few feet off the ground. I have personally jumped off a ledge as a belayer to save my partner from decking between the 2nd and 3rd bolt. a number of years ago a talented climber warming up on a sport route fell before the first clip and landed poorly rupturing several internal organs. another friend split her ankle open like a watermelon falling between bouldering pads. 

Every time I lead I’m in the no fall zone. 

Chad Millerwrote:

Every time I lead I’m in the no fall zone.

Pfft, every time I get out bed I’m in the no fall zone.

Eric Shulerwrote:

I’m curious how often others feel like they enter this [no fall] zone when climbing.

Almost every time I’m out climbing. But most of my climbing these days is pretty mellow in terms of my limit. Gettin’ a little like a scared-y cat in my old age. ;)

Any time I'm leading ice.  Most alpine routes, especially on the descent.  

Most trad leads these days, really.  It takes me so long to heal these days, that I really try hard to avoid even a sprained ankle.  

Joseph Brodywrote:

I took my first whipper on Nutcracker in Yosemite yesterday.   I guess it was a 25ft fall, but maybe more and I was lucky to miss the tree trunk that is about halfway up the pitch.  That section was too hard to stop to place pro for me.  I have only been climbing casually cracks for about a year, so I still feel inexperienced with crack.  

That pitch has an infamous bulge on pitch 5, that has shattered ankles since it's a vertical fall onto a very low angle slab without good protection. The bulge move is much easier than the finger layback that is semi-polished and semi-overhang on pitch 1. 

The tree on the first pitch or am I misremembering? 

For my answer:

Honestly I try to avoid no fall terrain as much as possible. I would honestly rather climb 5.hard well protected climbs than run it out on 5.easy. Although both have their place.

Connor Dobsonwrote:

The tree on the first pitch or am I misremembering? 

Yes, the first pitch.  

Joseph Brodywrote:

Yes, the first pitch.  

Oof glad you're okay, that's a giant ledge 

Every time I climb with a newbie and sometimes with experienced climbers. 

Most of Nutcracker is no fall zone. One should not be pitching off from lead pitches on that rig. Many moderate routes include lots of no fall terrain. One might consider such falls as failures in judgement. If you make a habit of it, there are surely bad results lurking in the future. For classic trad climbing, there is more no fall terrain than there is safe fall territory and often by a huge margin.

Its a very big mistake to come to moderate trad with an "it's ok to fall" mentality.

Cherokee Nuneswrote:

Its a very big mistake to come to moderate trad with an "it's ok to fall" mentality.

This man speaks truth. Or bolted routes under 5.10 for that matter.

But if noun is unwilling to fall on gear on steeper terrain, pronoun's progress will be glacial. 

this may not seem like the macho  when in doubt run it out nonsence that many climbers like to spew but one of my pet peeves is folks that give a loose belay to a top roper. Especially at the start of the climb.  Take a 30m climb with a yo yo top rope most top ropers are in a no fall zone for the first 15ft due to belayer error.    one of my friends just got hurt exactly this way. dropped by a professional climber. 

Nick Goldsmithwrote:

this may not seem like the macho  when in doubt run it out nonsence that many climbers like to spew but one of my pet peeves is folks that give a loose belay to a top roper. Especially at the start of the climb.  Take a 30m climb with a yo yo top rope most top ropers are in a no fall zone for the first 15ft due to belayer error.    one of my friends just got hurt exactly this way. dropped by a professional climber. 

Yeah, this is the worst. It's even more dangerous because they're on top rope: people assume they're safe because it's a top rope.

I think the reason belayers do this in  many cases is that they're gym climbers: gym top ropes are typically semi-static, but most climbers outdoors are using a dynamic lead rope, even when top roping. The margin of error for a little slack with a semi-static rope is much larger than with a dynamic rope, whereas an entire top rope's length of dynamic rope isn't going to catch significantly in the first 5 feet, even if there's no slack out and it's just rope stretch.

What’s the no fall zone?

David I don't think its the gym climbers fault. This  goes way back to the trad roots of leaving slack in the system to deliberately not give the top rope climber any assistance with the rope. This was absolutely a thing 40 years ago when I started climbing. We called it lead simulation or penalty slack and I have always insisted it was St0000pid. Its just a top rope keep me Tight dammit!

Kai Larsonwrote:

Any time I'm leading ice.  Most alpine routes, especially on the descent.  

Most trad leads these days, really.  It takes me so long to heal these days, that I really try hard to avoid even a sprained ankle.  

Ditto; Ice, alpine, most trad and also solo.

The first 15-20 ft any time I’m leading. If I whack my belayer in the head, neither of us are having a good time.