Ballnuts - useful in the PNW?

I'm adding some micronuts to my rack to complement my smallest size cams (black aliens) for routes that have areas of thin climbing/seams or would otherwise be runout if there wasn't any tiny gear... I'm wondering if Ballnuts would also be useful or if they work well in rock types found in the Pacific Northwest (crag and alpine). I mostly climb in Squamish but also venture into the alpine, and hope to climb in Washington state now that the land border will be open soon. For their weight I would carry them as an "oh shit" piece to compliment the micronuts since I don't have any cams smaller than the black aliens, and 00 or 000 C3 are impossible to find.... 

There's some stuff in Index and Vantage that ballnuts work well on, but it's pretty few and far between. Most of the stuff that requires that small of stuff will just have a bolt, or a bigger piece within a few feet, but there are a few outliers.

Joseph Healy swears by them for basalt: Beacon Rock and the Columbia Gorge in general.

They will work but are very rarely necessary 

Far from necessary, but many people use them with success in vantage. Many of the 11s there. I personally hate them, and wish I didn't. 

saign charlesteinwrote:

There's some stuff in Index and Vantage that ballnuts work well on, but it's pretty few and far between. Most of the stuff that requires that small of stuff will just have a bolt, or a bigger piece within a few feet, but there are a few outliers.

I’m with saign, I don’t trad climb that much but I have never placed one without either getting a spray down, looking at ticks beta or having a route description tell me, so you won’t be missing it 99% of the time. In index there will generally just be a bolt.

I've found them useful at basalt crags near Portland. They are rated to hold a higher load than similar sized cams or nuts. That said, I've never fallen on one so YMMV.

Steverwrote:

I'm adding some micronuts to my rack to complement my smallest size cams (black aliens) for routes that have areas of thin climbing/seams or would otherwise be runout if there wasn't any tiny gear... I'm wondering if Ballnuts would also be useful or if they work well in rock types found in the Pacific Northwest (crag and alpine). I mostly climb in Squamish but also venture into the alpine, and hope to climb in Washington state now that the land border will be open soon. For their weight I would carry them as an "oh shit" piece to compliment the micronuts since I don't have any cams smaller than the black aliens, and 00 or 000 C3 are impossible to find.... 

I generally carry the blue/red (two smallest sizes) on my set of nuts for alpine rock on new routes. It does not add much weight to my set and int total I only cary 5-7 nuts usually on a route. They work best when you can place at stances or anchors. I carry the two smallest sizes as they work in cracks where micronuts wont, and the other small cams are to large. If I know the route does not need them, or if the climbing is easy for me I leave them behind. 

They are useful in places like Trout Creek where protection bolts are non existent, but in most other crags in the PNW people have added bolts where ball nuts could be used. 

Thanks for the info everyone - lots of food for thought!

I've found them useful at static point.  I've seen a couple spots at darrington as well where I think they'd fit well, but I've never actually brought them up there.   

Just the Blue and red really, the rest are in the cam range. It really does just add a piece of protection that you didn't have before, and with very minimal added weight. 

Ball nuts are great for some of the thinner 10s and 11s at Index (e.g. Lower Zipper, Curious Poses) in my experience!

Patrick Beesonwrote:

I've found them useful at basalt crags near Portland. They are rated to hold a higher load than similar sized cams or nuts. That said, I've never fallen on one so YMMV.

One of the biggest whips I've ever caught was on a medium ballnut, outside of Portland.  It cleaned pretty easily.  

I carry the three smallest sizes, and place them pretty frequently. They really do fit a gap in the smallest end of the rack, since they can sit nicely in small, parallel cracks from vertical to horizontal, where micro nuts don't work, and I think ballnuts are easier to examine for hold than C3s or other micro cams.

Mark Straubwrote:

Ball nuts are great for some of the thinner 10s and 11s at Index (e.g. Lower Zipper, Curious Poses) in my experience!

The slab crux on Thin Fingers protects perfectly with the red ball nut. 

Kerwin Loukusawrote:

The slab crux on Thin Fingers protects perfectly with the red ball nut. 

It also takes brassies or a grey wallnut...