Olympics climbing feature in NYT

Have other Olympic events caused the related sport to gain a bunch of popularity? It feels like the answer would be "yes" but does anyone know of actual studies/reports that show this? 

Khoiwrote:

Irrelevant. 

You said: "If we ban bots that will keep them indoors"

Places such as The Gunks and Indian Creek show the having no bolts does not keep them indoors. 

Semantics. With the bar set higher, more skill and more gear, less people will climb. 

James Jen wrote:

Yes, and that's a good thing. The Olympics will afford climbing greater exposure and, over time, this will translate to more outdoor climbers.

Climbing is beautiful. It is fun. We're all here because we fine fulfillment and enjoyment in it. Its democratization-- having more people sharing in this is a great thing.

The most damage to boulders and crags are already done: scarred rocks through bolts, environmental degradation through approach trail. Popularization just scales up the tail end of the burden-- yah, more people means slightly more wear, more trash, more loudly playing music. So what?

We all believe in democratization of climbing. We use Mountain Project, don't we? We're here, aren't we? We believe in and use guidebooks, don't we?

Damage is done? It can always get worse, worse like your favorite crag is shut down. 

James Jen wrote:

No, but I care about the sport of climbing.

Climbing, having gained the pedestal of Olympic competition is a sign of its growing prestige, recognition, and practice.

It is, moreover, popular showcase and exposure for the sport. Having more participation, money, and recognition in it will bring downstream gains for the casual, recreational climber.

The Olympic format is a mockery of climbing, just a perversion to attract eyeballs and make money for the "industry". "Casual, recreational" climbers are not wanted at outdoor crags because they are destructive, loud, and dangerous. The masses, in general, lack respect for their surroundings and climbing commands respect. No respect for the land, land destroyed, no respect for safety, people die, the masses have demonstrated they are not worthy of being climbers.

You're probably right on one thing, there's no stopping it now, the cat is out of the bag so to speak. "Climbers" who started up in the last decade or so really have no frame of reference, no way to see what has happened to climbing, since it has always been just "recreation" to them.  

The upside is that climbing has an option, the masses are coming no matter what and some of them will bleed into the outdoors, but current climbers can help by keeping them indoors by any means necessary. STOP THE BLEED!

Tradi, couldn't current climbers also help by quitting climbing? You're talking passionately about reducing the impact of climbing, so humor me here. Why is reducing the impact important to you in such a way that you're not responsible, but these "others" are? 

New climbers really have no way to see what happened is your take, but how about this...I'm a new climber (if we are talking within a decade as being new), and here I am reading fairly consistently on MP about 'what has happened'. Why are you being disingenuous with your statements? How can you say new climbers have no way of 'knowing' while you are trying to explain? As a certified worthy rock climber, what do you feel your ethical responsibility is here, if any?

Tradibanwrote:

"Casual, recreational" climbers are not wanted at outdoor crags because they are destructive, loud, and dangerous. The masses, in general, lack respect for their surroundings and climbing commands respect. No respect for the land, land destroyed. 

I disagree with some other stuff you wrote, but I couldn't have said this part better myself. I came into climbing after having done lots of hiking and backpacking, and that sort of experience gives you a huge amount of respect for nature. I agree with you: that people who go directly from the city to the crag do not share this respect. 

T Legowrote:

Tradi, couldn't current climbers also help by quitting climbing? You're talking passionately about reducing the impact of climbing, so humor me here. Why is reducing the impact important to you in such a way that you're not responsible, but these "others" are? 

New climbers really have no way to see what happened is your take, but how about this...I'm a new climber (if we are talking within a decade as being new), and here I am reading fairly consistently on MP about 'what has happened'. Why are you being disingenuous with your statements? How can you say new climbers have no way of 'knowing' while you are trying to explain? As a certified worthy rock climber, what do you feel your ethical responsibility is here, if any?

Real climbers such as myself have earned the privilege to climb by respecting the responsibility required to climb outdoors. Some new people have this respect, alot don't.

Tradibanwrote:

Real climbers such as myself have earned the privilege to climb by respecting the responsibility required to climb outdoors. Some new people have this respect, alot don't.

And many old climbers don't have this respect. Perhaps the dilineator on who can climb should be something other than when you started, given that it has not bearing on whether or not you are able to understand climbing ethics. 

T Legowrote:

And many old climbers don't have this respect. Perhaps the dilineator on who can climb should be something other than when you started, given that it has not bearing on whether or not you are able to understand climbing ethics. 

The reference to timing is in regards to a frame of reference. Newer climbers do not have a frame of reference to assess the respect that climbers are giving. Their baseline for respect has been set by the masses and therefore is askew.

T Legowrote:

Tradi, couldn't current climbers also help by quitting climbing? You're talking passionately about reducing the impact of climbing, so humor me here. Why is reducing the impact important to you in such a way that you're not responsible, but these "others" are? 

New climbers really have no way to see what happened is your take, but how about this...I'm a new climber (if we are talking within a decade as being new), and here I am reading fairly consistently on MP about 'what has happened'. Why are you being disingenuous with your statements? How can you say new climbers have no way of 'knowing' while you are trying to explain? As a certified worthy rock climber, what do you feel your ethical responsibility is here, if any?

10/10, well done.

Tradibanwrote:

Real climbers such as myself 

WOW GUYS we are in the presence of a REAL CLIMBER

Russ Keanewrote:

A whole hour of "1A" on NPR was devoted to climbing.    They had a soundbite of Adam Ondra saying how stupid it was to include speed climbing in the games.

This just in “Man Child complains about not being the best “ 

B Pwrote:

This just in “Man Child complains about not being the best “ 

I dunno I think you should watch the speed climbers try to boulder and then tell me you don’t agree the format is stupid. 

James Jenwrote:

Yes, and that's a good thing. The Olympics will afford climbing greater exposure and, over time, this will translate to more outdoor climbers.

Climbing is beautiful. It is fun. We're all here because we fine fulfillment and enjoyment in it. Its democratization-- having more people sharing in this is a great thing.

The most damage to boulders and crags are already done: scarred rocks through bolts, environmental degradation through approach trail. Popularization just scales up the tail end of the burden-- yah, more people means slightly more wear, more trash, more loudly playing music. So what?

We all believe in democratization of climbing. We use Mountain Project, don't we? We're here, aren't we? We believe in and use guidebooks, don't we?

While I do not subscribe to the philosophy of keeping climbing just for a select few -- at all, your statement about most damage to boulders and crags being already done is factually wrong. 

The truth is that significant negative impacts are accelerating at an alarming pace -- not "slightly" more as you incorrectly posit.

We have seen not just the bases of boulders covered in pads, but larger crowds spreading their pads far afield as they observe and kick back, crushing plant life and creating a hugely unnecessary sacrifice zone.  Unfortunately, the social scene at the gym is being transported to the outdoors, without any introspection (or awareness) that this may not be an appropriate way of experiencing and interacting with the outdoors.  

"So what?" you rhetorically ask...  There is a big "what."

The disrespect we show for the outdoors not only wrecks havoc on the natural world, but invariably (and inevitably) leads to closures and restrictions.

And, perhaps the point is, we as climbers, must do a far better job of raising the awareness of new climbers -- which now predominately (if not nearly entirely) are coming from the climbing gym.  The transition needs to be managed far more wisely.

Or, maybe you are just trolling, which is kinda sad.

Randywrote:

The disrespect we show for the outdoors not only wrecks havoc on the natural world, but invariably (and inevitably) leads to closures and restrictions.

So far there is very little evidence of it actually happening. Objectively the ratio of new climbs to closed climbs is STRONGLY in favor of new climbs, I welcome evidence to the contrary. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9tH-m44xcrE

Olympics suck,  No Wonder They Want to Come Home

Tradibanwrote:

Real climbers such as myself

Okay, so this is dating me, but here's what Tami Knight (who?) thought a "real" climbing competition should be like.

tobias bundlewrote:

I dunno I think you should watch the speed climbers try to boulder and then tell me you don’t agree the format is stupid. 

I've watched, and the comment applies - speed climbers try their anti-style and find it hard. - And of note I think that at least one speed specialist qualified in both the men's and women's divisions, so we'll all get to watch in the olympics.
For Paris 2024 they've split the combined event, because there will be 2 medals, so this is a bit moot. I think speed climbing will become the olympic equivalent of climbing a rope in gym class, or it'll peak at ~5s, and get boring.

James Jenwrote:

Yes, and that's a good thing. The Olympics will afford climbing greater exposure and, over time, this will translate to more outdoor climbers.

Climbing is beautiful. It is fun. We're all here because we fine fulfillment and enjoyment in it. Its democratization-- having more people sharing in this is a great thing.

The most damage to boulders and crags are already done: scarred rocks through bolts, environmental degradation through approach trail. Popularization just scales up the tail end of the burden-- yah, more people means slightly more wear, more trash, more loudly playing music. So what?

We all believe in democratization of climbing. We use Mountain Project, don't we? We're here, aren't we? We believe in and use guidebooks, don't we?

Nope

Maybe if you’re climbing trade routes in Yosemite or other populous area in So Cal but the amount of environmental degradation that has occurred in the PNW is certainly not a “tail end” effect.
Reading your comments I’d wager you make your  money in the climbing industry.

Mx Amiewrote:

I've watched, and the comment applies - speed climbers try their anti-style and find it hard. - And of note I think that at least one speed specialist qualified in both the men's and women's divisions, so we'll all get to watch in the olympics.
For Paris 2024 they've split the combined event, because there will be 2 medals, so this is a bit moot. I think speed climbing will become the olympic equivalent of climbing a rope in gym class, or it'll peak at ~5s, and get boring.

How is speed climbing any more boring than watching sprinters in the 100m or 200m? Plenty of people tune in to watch those events.

Mx Amiewrote:

 I think speed climbing will become the olympic equivalent of climbing a rope in gym class, or it'll peak at ~5s, and get boring.

Yeah heaven forbid speed climbing become boring...

Andrew Krajnikwrote:

How is speed climbing any more boring than watching sprinters in the 100m or 200m? Plenty of people tune in to watch those events.

Ok, after reading up on the timeline of the 100m record, you're right.