Redacted route titles?

Ron Birkwrote:

Most people don't want to use highly inappropriate names. We may disagree where the line is but most agree in general. But we need to show something and this site elected to hide the name with the option to see the name. That is not whitewashing in my opinion. 

I also suggested an option to see the older name in cases where the routes got renamed so we can preserve history:

https://www.mountainproject.com/forum/topic/119624104/ability-to-see-previous-names-of-routes

i dont know that i agree we have to show something. 

if we do have to show something, i do agree that your suggestion is a good one, i would appreciate being able to keep track of the changes/“history”

really, who does it hurt if slow children isn’t on MP? 

C Limenskiwrote:

really, who does it hurt if slow children isn’t on MP? 

Who does it hurt if it is on MP?

SinRopa wrote:

Gender exclusive and classist to boot?  Redacted.  People donning cloth.

Haha yes!!! People have been historically oppressed and ridiculed in this country and are now speaking out when they are made uncomfortable, but somebody misinterpreted the name of a rock climb!! Hilarious comedy!!

If "Knights" was a reference to the KKK, donning satin makes them sound a bit, well casper milque toast, no?

Isn't this how the KKK was forced from fashion in the first place, people making fun of their outfits and handshakes and such?

https://www.mentalfloss.com/article/503813/how-superman-helped-foil-kkk

FrankPSwrote:

Who does it hurt if it is on MP?

yes. that is what i was attempting to convey

Heh... well, yeah.  That may be part of it.

C Limenski wrote:

nun yall woke enuf till ya worship black jeebus or deny blue eyed christ outright. colonizers

Yeah dude this isn't okay

The inclusion of the redacted name in searching does not seem to be working right. I was trying to find Shockley's Ceiling without having to navigate through the route DB and didn't know what it was called here now.

"Shockley" doesn't turn it up in the search box results-while-typing:

Though it does pick up the (apparently not renamed) Shockley's Without. Getting all the way to "Shockley's cei" does not turn up the actual route:

I needed to get all the way to "Shockley's ceil" before "The Ceiling" turned up.

Lily Johnsonwrote:

Yeah dude this isn't okay

you know ... i feel fine about it 

edit to clarify i do think we can assign a lot of blame for both the racism and the misguided attempts at resolving racism to the overarching umbrella of christianity. obviously not all of it. there are lots of individuals to blame and a lot of wonderful christians but i am trying to poke at a systemic cause for immeasurable pain worldwide 

C Limenskiwrote:

you know ... i feel fine about it 

edit to clarify i do think we can assign a lot of blame for both the racism and the misguided attempts at resolving racism to the overarching umbrella of christianity. obviously not all of it. there are lots of individuals to blame and a lot of wonderful christians but i am trying to poke at a systemic cause for immeasurable pain worldwide 

Okay to start, I hate religion and am not here to defend Christianity. But that weird strawman misspelling thing you did comes off as straight-up racist and had very little to do with criticizing Christianity.  

Lily Johnsonwrote:

Okay to start, I hate religion and am not here to defend Christianity. But that weird strawman misspelling thing you did comes off as straight-up racist and had very little to do with criticizing Christianity.  

guess we are back to context. happy to remove it. read teddies quote if you want (some of the) context.

if you don’t understand how that is about christianity i can not help you. you have research to do

 im trying to make a point not be offensive 

this does make the video better tho 

C Limenskiwrote:

guess we are back to context. happy to remove it. read teddies quote if you want (some of the) context.

 im trying to make a point not be offensive 

this does make the video better tho 

Of course you're not trying to be offensive, but just think of the implications of what you wrote. What kind of person are you satirizing there, because obviously the misspellings are to imply that the person is dumb, and the language sounds like a hyperbolized strawman version of something that someone who doesn't understand the actual problem thinks that POC are upset about. While you think you're making fun of "woke white people" who don't help with actual problems, you're actively spreading ignorance and discouraging people from caring about the real problems. Separate from this, consider what the problem you have with this movement really is. Even if it is mostly just "virtue signaling", there are POC out there who have been made to feel more welcome and included in this community due to the changes. Actual, historical, and currently existing prejudice takes precedent over you're feelings. 

(sorry most of this isn't directed at you really I just got on a bit of a rant) 

Lily Johnsonwrote:

Of course you're not trying to be offensive, but just think of the implications of what you wrote. What kind of person are you satirizing there, because obviously the misspellings are to imply that the person is dumb, and the language sounds like a hyperbolized strawman version of something that someone who doesn't understand the actual problem thinks that POC are upset about. While you think you're making fun of "woke white people" who don't help with actual problems, you're actively spreading ignorance and discouraging people from caring about the real problems. Separate from this, consider what the problem you have with this movement really is. Even if it is mostly just "virtue signaling", there are POC out there who have been made to feel more welcome and included in this community due to the changes. Actual, historical, and currently existing prejudice takes precedent over you're feelings. 

(sorry most of this isn't directed at you really I just got on a bit of a rant) 

cuz peeps choose not to right propr english dont mean shit bout their intellect. k?

education and grammar have nothing to do with each other. i appreciate what you are saying. 

i am genuinely curious what ignorance i am spreading? i was mostly pointing at colonization and christianity as the root of our racism which is absolutely true 

aaaaaaah i get it. you dont think i am cereal. im so cereal guys 

edit because i cant post below

y’all making assumptions about where my jeans and attitude are from ... is there a word for that? 

yes i know how to spell genes. 

definitely the first step to destroying colonizing attitudes is to complain

if no one complained about slavery where would we be? 

[redacted]

There is nothing, absolutely nothing, more bourgeois than a white kid complaining about colonization, racism and privilege 

MojoMonkeywrote:

The inclusion of the redacted name in searching does not seem to be working right. I was trying to find Shockley's Ceiling without having to navigate through the route DB and didn't know what it was called here now.

"Shockley" doesn't turn it up in the search box results-while-typing:

Though it does pick up the (apparently not renamed) Shockley's Without. Getting all the way to "Shockley's cei" does not turn up the actual route:

I needed to get all the way to "Shockley's ceil" before "The Ceiling" turned up.

Some particularly soft individual outright renamed the route instead of redacting it. Probably so they did not have to field weekly 'Why in the world is this redacted?' questions.

John Qwrote:

Some particularly soft individual outright renamed the route instead of redacting it. Probably so they did not have to field weekly 'Why in the world is this redacted?' questions.

Ah, now I see it does not have the redaction info on the page. It should definitely have the original name restored and then redacted to something else so searchers can find it.

MojoMonkeywrote:

Ah, now I see it does not have the redaction info on the page. It should definitely have the original name restored and then redacted to something else so searchers can find it.

That why I suggested the ability to show (and search for) older names:

https://www.mountainproject.com/forum/topic/119624104/ability-to-see-previous-names-of-routes

Claudine Longetwrote:

There is nothing, absolutely nothing, more bourgeois than a white kid complaining about colonization, racism and privilege 

Man if you think I wouldn't be down for a proletariat revolution right now I don't know what to tell you.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/sep/27/social-dilemma-media-facebook-twitter-society

M Spraguewrote:

 "the solution needs to incorporate the work and voices of devoted activists, organizations, scholars, and those who have experienced the harms of exploitative technology, which amplifies systemic oppression and inequality."

I really do agree with that article in general, the people that build those platforms did it for their own personal monetary gain, and in a sense to fuel capitalism; this is exactly the mindset the rich want us to maintain and they encourage us to fight so we don't acknowledge the true oppressors in the upper class.  But in this effort they created platforms with power, and it is our responsibility to commandeer these platforms and use them in a way that fights inequality and stands for the oppressed and against the oppressors.