You can now flag a discriminatory name

SinRopa wrote: Anyone know why the viewable list of "bad names" is restricted to the first 200 now?  This gets more bizarre every day...we used to be able to view all 4000+

https://www.mountainproject.com/bad-names

The list could be so long that the server is have trouble rendering it for everyone who's trying to look at it.

crackatoa Spiesbach wrote: IS MP going to address how they stole this idea after laughing at the women who developed it and brought it to them?  

Really? You read the post on that MBC blog and what you took away from that was that something was stolen? Go back on read some of the earlier posts in this thread that highlight why that woman's claims are absurd. Seriously, suggesting MP add a flagging system isn't a billable idea. If it was, then she can go ahead and collect royalties from the maybe 50 gabillion websites that starting implementing such a system 5 internet centuries ago.

J. Albers wrote:

Really? You read the post on that MBC blog and what you took away from that was that something was stolen? Go back on read some of the earlier posts in this thread that highlight why that woman's claims are absurd.

We are like 4 layers deep in the inception where the trolls are the trolls are the trolls.

Jared Willis wrote:

We are like 4 layers deep in the inception where the trolls are the trolls are the trolls.

Certainly possible, eh? Funny reference btw...

mama wrote: What is your response to this? Seems pretty damning to me...

https://www.melaninbasecamp.com/around-the-bonfire/2020/7/6/how-mountain-project-stole-from-a-woman-of-color

Wtf is going on? Should we start flagging all these posts? 

you are free to use the flag feature as you wish.

YOLOLZ Bicarbonate wrote: I'm not one to stand up for a bunch of Tech Bros, but this is not the first person of color to approach the climbing community recently with a dubious personal story of discrimination and a vague demand for money. I'd also note that it's been mostly people in CA from the LGBT activist community doing this and not in any way normal black folk - and by "normal" I mean, "not activists." For instance, the woman decrying racism at GWPC a few weeks ago, but who refused to say what actually happened (GWPC also refused to comment on the specifics). And who subsequently was involved in a second unlikely episode from which she gathered money for her non-profit (the white people hanging out at Indian Rock in Berkeley aren't the sort to call a ten year old black girl the n-word; sorry, to paraphrase Dave Chappelle on Jussie Smollet, I need some more evidence before I'll believe that). And now this.

If this individual who is a programmer has a personal grudge they should contact a lawyer and sue. Then we'll all know how innocent or evil MP is. If this person doesn't have a basis for what they are saying, then MP should consider suing them for libel.

Excuse me, "normal black folk"? Is this for real?

crackatoa Spiesbach wrote: IS MP going to address how they stole this idea after laughing at the women who developed it and brought it to them?  

I agree, so what's the MP response to this?

This is my response: mountainproject.com/forum/t…

Nick has apologized for his white privilege and stealing from POC, please stop bothering him now. Can't we all move on to complaining about crappy route names? If you all don't stop badgering him, he's likely to change the name of Mountain Project to "Grievance Studies Graduate Group" or "Whiney complaining Liberals With a Few Climbers also posting Project" or some such. Did we really need 22 pages to get here?

Billcoe wrote: Nick has apologized for his white privilege and stealing from POC...

Nick has apologized for having been wrongly accused...
Nick has apologized for reusing code he wrote himself and has used for over 10 years... 

Take your pick!

NOTE:   Wild women of planet Playtex  was named after a "Farside" comic strip and "opus" the penguin..     Yeah~~~has ZERO to do with hate and everything to do with humor.  But it seems some butthurt knumbnut (s)  think they need to be the deciders of all that is right- fluffy and unicorn-ish..  What utter bullshyt this whole avenue is.   And where might I ask does this shyt stop ?   Soon people will be offended that a crack climb doesn't come festooned with bolts every 6.3 feet and will install them at THEIR will- while also renaming the route something like "beautiful daisys in a fluffy blue sky" .. Then, some other peeps will think the bolts are an intrusion and chop the hell out - renaming it heavens devils..  So on and so forth..   the lunacy spreads..                                                    

marmot marmot wrote: https://www.melaninbasecamp.com/around-the-bonfire/2020/7/6/how-mountain-project-stole-from-a-woman-of-color?fbclid=IwAR0RFgrfMCSRHVUaV2azhE0cAEcQcMS_dDow9xqDkH2-3n85WzyGfbNKrog

In theory, the addition of this feature is welcome and a long time coming, but it appears that Melissa Utomo had been marketing this idea to Mountain Project (or rather to REI, the owner of this site) for months to no avail. The article above, as well as Melissa's personal instagram account, argue that it's stolen intellectual property, or at least partially so, as the feature is a much more basic version than the one Melissa proposed.

REI's treatment of Melissa Utomo is pretty despicable throughout all of this.

I posted the note below on the General forum.  However, to be more precise, Melissa Utomo's proposed functionality is an extension of existing functionality to flag messages. There is nothing particularly unique about route titles that makes the technology or the concept different.  Therefore, the original functionality of flagging, developed by Nick, is what Melissa is appropriating in her proposal to REI.  There is no evidence that REI transferred any code to Nick, or that Nick solicited anything from REI or Melissa and used it without compensation or attribution.

Maybe REI was dismissive of Melissa Utomo, and that's sad, but that's a long way from theft of intellectual property.

SMarsh  · 1 hour ago · NY, NY · Joined Sep 2013 · Points: 2

I read the proposal.

As a former technology manager, I would say that the proposal lacks any functionality that differs significantly from what the current flagging methodology was on MP at the time.  So, even if the writer did propose a "feature", that "feature" already existed in other forms.  So, copying from the original source, the poster's proposal could just as easily prove that the poster appropriated from what existing on MP.

There have been many "discoveries" and changes of functionality in other realms where more than one person developed / discovered / created something at the same time as someone else.

I believe that Dave K properly defined who needs to prove what.  

Since Nick was not actively involved while REI was, there is little reason to believe that Nick used any product that REI declined to use.

In any case, for those who want to make MP responsible to prove that they didn't copy, I would prefer to hypothesize that the proposal cannibalizes existing MP technology, copies from it, and then accuses MP of not deeming that contribution to be unique.

Just curious, what would the process be for removing a route from that list, or marking it as "dealt with"? I noticed one on the list that didn't fit the alpha numeric scheme and they are notated as having the name changed by the FA. Route is now named Catharsis.

Captain Obvious wrote:

If Rong is whining, you know you’re doing it right. Thumb’s up!

In these troubling times at least the aggrieved man toddlers are still amusing us with incessant whining rants, lol!

Well Zach Thompson,, one can only wonder why your even on this thread.   You've never put up a route --  and you main contribution to climbing seems to be a tick on the ass of those that have~~ that and being a disrespectful asshole/punk..    

RDA wrote:

Well Zach Thompson,, one can only wonder why your even on this thread.   You've never put up a route --  and you main contribution to climbing seems to be a tick on the ass of those that have~~ that and being a disrespectful asshole/punk..    

Have I not put up routes? We friends Ron “Rong” Anderson? More importantly, who is this association of ticked off route developers?

Anyway, I thought you gave up your climber card in disgust in one of the 1000s of rants you’ve posted? It’s hard to keep straight for you too, I bet.

Keep being the lit flame of drama and I’ll keep on climbing whatever stupid named route you put up way bitd and laughing.

Like your route, Fuck Me, at River Rock. Dumb name exemplified and feather pillow soft at the 5.11c you gave it - a Rong Anderson tour de force! If it were just a little shorter and more chossy, we’d have to give you a gold plated turd or something. Although, I do appreciate an 11+ I can climb in running shoes. I wish you put up more 12s but I know that at least one of those was already downgraded a couple letters as well. Drats.

Back atcha, as far as the rest goes. You’ve called more names and tossed more dirt than anybody all while playing a victim card. Way light duty. But, sure, turn it around on me because I was one who - after plenty of chances - called you out on the endless garbage you spewed at Supertopo. I expect no less than that sort of deflection from you.

We need to have a super taco dance off!
I say tuttle starts it with the Sloan boogie!
Then Clint can do the nichols tap on zoom from across the country!
Then you guys as the main event. Youve been served.

Luke Mehall wrote:

I respect the move Nick. 

A great follow up, in my humble opinion, would be to also hire fact checkers, and pay your contributors for the data they provide. I've seen some ideas floating around from Andrew Yang in the tech world, and maybe MP could be a leader in this.

Respectfully,
Luke 

This is going to sound ridiculous to people not familiar with the history, but New Deal programs like the Works Progress Administration would have supported precisely this. Mountain Project would apply for a grant to fund "positions to curate a database of rock climbing route information and history for use by the general public" and, if approved, use the grant money to hire curators. If you got flagged (say, someone claimed you were fraudulently taking the money and not doing the work) you might get audited, but that's it.

That's not a great way to run the whole economy, but you better believe it's better for the country to pay people to do work like that, cleanup parks, start after-school programs, etc. than to have them work for minimum wage at a Subway.

Dan Schmidt wrote:

This is going to sound ridiculous to people not familiar with the history, but New Deal programs like the Works Progress Administration would have supported precisely this. Mountain Project would apply for a grant to fund "positions to curate a database of rock climbing route information and history for use by the general public" and, if approved, use the grant money to hire curators. If you got flagged (say, someone claimed you were fraudulently taking the money and not doing the work) you might get audited, but that's it.

That's not a great way to run the whole economy, but you better believe it's better for the country to pay people to do work like that, cleanup parks, start after-school programs, etc. than to have them work for minimum wage at a Subway.

Civilian Conservation Corps for the win.

YOLOLZ Bicarbonate wrote:

The WPA was not designed to support activist undergrads from Evergreen College and UC Santa Cruz who find themselves without a salable skill and massive student loans. But ff billionaires want to use their tax dodge wealth funds to benefit for profit companies, that's on them (if legal, which it might not be- I'm not completely sure). And, yes, I know WPA supported some artists, but today about 15% of Americans under the age of 40 consider themselves "artists," so it's not the same world.

That said, the recent co-opting of the Radical Left by billionaire wealth funds is one of the most fascinating historical events I've seen in my life. Some of you might not be aware that this is happening, but it is, and it has re-shapred our politics in the US. Basically, the rich figured out that the best way to keep their tax rate low is not to fight upper middle-class Leftwing crusaders, but to use charitable wealth funds to funnel money to woke non-profits that specifically do NOT seek structural (i.e., financial) change. These groups rally around issues that are concerned primarily with psychological problems (to use a broad term for anything that one might find triggering): racism, transphobia, gun control, etc,  but very specifically do not advocate for the re-distribution of wealth (which is the only thing that will solve poverty in the US). The fight for this money is hyper-competitive, whic results in a fractured Letwing field (although it looks solid from the outside, perhaps). Today's Leftwing radical therefore relies upon the rich for their employment, since if the wealth fund money that pays for their lifestyle through grants were to dry up, they would be out of a job with zero marketable skills. Our Left politics therefore reflects a tacit agreement with the billionaire wealth class of the United States. This in a time when US government services are shrinking, precisely because of low tax rates on the wealthy and corporations. Wokeness in other words, is a victory of the free market. 

In other words, the Kochs are right, and they have thoroughly defeated the Left. Our current political moment is hilarious, in that we're here arguing maddeningly over changing route names, when we should be asking for an 80% tax rate on income over $100,000 (or something similarly draconian). If you want to see others come up, most people in the US will have to see themselves go down. This includes the Upper Middle Class and the very wealthy.

Therefore, I propose changing the route name Nubian Slave to something very fitting:  Red Herring.

While I agree somewhat to your vague assessment of the far radical “woke” left, your vision for progress into the future is so hysterically ass backward and off base, it’s disturbing. So in a round about nutshell, your vision for how to progress forward follows along the lines of Venezuela? Tax the rich out of existence and provide for the poor, which will be literally everyone. 80% of 100,000 dollars = 20,000 a year. So you want everyone to be equally poor? No thank you. It’s not my fault you missed the boat on the easiest ship to catch. Making over 100,000 dollars a year isn’t hard. You just have to put your neck out there and work for it. Or I guess you could just steal it from someone else who worked for it and give it to someone else who didn’t. Historically, that is what’s known as theft. Nevermind that free market capitalism has produced the most prosperous and technologically advanced civilization in the history of mankind in a very short period of time. Let’s tear it all down and move to some form of socialism, which has created “nothing” but bringing out the absolute worst in mankind. Well call it, the National Socialist “American” Workers Party.  Genius!