Texas Quickdraw Chain Free Solo Guy

how about teach him how to do it with a Petzl connect. I would shy away from aid climbing daisys as they have their own issues but   give the guy two pieces of old climbing rope and show him how to tie them off, give him a petzle connect and a piece of old rope so he has one  adjustable rig  to go with his  non adjustable teather.  be nice and teach.  get his email and send him a link to Via feratta rigging. 

whomever it was that suggested calling the police please give yourself a nut shot for stupidity. 

Nick Goldsmithwrote: whomever it was that suggested calling the police please give yourself a nut shot for stupidity. 

Whoa.  Hold on there a sec.  I think many of you are underestimating the situation.  This is more’n likely a guy who needs more help than Just some expert climbing advice.  I may be wrong, but my impression is that this may be an adult of the “vulnerable” persuasion.  Not sure what the best option is (ambulance, cops, coroner) but if further attempts at normal interaction/discussion fail in an attempt to assess his mental status, that may be what’s needed.  I’d try to avoid police as much as possible (can only imagine possible outcomes there) and only as a last resort.

If this guy ultimately turns out to just be a run of the mill, self-absorbed and incompetent  dumbass I’d be surprised. 

Yeah I definitely wouldn't suggest getting the police involved for 99.9% of jackass-at-the-crag situations.  Some of you may be missing the context though.  The Greenbelt, and specifically the walls mentioned / pictured, are crazy busy.  From the anchors of most of those routes, it's a 5 to 20 foot scramble through loose mulch and scree.  There is no way to top a lot of those out without raining 5 - 20 lb rocks on everyone below.

If this dude ignores everyone asking him to stop, what are the options?  Fight him?  Tell everyone else they should leave the crag for their own safety?  Call the police?  I don't really know to be honest.  Just saying, if someone who's actually there does think it's appropriate to get authorities involved, I'm happy to share a real example of why this kind of thing is dangerous for people below.

Thread migrated to alternate ways to daisy solo and such, but the fact is the kid has his harness upside down.  There is more going on than he is just a noob IMO, as he does not realize the danger he is causing others or himself.  A concerted effort to reach out to him and find a way to meet him at an appropriate level (attitude, personality, capability) is the way to go.  Probably has already been done repeatedly, but I would rather beat my head against a wall than hear that he gave someone a fatal rock shower.  Nobody truly wants to see a guy deck after a bolt blew or give himself a 22KN wedgy either.

E Mwrote:or give himself a 22KN wedgy either.

Well said... That sounds extremely unpleasant

5.11 seems like a stiff grade to be doing shenanigans on.

Offer the guy climbing lessons, give him an old tag line and teach him how to rappel and teach him that dropping rocks on other people will get someone killed.  give yourself a nut shot for suggesting calling the cops.  Use a wall hammer. 

Dude definitely needs to be checked for for the rock fall shit but North Face just put a quick draw chain up as part of their ad.  I’m sure he saw this ad and thought well North Face did it so it must be legit.

Could always just "top out" above him while he's doing his thing. He'd get to learn firsthand about the dangers of rockfall, and you might get a demonstration of how well his method of protection does (or doesn't) work!

(And because the Internet is stupid: yes, I'm being facetious.)

A C wrote:

One big difference is his setup is metal to metal, way more likely to twist and open.

And again, if he wants to wreck himself that is fine. But if he is dropping rocks he either needs to get wrecked or get his car wrecked before somebody gets hurt.

If it is that bad, and a stern talking to doesn't work, it is more likely to be better for all to ask for the help of a ranger. No sense endangering yourself more, especially in this day and age where everything you do will be recorded.

Ted Wilsonwrote: Dude definitely needs to be checked for for the rock fall shit but North Face just put a quick draw chain up as part of their ad. I’m sure he saw this ad and thought well North Face did it so it must be legit.

extending a bolt with a series of dogbones and carabiners while you are climbing with a dynamic rope is very, very, very, very, very different from using a single chain of quickdraws to lead solo

who are you to tell someone they can't climb..   I was chewed out by a Gym guide for free soling at my local crag while he was guiding off of anchors that I installed.  told me that I was making him feel uncomfortable free soloing in front of his clients. he made me uncomfortable guiding without a helmet.  its a free world out there. the rock fall shit on the other hand is not cool and needs education...  the key is education not enforcement. 

Long Rangerwrote: Are the bolts on the routes he's climbing really spaced that closely that he can clip the bolt above, while still being able to reach the bolt "below"? He's Via Ferrata'ing that sheeeet.

And so, if he can't, he just leaves like a $100 in quickdraws behind, dangling?

On the specific route pictured a lot of times you clip a bolt while standing on a ledge or just before pulling onto one, meaning you have the stances to reach down and unclip and then get on tippy toes and clip. It's a Rubber Wall in the Greenbelt in Austin, TX, bur I forget the name of the route. 

Rock debris falling on your head while at a one pitch crag is super lame. I would hat to have to explain to someone's mother/wife/loved one why Jimmy/Jenny died because some asshole knocked a block off on their head. And was told repeatedly that they were endangering other people but nothing "concrete" was done...and by concrete I mean punched in the face.

He can climb stupidly if he wants to. People have tried to explain it to him but he won't listen. They've done what they can and should do.

Raining down rock over and over is a completely different situation. He's endangering other people. It sounds like multiple people have asked him to stop and he continues to do it. It is absolutely a situation to get the authorities involved. What's the alternative? Allow him to keep risking other people's lives. Beat him up. Trash his car. Getting the authorities involved is absolutely the right call. I would personally video someone asking him to stop. Video him knocking down rock. Call the authorities. Present the evidence. However if I was there, especially with family and I told him not to and he knocked down rock on us, then it would be a beat down, and let the chips fall where they may.

Gloweringwrote: He can climb stupidly if he wants to. People have tried to explain it to him but he won't listen. They've done what they can and should do.

Raining down rock over and over is a completely different situation. He's endangering other people. It sounds like multiple people have asked him to stop and he continues to do it. It is absolutely a situation to get the authorities involved. What's the alternative? Allow him to keep risking other people's lives. Beat him up? Trash his car. Getting the authorities involved is absolutely the right call. I would personally video someone asking him to stop. Video him knocking down rock. Call the authorities. Present the evidence. 

I usually agree with you Glow-bug. But time has passed for that, he has become emboldened by the lack of consequences to his actions.  

It actually seems to be a growing trend that people show up at crowded crags with NO IDEA how to behave. And then act all indignant when a concerned citizen steps in and tries to help them out. I'm a big guy, so that may have something to do with it, but the last time I yelled at a n00b belayer to "PUT THEIR GODDAM LEADER BACK ON BELAY" before he decked, they did exactly as told. More people need to do this in a manner that implies consequences if ignored...rant over.

Ted Wilsonwrote: Dude definitely needs to be checked for for the rock fall shit but North Face just put a quick draw chain up as part of their ad. I’m sure he saw this ad and thought well North Face did it so it must be legit.

Yeah, I do this all the time. Easier to make a tough clip rather that have an alpine draw flopping all over. Usually not with 3 draws but not a big deal. 

Maybe you're right Buck. I just kind of figure if he's been talked to a few times about how he's endangering himself and won't listen he's got a screw loose, and further discussion won't do any good. But maybe getting in his face is warranted and may save his life.

But endangering others, I have no problem with yelling at him or doing whatever it takes to eliminate that risk to me and mine.

Mark Pilatewrote: If this guy ultimately turns out to just be a run of the mill, self-absorbed and incompetent  dumbass I’d be surprised. 

Based on what I've witnessed myself and what I've heard, he isn't.