El Cap Climbing

It sounds like the YNP is slowly getting worked out, at least in terms of in-the-Valley camping.  Nothing has been mentioned regarding the vertical camping, for reasons that are intuitively obvious.

It seems like a plan could easily be worked out for those who want to exclusively do bigwall routes.  

Why can't there be an agreement to allow this type of camping? Provide a multiday, bigwall permit to climbers on which one is allowed to literally park the car, gear up and launch into a wall route?  Top out, descend and drive out.

I understand there are huge bureaucratic logistics to hash out right now for park officials, and climbing is probably not even on their radar.  But still, wall climbing seems to be a pretty easy "green light", at least in my tunnel vision mind.   

The issue with that (in my mind, please correct me if I'm wrong) is the possibility of accidents requiring rescue. There's no way to pull off a rescue that doesn't put YOSAR in a bad situation where their members are at risk for infection. If everything went well and you could figure out how to stagger teams on routes, maybe this could work, but I think the risk to YOSAR is too high. 

Jacob Bendicksen wrote: The issue with that (in my mind, please correct me if I'm wrong) is the possibility of accidents requiring rescue. There's no way to pull off a rescue that doesn't put YOSAR in a bad situation where their members are at risk for infection. If everything went well and you could figure out how to stagger teams on routes, maybe this could work, but I think the risk to YOSAR is too high. 

I don't see how the risk to YOSAR would be any greater--in terms of COVID-19 issues--when rescuing a climber on the Nose versus a hiker on the Mist Trail. Obviously there's a huge difference in terms of expense, exposure, complexity, etc. 

Pete.N wrote:

I don't see how the risk to YOSAR would be any greater--in terms of COVID-19 issues--when rescuing a climber on the Nose versus a hiker on the Mist Trail. Obviously there's a huge difference in terms of expense, exposure, complexity, etc. 

The risk regarding infection would be the same and the likelihood of a climbing callout immensely lower.

Maybe I'm reading this wrong but I think the OP is confused.  You do not need a permit to camp on a big wall so I would assume that as long as the park is open and you can get to the wall there is no reason you can't camp on a wall.  In my opinion as long as you're cool with your partner a big wall is about as socially distanced as you can get. Have fun

Mydans wrote: Maybe I'm reading this wrong but I think the OP is confused.  You do not need a permit to camp on a big wall so I would assume that as long as the park is open and you can get to the wall there is no reason you can't camp on a wall.  In my opinion as long as you're cool with your partner a big wall is about as socially distanced as you can get. Have fun

I think the issue here is that they're looking at overnight reservations and day-use reservations, possibly leaving big wall "camping" in a gray area or just unaccounted for.

The only thing I would be worried is getting a ticket if leaving a car at El Cap Meadow overnight since that’ll give away you don’t have a camping reservation.

Oh man, El Cap Fever is strong! (well, at least my older, softer version of going to the meadow and kickin it with friends, haha) ....I feel your pain, and I hope we can work with the NPS to sort this out....good news some folks hiked up and trundled the loose block at the Wild Stance, right below the top of the Nose, today, so El Cap is lighter, fitter, and gleamingly gorgeous as ever. Woot Woot!
Erik Sloan
Rockclimbingyosemite.com

One angle someone might suggest, if they are in communication with the park, is that day use climbing might lead more bigwallers to go for routes in a push, potentially having more epics and creating rescues, than just allowing folks to camp on the walls (maybe YCA could set up a bigwall climber permit system?).

Erik Sloan wrote:.good news some folks hiked up and trundled the loose block at the Wild Stance, right below the top of the Nose, today, so El Cap is lighter, fitter, and gleamingly gorgeous as ever. Woot Woot!
Erik Sloan
Rockclimbingyosemite.com

That's awesome!  That block was scary. Thanks to whoever did that.  

Mydans wrote: Maybe I'm reading this wrong but I think the OP is confused.  You do not need a permit to camp on a big wall so I would assume that as long as the park is open and you can get to the wall there is no reason you can't camp on a wall.  In my opinion as long as you're cool with your partner a big wall is about as socially distanced as you can get. Have fun

Yes I know you don't need a permit to climb El Cap so no confusion there. 

My question is best explained by Goran.  It is a huge gray area whether El Cap Climbing for multi day routes would be permitted.  

And if vertical camping is permitted, then would the same be true for Half Dome? Leaning Tower, WC etc...where you could conceivably camp on route?

Will the NPS be issuing wilderness permits?  (I would expect so because it should make social distancing easier.)  People w/ wilderness permits can park wherever and disappear for days to go camping, so if that's going on then you should be good to go for big walls.  They won't be able to tell your car from a backpacker's.

Careful what you wish for.  If they start issuing "bigwall permits" now, then they'll probably never stop.

JaredG wrote: 

Careful what you wish for.  If they start issuing "bigwall permits" now, then they'll probably never stop.

This is what I would worry about. It would be better to lose a summer season than to push for more climbing bureaucracy.   

^this

It seems like a return to the old policy of "you're allowed to sleep on a wall without a permit" is all that's necessary here --- I think that's what Jplotz is advocating for.

JaredG wrote:Careful what you wish for.  If they start issuing "bigwall permits" now, then they'll probably never stop.

Bingo!  

What I had gloomily imagined is that they would instate a 'no high-risk activities' policy during Covid, which would mean no climbing.

But then I saw that they're going to erect the cables, which makes me think they won't be looking to prohibit high-risk activities in the park. So that means either it's going to be back to normal for climbing, or some sort of permitting system as worried about above.

Honestly it's hard to imagine a big-wall permitting system that could be monitored or enforced. Easy to post a ranger and check for permits at the base of the cables, somewhat harder for El Cap, and much much harder for all of the big walls in the Valley. It'd be simple to spot some with binos once they're on the wall, but would be a hassle to track them down and cite them at the top.

Imagine topping out to find LEO there waiting at the lip! F that. Big wallers are going to be the new BASE jumpers, with intricate evasion and getaway plans from the summit.

Better to just keep quiet and miss a season of el cap.  

Permitting for big walls would be the absolute worse situation I can imagine...  

​update...

https://gripped.com/news/yosemite-to-implement-big-wall-climbing-permit-system-for-vehicles-parked-overnight/​​​

Well see if they ever lift any of these restrictions. My guess is they lift the number of vehicle entries into the park but maintain the permit system as well as raise the ($2) fee. The permit to park your car for big walls is never going away and will only be expanded upon. 

Yeah, not sure I believe this will happen:

McGahey stresses that once the COVID-19 restrictions are lifted parking permits for overnight climbs will no longer be required.