Professions for a Climbing Career

Pip Hokr wrote: I am graduating college this June and am currently planning on going to coding bootcamp in Denver (to move to CO). I have been climbing for awhile and want to focus as much time as I can on climbing, however I know I need to make money and have some kind of a career. I am good at logic and software engineering is a good profession as it will be intellectually engaging as well as high paying and (hopefully, I know it depends on the employer) normal 40-45hr weeks. I don't care about my career/improving or moving up the "ladder" I only care about becoming the best climber I can and living in a place where others find passions>career (why I want to move to Denver/Boulder/Golden area). While I LOVED studying exercise science in school (because it makes me a better athlete), I am choosing this path because it pays more and keeps me off my feet so I can perform on the wall.... my issue is that what I love doing doesn't make any money. I don't understand how people become slaves to their career... this sounds absurd I know but I want to stay true to what matters to me, and that is climbing. Is this insane? Any thoughts from software engineers/ other climbers? Is this a good idea/ bad idea/ alternatives? Originally I was thinking Physical Therapy but i don't want to stand on my feet all day (so I'm tired for climbing), work with elder people(a worthy profession but not my interests) and the pay is lower. Anyone have any thoughts on this?

Well, you might consider my tactic.

I was in computers in a Fortune 100 company in Colorado right out of school.  I worked normal hours and climbed every weekend and vacation I could.  I lived well within my budget and saved/invested a nice chunk of my salary every month.   I retired at age 45 and became a climbing/skiing dirtbag. (Not really, I have two houses, two vehicles, and live quite well.)

In reality, you've got two viable choices: 1) Work now, play later  2) Play now, work later.   Pick your poison.

P.S. And yes, paragraphs are nice.

John Byrnes wrote:

Well, you might consider my tactic.

I was in computers in a Fortune 100 company in Colorado right out of school.  I worked normal hours and climbed every weekend and vacation I could.  I lived well within my budget and saved/invested a nice chunk of my salary every month.   I retired at age 45 and became a climbing/skiing dirtbag. (Not really, I have two houses, two vehicles, and live quite well.)

In reality, you've got two viable choices: 1) Work now, play later  2) Play now, work later.   Pick your poison.

P.S. And yes, paragraphs are nice.

The millennial/genZ reply is can you hook me with a job bro?

John Byrnes wrote:

Well, you might consider my tactic.

I was in computers in a Fortune 100 company...I retired at age 45 .

Good advice, but getting out of the rat race as an employee in under 25 yrs is extremely rare.  Even the highest earners at the largest and highest paying companies are generally there until their 50's.  Saving and investing is very good advice, but the guys who seem to value it the most often also learned it from their parents, who are able to pass on to them a life altering chunk of money.  

My advice - after the usual jobs and investing advice everyone has - stick with one wife and family - one is expensive enough -- two or three and you will never retire.

Healthcare. Twelve hour shifts gives you four days a week off to play...

Pick the right healthcare field and your job could be as adrenaline pumping as climbing...

M Mobes wrote:

The millennial/genZ reply is can you hook me with a job bro?

Lol. So basically someone who was in a field during a period of unprecedented growth and retired at its peak (the dot.com bust) is giving career advise. I'm taking a wild guess that Fortune 100 company is HP. Let's see how it (which has been split into 2, though both have performed similarly) has done in the 20 years preceding and after y2k:

I'll leave it at that...

just graduating you could also sign up for any blue color municipal job. drive a garbage truck or bus. the benefits and pensions are insane. 20-25 years in some places and you get a full pension. no need to luck out at a tech company. by 45 you are fishing of your dock or crushing multi pitch in mexico. 

petzl logic wrote: just graduating you could also sign up for any blue color municipal job. drive a garbage truck or bus. the benefits and pensions are insane. 20-25 years in some places and you get a full pension. no need to luck out at a tech company. by 45 you are fishing of your dock or crushing multi pitch in mexico. 

Or just get psyched and crush whatever. Replay definitely doesn't work. Crush whatever you end up doing even if you weren't set up like everyone before you. Crushers fish off their dock and multi pitch all in the same work week, big babies stay at home with mommy and cry that things arent as good as they used to be.

Good question... this topic came up while I was riding home with a friend of mine who is a MD Doctor.... started off like this: “you know Guy we both blew it as far as the best profession to have and be a climber- I’m a slave to my practice and employees...” “I have finally figured out what would be best. Hi-Tension Line Work... those guys make $60/hr plus OT and every job is all OT AND they have a great union that understands your need for big time off... just tell them I need time off and you get it. When you’re ready to return just call the union and they will get you on a crew...”

I don’t know if this is totally true- maybe we have some linemen on MP.
But to the OP... anything where your not needed 24/7/365 works. 

Guy Keesee wrote: Good question... this topic came up while I was riding home with a friend of mine who is a MD Doctor.... started off like this: “you know Guy we both blew it as far as the best profession to have and be a climber- I’m a slave to my practice and employees...” “I have finally figured out what would be best. Hi-Tension Line Work... those guys make $60/hr plus OT and every job is all OT AND they have a great union that understands your need for big time off... just tell them I need time off and you get it. When you’re ready to return just call the union and they will get you on a crew...”

I don’t know if this is totally true- maybe we have some linemen on MP.
But to the OP... anything where your not needed 24/7/365 works. 

That’s funny, I avoid OT at all costs.

caughtinside wrote:

Most young people don’t have quite the long view like this. And that’s okay! You did a great job setting yourself up. But you only get to be in your 20s and 30s once. 

And you only get to be in your 40's and 50's once, too.    

But you're exactly right.  Most young people don't have a plan which is why they end up somewhere they didn't expect or want to be.

I think software sales is a very under looked job for work and passion balance. If you find a good gig and stay on top of your work you have 90 percent control over your whole schedule. Also, if I am going to work I want to be rewarded with money. That being said you want to get into a company that is not a transactional sale or you will be a slave to the desk. Plus you have to live somewhere with decent access.

It is very rare that I have something comes up on the calendar that I did not place on it. So for me, I can get out of work by 3 and be climbing shortly after. Or I can take the alternative and climb from 6 am and show up to work by 10 am. Weekend trips are prime since I can leave Thursday night and work remote on Friday where ever I am going.

Personally I would go climb for a year or 2. Do some seasonal work in locations you have always wanted to visit. Find out what drives you other than climbing. Then if you want you can start your career.   

Become a tower inspector/mapper or a telecommunication structural engineer. I've been a Structural Engineer in telecommunication engineering since 2004 and when I traveled all over the US inspecting and mapping towers I was able to climb literally everywhere. I got so many free trips to Vegas, Smith Rock, Bishop, Colorado, Wyoming, Alabama, etc... I can't even begin to tell you. Yes, it's a young mans game because living in and out of hotels sucks sometimes, but all expenses are free and depending on the company the money can be very good. Plus all of your airline travel points and rental car points are yours to keep and some companies like mine will even buy your points from you each money adding a nice little bonus that equates to what the cost of the flight would have been. Every single city I stayed in I would goto www.indoorclimbing.com (closed down now) find a local gym and train all the time. This career allowed me to move from Raleigh, NC to Denver, CO back in 2007 and now I run a Structural Engineering office in Westminster, CO for the telecommunication industry. The other great thing about it is that we are completely unaffected by recessions and Covid-19. The only time we've ever been slow is during mergers such as the current Sprint/T-Mobile merger has caused a lot of our work to get put in limbo until the merger goes through.

It can be tricky though. Without flaming my colleagues and/or competitors you could end up in a company that'll have you working 7 days per week for 5 weeks straight and then 2 weeks off, but other companies can have you back home every Friday. Luckily, I've never worked for any of those companies. I'm not trying to sell you on our company (we are actually hiring), and trying to make it sound better than it is because it's hard work climbing towers all day and being away from friends and family for days at a time. It's just an option because I know from 16 yrs of experience that before I started managing our office in Denver I loved traveling around climbing towers, because I got to see so many climbing areas I would have probably never visited. The biggest kick in the pants is you better believe this that you'll be climbing towers in the hottest, most humid climates in the Summer and the coldest, ice covered towers in the Winter. It's not always like that, but the first time you goto Michigan in the Winter and Louisiana in the Summer you'll forget about everything else. It can truly suck sometimes! Plus I've been on a 1,000-ft broadcast tower in Louisiana before when a lightning storm came up so fast I barely made it off the tower of that tower before I got popped several times as I just got down. They are grounded, and supposedly nothing will happen to you if the tower does get struck while you're on it, but I've never wanted to test that theory. Then there are the idiots that run broadcast stations that turn their broadcast antennas off when you leave the ground and then decide to turn them back on just as you are under a broadcast antenna which could cause permanent damage just because the network station started bitch'n at the shelter tech because all the old ladies are complaining that their soap's were shutoff for  a few hours.

Bill Schick wrote:

These things are true with most white collar professional jobs these days.  Unlimited vacation and remote days are pretty common.  The New Company theme is to go do whatever you need to do with your life, then come in with a clear mind and get your work done. 

"white collar professional jobs these days"  may be up for some revision shortly, especially in tech. The ripple effects of mass unemployment are coming for all categories of employment and downward economic mobility is a real threat to us all

"Unlimited vacation" sounds like it would lead to people talking more leave, but in some companies it's the opposite.

Makes some sense, since I'm not owed a specific amount, how much should I take, given I want to be (promoted | not_fired)? Probably not more than whatever the cultural norm is in the region.

Seems like one of those company perks that are almost entirely dependent on your boss's attitude.

Bill Schick wrote:

These things are true with most white collar professional jobs these days.  Unlimited vacation and remote days are pretty common.  The New Company theme is to go do whatever you need to do with your life, then come in with a clear mind and get your work done. 

I respectfully agree but to my point, it was more on who controls your time. In the last 2 companies, I have worked for it was always sales reps that had the most control over their time. No one is telling you when to work or how to work. You have a quota and as long as you hit that you can basically fly under the radar and never talk to management unless you want to. 

Remote work should have been acceptable 5 years ago. Sure a good chunk of companies have adopted this way of working but still, a surprising amount have held off. I think we can all say that recent events are going to force those late adopters to get on board. 

Unlimited PTO is a scam. If you ever stumble across this mirage do yourself a favor a negotiate a fixed amount. You can get away with some unreal numbers of days off.   

Philip Magistro wrote:

Bill, I'm 37.  I've been working seasonally for the last 6 years.  Prior to that I spent 5 years working for REI and taking full advantage of their 3-month unpaid leave policy....so not quite seasonal but definitely afforded me large blocks of time off.  Why do you ask?

Is 3-month unpaid leave standard at REI still? Is this REI corporate (Kent/Bellevue) or store personnel?

James Cho wrote:

Is 3-month unpaid leave standard at REI still? Is this REI corporate (Kent/Bellevue) or store personnel?

It was standard for retail staff.  I left REI in 2015, so I can't speak to what they offer now.  Outdoor retail is a very seasonal business.  Super busy in Nov/Dec, quiet until March, busy until Sept.  So it makes sense to offer staff unpaid time off as long as it falls within periods of low need.  My requests had to be approved...and there was no way I was gonna get the month of May (big sale) or August off.  But October or February, sure.

Clea Taylor wrote: Do construction or work on a farm. That way you’ll be strength training at work.

I heard that physical movement can be tiring and wear you out ;)