Anybody read "The Mountain Guide Manual"? I have a question..

It is about their proposed quick rappel turnover (2 climbers with two half-ropes) where the second attaches her rappel device to the back of two cloves that the leader used to attach himself to the anchor.

What’s your question?

Em Cos wrote: What’s your question?

there's no mention of throwing the ropes down, so my question is: do the authors imply that the ropes are "saddle bagged"?

There are many ways of getting a pair of rappel ropes down to the ground. Just as there are many ways of transitioning from climbing to rappelling. Pick the one that makes the most sense for the context. 

Matt Z wrote: There are many ways of getting a pair of rappel ropes down to the ground. Just as there are many ways of transitioning from climbing to rappelling. Pick the one that makes the most sense for the context. 

did you read the book?

In some of their transitions people actually stay tied in to one end while rappelling.

Make sure you bring an extra pair of socks

Niccolo Gallio wrote:

there's no mention of throwing the ropes down, so my question is: do the authors imply that the ropes are "saddle bagged"?

The second stays tied in. This closes the system and means only half the rope has to be tossed. You could saddle bag if you want. 

The leader then can use a tether, untie, and thread the ropes. This could happen as the second raps if you're okay rapping on a clove hitch without a closed system behind it. 

Adam Fleming wrote:

The second stays tied in. This closes the system and means only half the rope has to be tossed. You could saddle bag if you want. 

The leader then can use a tether, untie, and thread the ropes. This could happen as the second raps if you're okay rapping on a clove hitch without a closed system behind it. 

Thanks!

I see you use "rope" (singular), does this apply also to two half ropes?

Gumby King wrote: Make sure you bring an extra pair of socks

I think this is the only part of the book that I understood.

Niccolo Gallio wrote:

Thanks!

I see you use "rope" (singular), does this apply also to two half ropes?

This situation only applies when you have two ropes available.  Doesn't matter if they're half, twins, or a single and a tag line. I suppose you could toss and have the second rap on a single half rope, but I would personally rap on both to protect from cutting over a sharp edge and to provide more friction.  

There follower does not have to stay tied in once their weight is transfered to the rappel system - contextually, it may be more appropriate to untie and throw the ropes, or saddle bag them as necessary. 

ciao Niccolo....happy to chat further about the transition.....hit me with more questions/comments if you are still unclear---thanks man! RC

coppolillo wrote: ciao Niccolo....happy to chat further about the transition.....hit me with more questions/comments if you are still unclear---thanks man! RC

Thanks a lot Rob, I’ll do it as soon as I get back to the book at home. 

the best method for rappelling is to be  methodical. always have extra headlamps. Dont be afraid of the dark, don't rush things just because its getting late and you are thirsty.  Be methodical, constantly check your systems. be methodical, don't rush. If there is lighting to run away from be smooth and methodical which =fast. save time by being efficient and smooth, not by rushing. be methodical and stay alive.  Just ask Brad...  

Nick Goldsmith wrote: the best method for rappelling is to be  methodical. always have extra headlamps. Dont be afraid of the dark, don't rush things just because its getting late and you are thirsty.  Be methodical, constantly check your systems. be methodical, don't rush. If there is lighting to run away from be smooth and methodical which =fast. save time by being efficient and smooth, not by rushing. be methodical and stay alive.  Just ask Brad...  

thanks for the general pointers 

My question was very specific, though. Did you read the book in question? 

I’ve read the book, and I think Adam above answers your question very completely.

Terry E wrote: I’ve read the book, and I think Adam above answers your question very completely.

I have not read the book.  Still - I also agree.  :)

This shit almost never goes well. The kid in EPC and a few in the Rockies. No guide that I know of actually does this

Mike, you need a book, dude! I’ll send you one...PM me your address! 

coppolillo wrote: ciao Niccolo....happy to chat further about the transition.....hit me with more questions/comments if you are still unclear---thanks man! RC

My question regards the "Two people using a double-rope system setting up a rappel" paragraph in chapter 8: Transitions.

It is clear how this works: The leader arrives at the stance and clove hitches with both ropes to a large carabiner, the second sets up her rap device on the backside of the leader's cloves and raps off the two clove hitches while keeping the other two ropes' ends tied to herself. These two ends are the ones that would usually be thrown down the cliff so I wonder what is usually done with the two "bights" that are now available: 

Are they thrown down?

Are they saddle bagged on the second?

Are they kept piled on the ledge (or rappel/belay stance) from where the second is rappelling and dragged down while the second rappels? (I would tend to dismiss this option as the risk of the ropes tangling above the rappeller would seem a bad thing).

thanks!